Ambassador Murdered

[DanaC]

Good pic, Pete. I saw those signs on the news coverage last night. Kind of gives one hope for basic humanity.

[Ibby]

I'm in no condition to cite sources at this hour, but as Bruce said in post #7, from what I heard on NPR and, i think, MSNBC (could be mistaken on that count), the actual invaders in Benghazi were backed by people who could only have been armed by either an international terrorist syndicate or an organized national paramilitary group - a group of the type not backed by the recent popular uprising's government but more likely by the former pro-Gaddafi paramilitary thug organizations, though to be fair their arms could easily have been reappropriated - and so it's patently absurd to try to blame the wider Muslim society in Libya for the rioting or embassy assault, and even more ridiculous to try to blame all Muslims internationally for the wider sociopolitical context that led to the attack, or for anything resembling support for the murders.

[Spexxvet]

Originally Posted by Ibby

..., the actual invaders in Benghazi were backed by people who could only have been armed by either an international terrorist syndicate or an organized national paramilitary group - a group of the type not backed by the recent popular uprising's government ...

It was Romney

Richard Engles:
At 10:25 p.m. ET Tuesday night -- after news of the attacks in Cairo and Benghazi
but before it was confirmed Stevens had been killed --
the Romney campaign released a statement in which Romney said,
Quote:
“I'm outraged by the attacks on American diplomatic missions
in Libya and Egypt and by the death of an American consulate worker in Benghazi.
It's disgraceful that the Obama Administration's first response was not to condemn
attacks on our diplomatic missions, but to sympathize with those who waged the attacks.”<snip>
But a few hours later...

Andrea Mitichell:
Quote:
But NBC’s Andrea Mitchell reported that the Cairo embassy
statement was issued six hours before the mob attacked the embassy.
She pressed Romney foreign policy advisor Ambassador Richard Williamson
to explain why Romney had criticized a statement made before the mob assault.

[Trilby]

I think I just got served by Ibby. What is she, 19 or something?

good post, Ibby. like I said, I was posting hastily. I was pissed off b/c this ambassador guy sounded like a real friend to those people. See? I was Romney-esque. talking before knowing all the facts.

[Undertoad]

And the response of Egyptian President Mohamed Mursi...

http://af.reuters.com/article/commod...8KCJ5X20120912

Egyptian President Mohamed Mursi asked the Egyptian embassy in Washington to take legal action in the United States against makers of a film attacking the Muslim Prophet Mohammad, the official state news agency said on Wednesday.

Mursi had requested the mission take "all legal measures", the MENA agency said, without giving further details on what that might involve.

Thanks Mursi that'll help

[Spexxvet]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

And the response of Egyptian President Mohamed Mursi...

http://af.reuters.com/article/commod...8KCJ5X20120912



Thanks Mursi that'll help

We may not agree, and he won't get anywhere doing it, but it's the civilized thing to do.

[Undertoad]

There are no laws in America that apply. Mursi is tacitly stating his support for *Egyptian* laws, says David Frum:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...-khomeini.html

More serious is the exploitation by Egypt's Muslim Brotherhood president of the incident as support for anti-Islam blasphemy laws. It's important to understand that Morsi is concerned with Egyptian, not American, laws. Morsi is taking a page from the 1979 Khomeini playbook, fabricating an international incident to mobilize religious passions as a weapon for his political grouping against more secular blocs in Egyptian society - the Egyptian military very much included.

[BrianR]

Another take

The gist is that this was a planned attack in hopes of provoking a violent response from the Marine guards there. Apparently, this is a fairly standard tactic in certain locations around the world, not just the Arab world.

In related news, the AP has published the identity of the person who made the film at the heart of this incident.

******************
Law enforcement has confirmed that the anti-Muslim movie blamed for attacks at US diplomatic buildings around the world was made by Los Angeles filmmaker Nakoula Basseley Nakoula.

The Associated Press reported early Thursday that Nakoula, 55, is responsible for the "Innocence of Muslims,” the film that was said to ridicule the prophet Muhammad and, in turn, prompt violent assaults on US land overseas, including missions in Egypt, Libya, Tunisia and the US Embassy in Yemen.
*****************

So, we now have allegations that both the pretext AND the result are both staged events. Hmmmmm.

Draw your own conclusions.

Pam

[DanaC]

Fed wonderfully well into his world view and confirmed him in his own hatred, thankyouverymuch :P

[footfootfoot]

I think the only reason Christian Fundamentalists aren't as deadly as Islamic Fundamentalists is because our legal system has checks in place against murder. If we had a Christian version of Sharia law there'd be a lot more Christian Soldiers marching Onward as to war...

With the cross of Jesus going on before.
Christ, the royal Master, leads against the foe;
Forward into battle see His banners go!

Let's take metaphor and make it literal!

[Sundae]

You didn't live through The Troubles.
Not fundies, but rabid as frothing dogs all the same.

There were riots in Belfast this month over the routes of marches (link to BBC website)
Who do the Orangemen march in support of? Good King Billy.
That's William of Orange. He died in 1702.

I'm not beating a dead horse about Islam, I really appreciate the later posts people have made. I'm just beating my usual dead donkey-shaped pinata about the violence I grew up with.

[Ibby]

Al-Qaeda released a video the morning of Sept. 11, urging Islamists to attack America to avenge the drone-strike killing of Abu Yahya al-Libi (lit. of Libya). Every piece of reporting that's coming out is confirming that the attack on the consulate was an armed militant organization with a complex assault plan. Rachel Maddow started her show tonight (and is still talking about the connections and evidence, including part of an al-Jazeera report that included interviews with witnesses to the attack who say there was no PROTEST before the attack - just an attack!) explaining the evidence that the attack had little or nothing to do with the video sparking protests in Cairo and Yemen and elsewhere. When the video goes up on the MSNBC website around midnight I'll try to post it - the first fifteen minutes alone are absolutely revelatory.

[Ibby]

I think I've managed to get a link to the relevant opening section of tonight's Rachel Maddow Show that highlights the Al-Qaeda/terrorist connections to Tuesday's attack on the Benghazi consulate. The highly-relevant story is only fifteen minutes or so, and well worth the watch, if you want to be highly informed to talk about the situation, I think.

Originally Posted by msnbc.com's autotext for email links to the story

Libya attack puts spotlight on Al Qaeda terror affiliates

Rachel Maddow describes the evidence that points to the attack on the U.S. Consulate in Benghazi, Libya as having been an organized terrorist attack, and shows how Al Qaeda affiliates and Al Qaeda-like terror groups have established themselves throughout Africa.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908...27233#49027233

[Ibby]

Originally Posted by Ibby

I think I've managed to get a link to the relevant opening section of tonight's Rachel Maddow Show that highlights the Al-Qaeda/terrorist connections to Tuesday's attack on the Benghazi consulate. The highly-relevant story is only fifteen minutes or so, and well worth the watch, if you want to be highly informed to talk about the situation, I think.

I think I might have a particular level of interest in this story, considering that my mother works for the State Department and my dad works, as a Department of Defense civilian, closely with State Department personell at our overseas State Department missions, and that I plan to work for the State Department as a Foreign Service Officer as soon as I have my bachelor's degree. I'm closely associated with and highly interested in the State Department, and therefore, our State Dep't officers and their well-being. So, I'm trying to be as up-to-date and informed on this situation as possible - and since the Cellar is one of the places I am the most engaged on politics and current events, I want to share with you what I learn about their operations, especially when it becomes part of important American news and policy.
This attack was NOT a rowdy torch-and-pitchfork mob of angry Libyan civilians overrunning our state department mission (consulate) in Benghazi. this was an organized and planned terrorist/militant attack on (percieved) American imperialism and diplomacy by a terror-affiliated paramilitary organization. the attack on our Yemeni embassy, detailed later in the show (after the first fifteen minutes), which resulted in the destruction of Embassy property, vehicles, and defenses, but NOT loss of American life, is what happens when mobs attack our facilities abroad. It's deplorable, but not at all the same as the attack on the Benghazi consulate. Rachel is right to question the very notion that the Benghazi attack had ANYTHING to do with the shitty-ass, pathetic fifteen-minute youtube video that cities across the Muslim world are protesting.

[tw]

Originally Posted by Ibby

This attack was NOT a rowdy torch-and-pitchfork mob of angry Libyan civilians overrunning our state department mission (consulate) in Benghazi. this was an organized and planned terrorist/militant attack on (perceived) American imperialism and diplomacy by a terror-affiliated paramilitary organization.

A Benghazi consulate attack was well coordinated and planned according to the NY Times. In particular was the second attack. Apparently the attackers had an inside informant. So they knew exactly when and where to attack the rescue convoy carrying American and Libyan personal.

Video from some hiding person may only be an excuse. A simultaneous and maybe unrelated event. The consulate attack occurred without any preceding demonstrations, according to interviews reported in the NY Times. The first attack was sudden and unexpected.