tell me what you think about car sales - Page 3

wolf · 12-19-2003, 12:57 AM

I think the worst thing a car salesman (allright, person, although I have only once dealt with a female seller of vehicles, and she pretty much gave up and I was handled by the male sales manager, although she did put a very nice xmas bow on the rear view mirror of my first car) can do is be patronizing and make assumptions about their customer.

I had already decided that I was going to buy an Eagle Talon in '94. I had driven my best friend's on his recommendation, fell in love with the look and the handling. Went to his dealer, got his salesperson, and what turned out to be a great price. Of course, being a good shopper, I had to do some comparison shopping, so went to another dealer which shall remain nameless, but is Sport Chrysler of Norristown.

Doofus (very young salesman) should have had a clue when I sat down and explained that I wanted a 1994 Eagle Talon DL with the 21M options package.

Online searches of car information were not big in those days, and my specificity regarding the model and options package was unusual, to say the least.

On the way out to the lot to look for a vehicle to test drive, the young man said, "you want an automatic, right?"

I carefully stated "I won't drive an automatic."

He cheerily responded, "It's really easy. I can show you how!"

I should have walked out right then and there. But I had something better in mind.

I suggested he might want to put on his seatbelt. I believe in fair warnings. He did, but only because the seat belt alarm sounding distracts one during a test drive.

He was one of those chatty little bastards too. Didn't get the training advice of let the test drive sell the car.

I revved it up a little bit to "get the feel of things" and sprayed gravel leaving the parking lot ... ran the car down to 202 and had it wound up to about 80 by the time I hit the jughandle/light for the turnaround just past the Bridgeport exit.

He did stop talking.

It's not often you get the chance to make a salesman wet himself.

And no, he didn't get the sale. When it came time to "run the numbers" he was still $10/month over the payment calculation I already had in hand from the other dealer.

And when he tried to "make me a better deal" on a used Talon that he had on the lot, he couldn't find the keys, but had figured out that I knew "just a little bit" about motor vehicles, and popped the hood on the used car.

I had a chance to feel around on the inside of the hood, and found evidence of some major bodywork ... then did a walkaround of the car and saw that there were still scrapes that hadn't been tended to on the driver's side rear quarterpanel.

Doofus returns with the keys (brave lad) and says, "you ready?"

"nope. How bad was the accident?"

"Accident, what accident?"

"The one this car was in."

"I have no knowledge of this car ever having been in an accident."

"Oh, really? So what's this ... and this ... and this ... and see here?"

"oh ... ummmm .... I can see what I can do about getting you a better deal on that other one ..."

lumberjim · 12-19-2003, 01:22 AM

sigh

we're not ALL like that you know.

I have a core of 5 guys that are as far from that as you can get, but those transient types don't care what they tell you, because chances are that they won't be there when you come back with a problem.

ask your salesman how long he/she's been there. It matters.

xoxoxoBruce · 12-19-2003, 03:45 AM

Early Nov of '03 I wanted a PT Cruiser, GT, Electric Blue, Chrome wheels, etc, etc. Went on the Chrysler web site and picked everything out. Hit the button to see what dealers had what. Hit the button to solicit offers. Videon emailed they didn't have what I wanted but would order it. Brandywine had it and came back with a firm deal. Every other dealer emailed me bullshit that sounded like the quintessential "car dealer".
On the way to Brandywine I stopped at an unamed dealer near 202 and 1. They had one but with a lot less equipment. I asked the price and was told msrp because "nobodies got these". I told him Brandywine had one with more equiptment and gave him the quoted price. He said he needed to talk to the manager. Came back in 2 minutes and demanded my name, address and phone number. I said never mind I'll just go to Brandywine. He said "go ahead, if you want to deal with a discount dealer". I did.

lumberjim · 12-19-2003, 06:42 AM

yeah, we don't give discount prices unless you come inside for the dog and pony show. had you asked to see me, it would have gone differently.

So, did you get your cruiser?

wolf · 12-19-2003, 08:46 AM

Must have, because I believe he drove it to UT's Birthday party.

It's sweet.

wolf · 12-19-2003, 08:58 AM

Bruce's story reminded me of something else that ticks me off about many (not you) car salesmen ... badmouthing another dealer or another product line.

My last salesman was great, didn't pressure me, didn't hassle me, really did let the car do the selling, was very casual about things.

And, what I really liked ... He was working for a Lincoln-Mercury dealership, and he drove a CORVETTE. Always has, since he started making money anyway.

And he had some 'Vette doodads in his little sales cubical.

jinx · 12-19-2003, 01:31 PM

I waiting patiently for the inevitable "I drove that piece of shit thru the showroom window" story....

vsp · 12-19-2003, 02:04 PM

Heh. My Saturn's lease runs out in three months, and I'm debating whether I just want to finance the remaining balance or start over with a new car (whether bought or leased).

The more I think about it, I'm tempted to continue with the car I've got JUST to avoid the car-salesman shuffle...

russotto · 12-19-2003, 03:04 PM

When my mother bought a white Miata, she went to a dealership that had two substantially similar cars, one outside on the lot and one in showroom. After the test drive of the one on the lot, etc, she started to deal and the guy wouldn't budge, and to emphasize his point he threw a pencil at her!

Later she went to another dealership which didn't have the right car but which had a decent salesperson. He ended up getting a car for her dealer to dealer --- from pencil-throwing dealer #1. And it was the one which had been sitting in the showroom, not the one being test-driven all over the place. Ha!

(yes, that's the same white Miata a few people have seen me with. I've sold it since, for a little under 1/3rd of the original price; not bad for a car which was 9 years old when I sold it.)

xoxoxoBruce · 12-19-2003, 04:58 PM

The best experience of all the new cars I've bought, was a Pontiac way back in the winter of '66. You know, prehistoric. They had a wall in the dealership with a bulletin board about 4x12 feet than listed ALL the models and ALL the options including All the packages and prerequisites. The list prices were listed along side each.
Now this is when you could buy a Chevy pickup for $1700 or a Mustang for$2200 but I was only making $6k a year. Anyway, you could get a heavy duty cooling system for $20 or HD shocks for $9. There were lots of desirable options that most people didn't even know existed unless they were on a car on the lot. Most on the lot didn't have this stuff, to keep the prices as low as possible.
I spent 2 evenings making a wish list and rewriting it a hundred times until I knew exactly what I wanted to order. Hey, fun for the feeble minded.

wolf · 12-20-2003, 12:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by jinx
I waiting patiently for the inevitable "I drove that piece of shit thru the showroom window" story....

Nah ... I just play with people's heads, hoping they will by reflex remember not to do the bad thing ever again.

JeepNGeorge · 12-20-2003, 01:14 PM

All of these horror stories makes me glad I still live in a small town! Of course it probably helps that my father worked at the Ford Dealership as a bodyman for 30 years, so it's hard for the sales people to be rude to my family.

I helped my mom and my sister when they purchased their new vehicles recently and jokingly told the owner (which is a personal friend) if they had the buy two get one free offer going on. He just laughed and said no, but he would make me a helluva deal on one if I wanted, I said as soon as you get a jeep on the lot let me know. Not two weeks later he had two jeeps sitting on the lot and yes I got a call. Wanted me to come down and check them out if I was interested.

Too much money for me, but the price quoted was below book. I just decided to put the money into my older jeep and save the payments.

Hell even when I bought my 91 jeep it was a pleasurable deal. It was sitting on the dodge dealerships lot and was being sold as a favor for a friend of one of the mechanics. I only paid $4000 for it, but the salesman bent over backwards to help me anyway he could. He even called once a month for about the first year to make sure the vehicle was doing ok and to let me know he appreciated my business. I know just drumming up new business, but it still showed he cared.

I think I'll stick with the local boys for a while longer and leave the pencil throwing high pressure sales people to you nuts! :P

elSicomoro · 12-20-2003, 01:28 PM

I have not yet bought a car from a dealer...only from family or family friends. Well...there was my '80 Monte Carlo that I bought from a guy in the paper, but that was a good car and a good deal.

The last time I went to a dealer was in '97...was this close to buying a car from them, but fortunately the financing wouldn't go through. Good thing, b/c the car was horribly overpriced and I probably would have went in the poorhouse to pay for it.

The experience as a whole wasn't overly pleasant, and admittedly, I don't care much for car salesmen. I know I shouldn't be like that, but I have never had a good experience with one. When I do finally purchase a new/almost new car (which will probably be later this year or next year to replace Putt-putt...Rho will get my car), I just have to make sure that I am as knowledgeable as possible and ready "to do battle." I know not all salesmen are bad...they're just trying to make money like the rest of us. But I'll be damned if I'm going to be taken for a ride.

lumberjim · 12-20-2003, 01:46 PM

SYC,

you know you'll buy it here, and i'll bury you. its your destiny. resistance is futile. don't make me throw a pencil at you.

ps, i don't like most car salesmen either.

xoxoxoBruce · 12-20-2003, 03:07 PM

I found Consumer Reports to be a good bet. They can be kind of persnickety on the ratings but once you've decided what you want, for $15 or so they'll give you all the info on that car. The options and packages, the list and dealer cost with the current kickbacks and incentives. You can update the info as many times as you like for a month. I think most people would be surprised, the dealer isn't making as much as they think.

12-19-2003, 12:57 AM	#31
wolf lobber of scimitars Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Phila Burbs Posts: 20,774	I think the worst thing a car salesman (allright, person, although I have only once dealt with a female seller of vehicles, and she pretty much gave up and I was handled by the male sales manager, although she did put a very nice xmas bow on the rear view mirror of my first car) can do is be patronizing and make assumptions about their customer. I had already decided that I was going to buy an Eagle Talon in '94. I had driven my best friend's on his recommendation, fell in love with the look and the handling. Went to his dealer, got his salesperson, and what turned out to be a great price. Of course, being a good shopper, I had to do some comparison shopping, so went to another dealer which shall remain nameless, but is Sport Chrysler of Norristown. Doofus (very young salesman) should have had a clue when I sat down and explained that I wanted a 1994 Eagle Talon DL with the 21M options package. Online searches of car information were not big in those days, and my specificity regarding the model and options package was unusual, to say the least. On the way out to the lot to look for a vehicle to test drive, the young man said, "you want an automatic, right?" I carefully stated "I won't drive an automatic." He cheerily responded, "It's really easy. I can show you how!" I should have walked out right then and there. But I had something better in mind. I suggested he might want to put on his seatbelt. I believe in fair warnings. He did, but only because the seat belt alarm sounding distracts one during a test drive. He was one of those chatty little bastards too. Didn't get the training advice of let the test drive sell the car. I revved it up a little bit to "get the feel of things" and sprayed gravel leaving the parking lot ... ran the car down to 202 and had it wound up to about 80 by the time I hit the jughandle/light for the turnaround just past the Bridgeport exit. He did stop talking. It's not often you get the chance to make a salesman wet himself. And no, he didn't get the sale. When it came time to "run the numbers" he was still $10/month over the payment calculation I already had in hand from the other dealer. And when he tried to "make me a better deal" on a used Talon that he had on the lot, he couldn't find the keys, but had figured out that I knew "just a little bit" about motor vehicles, and popped the hood on the used car. I had a chance to feel around on the inside of the hood, and found evidence of some major bodywork ... then did a walkaround of the car and saw that there were still scrapes that hadn't been tended to on the driver's side rear quarterpanel. Doofus returns with the keys (brave lad) and says, "you ready?" "nope. How bad was the accident?" "Accident, what accident?" "The one this car was in." "I have no knowledge of this car ever having been in an accident." "Oh, really? So what's this ... and this ... and this ... and see here?" "oh ... ummmm .... I can see what I can do about getting you a better deal on that other one ..." __________________ wolf eht htiw og "Conspiracies are the norm, not the exception." --G. Edward Griffin The Creature from Jekyll Island High Priestess of the Church of the Whale Penis

12-19-2003, 01:22 AM	#32
lumberjim I can hear my ears Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 25,571	sigh we're not ALL like that you know. I have a core of 5 guys that are as far from that as you can get, but those transient types don't care what they tell you, because chances are that they won't be there when you come back with a problem. ask your salesman how long he/she's been there. It matters. __________________ This body holding me reminds me of my own mortality Embrace this moment, remember We are eternal, all this pain is an illusion ~MJKeenan

12-19-2003, 06:42 AM	#34
lumberjim I can hear my ears Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 25,571	yeah, we don't give discount prices unless you come inside for the dog and pony show. had you asked to see me, it would have gone differently. So, did you get your cruiser? __________________ This body holding me reminds me of my own mortality Embrace this moment, remember We are eternal, all this pain is an illusion ~MJKeenan Last edited by lumberjim; 12-19-2003 at 06:56 AM.

12-19-2003, 08:46 AM	#35
wolf lobber of scimitars Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Phila Burbs Posts: 20,774	Must have, because I believe he drove it to UT's Birthday party. It's sweet. __________________ wolf eht htiw og "Conspiracies are the norm, not the exception." --G. Edward Griffin The Creature from Jekyll Island High Priestess of the Church of the Whale Penis Last edited by wolf; 12-19-2003 at 08:54 AM.

12-19-2003, 08:58 AM	#36
wolf lobber of scimitars Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Phila Burbs Posts: 20,774	Bruce's story reminded me of something else that ticks me off about many (not you) car salesmen ... badmouthing another dealer or another product line. My last salesman was great, didn't pressure me, didn't hassle me, really did let the car do the selling, was very casual about things. And, what I really liked ... He was working for a Lincoln-Mercury dealership, and he drove a CORVETTE. Always has, since he started making money anyway. And he had some 'Vette doodads in his little sales cubical. __________________ wolf eht htiw og "Conspiracies are the norm, not the exception." --G. Edward Griffin The Creature from Jekyll Island High Priestess of the Church of the Whale Penis

12-19-2003, 03:45 AM	#33
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	Early Nov of '03 I wanted a PT Cruiser, GT, Electric Blue, Chrome wheels, etc, etc. Went on the Chrysler web site and picked everything out. Hit the button to see what dealers had what. Hit the button to solicit offers. Videon emailed they didn't have what I wanted but would order it. Brandywine had it and came back with a firm deal. Every other dealer emailed me bullshit that sounded like the quintessential "car dealer". On the way to Brandywine I stopped at an unamed dealer near 202 and 1. They had one but with a lot less equipment. I asked the price and was told msrp because "nobodies got these". I told him Brandywine had one with more equiptment and gave him the quoted price. He said he needed to talk to the manager. Came back in 2 minutes and demanded my name, address and phone number. I said never mind I'll just go to Brandywine. He said "go ahead, if you want to deal with a discount dealer". I did.

12-19-2003, 01:31 PM	#37
jinx Come on, cat. Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: general vicinity of Philadelphia area Posts: 7,013	I waiting patiently for the inevitable "I drove that piece of shit thru the showroom window" story.... __________________ Crying won't help you, praying won't do you no good.

12-19-2003, 02:04 PM	#38
vsp Syndrome of a Down Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: West Chester Posts: 1,367	Heh. My Saturn's lease runs out in three months, and I'm debating whether I just want to finance the remaining balance or start over with a new car (whether bought or leased). The more I think about it, I'm tempted to continue with the car I've got JUST to avoid the car-salesman shuffle...

12-19-2003, 03:04 PM	#39
russotto Professor Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 1,788	When my mother bought a white Miata, she went to a dealership that had two substantially similar cars, one outside on the lot and one in showroom. After the test drive of the one on the lot, etc, she started to deal and the guy wouldn't budge, and to emphasize his point he threw a pencil at her! Later she went to another dealership which didn't have the right car but which had a decent salesperson. He ended up getting a car for her dealer to dealer --- from pencil-throwing dealer #1. And it was the one which had been sitting in the showroom, not the one being test-driven all over the place. Ha! (yes, that's the same white Miata a few people have seen me with. I've sold it since, for a little under 1/3rd of the original price; not bad for a car which was 9 years old when I sold it.)

12-19-2003, 04:58 PM	#40
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	The best experience of all the new cars I've bought, was a Pontiac way back in the winter of '66. You know, prehistoric. They had a wall in the dealership with a bulletin board about 4x12 feet than listed ALL the models and ALL the options including All the packages and prerequisites. The list prices were listed along side each. Now this is when you could buy a Chevy pickup for $1700 or a Mustang for$2200 but I was only making $6k a year. Anyway, you could get a heavy duty cooling system for $20 or HD shocks for $9. There were lots of desirable options that most people didn't even know existed unless they were on a car on the lot. Most on the lot didn't have this stuff, to keep the prices as low as possible. I spent 2 evenings making a wish list and rewriting it a hundred times until I knew exactly what I wanted to order. Hey, fun for the feeble minded.

12-20-2003, 01:14 PM	#42
JeepNGeorge Hand-of-Kindness Extender Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Where am I? Posts: 139	All of these horror stories makes me glad I still live in a small town! Of course it probably helps that my father worked at the Ford Dealership as a bodyman for 30 years, so it's hard for the sales people to be rude to my family. I helped my mom and my sister when they purchased their new vehicles recently and jokingly told the owner (which is a personal friend) if they had the buy two get one free offer going on. He just laughed and said no, but he would make me a helluva deal on one if I wanted, I said as soon as you get a jeep on the lot let me know. Not two weeks later he had two jeeps sitting on the lot and yes I got a call. Wanted me to come down and check them out if I was interested. Too much money for me, but the price quoted was below book. I just decided to put the money into my older jeep and save the payments. Hell even when I bought my 91 jeep it was a pleasurable deal. It was sitting on the dodge dealerships lot and was being sold as a favor for a friend of one of the mechanics. I only paid $4000 for it, but the salesman bent over backwards to help me anyway he could. He even called once a month for about the first year to make sure the vehicle was doing ok and to let me know he appreciated my business. I know just drumming up new business, but it still showed he cared. I think I'll stick with the local boys for a while longer and leave the pencil throwing high pressure sales people to you nuts! :P

12-20-2003, 01:28 PM	#43
elSicomoro Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 12,486	I have not yet bought a car from a dealer...only from family or family friends. Well...there was my '80 Monte Carlo that I bought from a guy in the paper, but that was a good car and a good deal. The last time I went to a dealer was in '97...was this close to buying a car from them, but fortunately the financing wouldn't go through. Good thing, b/c the car was horribly overpriced and I probably would have went in the poorhouse to pay for it. The experience as a whole wasn't overly pleasant, and admittedly, I don't care much for car salesmen. I know I shouldn't be like that, but I have never had a good experience with one. When I do finally purchase a new/almost new car (which will probably be later this year or next year to replace Putt-putt...Rho will get my car), I just have to make sure that I am as knowledgeable as possible and ready "to do battle." I know not all salesmen are bad...they're just trying to make money like the rest of us. But I'll be damned if I'm going to be taken for a ride. Last edited by elSicomoro; 12-20-2003 at 01:30 PM.

12-20-2003, 01:46 PM	#44
lumberjim I can hear my ears Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 25,571	SYC, you know you'll buy it here, and i'll bury you. its your destiny. resistance is futile. don't make me throw a pencil at you. ps, i don't like most car salesmen either. __________________ This body holding me reminds me of my own mortality Embrace this moment, remember We are eternal, all this pain is an illusion ~MJKeenan

12-20-2003, 03:07 PM	#45
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	I found Consumer Reports to be a good bet. They can be kind of persnickety on the ratings but once you've decided what you want, for $15 or so they'll give you all the info on that car. The options and packages, the list and dealer cost with the current kickbacks and incentives. You can update the info as many times as you like for a month. I think most people would be surprised, the dealer isn't making as much as they think.

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