When Police Aren't Busy Protecting Citizens - Page 3

capnhowdy · 08-12-2006, 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flint

Care to elaborate on those ironic quotations? Or, do you prefer to let your punctuation do the talking for you?

Why not?
To some, the problem would be the protest. To me the problem is not having a protest sign strong enough to ward off rubber bullets.

MaggieL · 08-12-2006, 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayMcGee

I though this was current event?
the dateline on the news-story is Nov. 2003

No, it isn't.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dateline

MIAMI, Aug. 10, 2006

The story was generated by...

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Story

A newly surfaced videotape...

Reading is FUNdamental.

JayMcGee · 08-12-2006, 09:15 PM

so it was....

referred to an event in 2003, tho.....

*refrains from commenting on the timelessness of US media*

Griff · 08-13-2006, 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by capnhowdy

To me the problem is not having a protest sign strong enough to ward off rubber bullets.

One of my Profs brought in a couple "rubber" bullets to class after a trip to Northern Ireland. I'd say they cross the line into lethal. It is remarkable that more protestors have not been killed over the years.

MaggieL · 08-13-2006, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayMcGee

referred to an event in 2003, tho.....

The actual story was the tape and its contents. It's one thing to allege being abused by police. It's quite another, very newsworthy in itself, to have discovered evidence that proves it.

The media appears to have done their job in this case, even if they are Yanks. Your job is to RTFA if you're going to comment. :-)

richlevy · 08-13-2006, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Griff

One of my Profs brought in a couple "rubber" bullets to class after a trip to Northern Ireland. I'd say they cross the line into lethal. It is remarkable that more protestors have not been killed over the years.

If I remember correctly, the safe method is to 'skip' the bullets by firing low. From the video, it seems some cops were doing just that.

The woman was crouching, so it's not clear if the bullet that pierced the sign was skipped or not. If not, then the cop firing it was intending to inflict more damage. I am curious to know if someone is killed by police using rubber bullets, can the bullet be matched to a specific gun?

The worst part was that the crowd did not appear unruly and I did not hear any order to disperse. If there was such an order given and it was ignored then the police had the right to take some action. It seems to me, though, that moving directly to rubber bullets was dangerous and inappropriate.

I love how the officer in the session talks about how great it is to win one for a change. I think what he was saying was how much fun it was to fire into an unarmed and peaceful crowd and not have to worry about a counterstrike. If they had tried that stuff in Maimi, they would have gone into the 'loss' column.

xoxoxoBruce · 08-13-2006, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Griff

One of my Profs brought in a couple "rubber" bullets to class after a trip to Northern Ireland. I'd say they cross the line into lethal. It is remarkable that more protesters have not been killed over the years.

Many people hear or read rubber bullets and think Nerf, when they should be thinking Tires. The bullets are as hard as a damn tire, so range is critical.

I believe the "skipping" was developed to make them safe to use, when the protesters and cops, got up close and personal. Typically they're used on command rather than the individual cops discretion, and typically they don't like to make that call until the protesters are real close.

I seem to remember a woman being seriously hurt (maybe killed), by a rubber bullet, at a CA demonstration against this current war.

08-13-2006, 07:59 PM

Unless specifically threatened they don't need to be using them or gas.
Cops are out of hand nationwide and have forgotten for whom they work.

footfootfoot · 08-13-2006, 08:02 PM

I'm hoping Flint had his sarcasm hand up. Freedom? WTF is freedom is you are being denied your right to peaceably assemble and exercise your 1st ammendment rights. (such as they are)

Flint · 08-13-2006, 08:08 PM

If it isn't obvious that I was joking, then we, as a society, are completely fucked.

08-13-2006, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by footfootfoot

I'm hoping Flint had his sarcasm hand up. Freedom? WTF is freedom is you are being denied your right to peaceably assemble and exercise your 1st ammendment rights. (such as they are)

If denied, time to take them back... not having them at any time is never an option.

footfootfoot · 08-13-2006, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rkzenrage

If denied, time to take them back... not having them at any time is never an option.

Not an option, but it does feel like we're sliding in that direction. I remember a course I took in college on the first ammendment, the teacher spoke about "the chilling effect" that certain laws had on free speech. They didn't outright deny your rights, but they chilled the option of excercising them by subjecting you to possibly long, expensive, and career or reputation destroying legal battles. Or in this case, a rubber bullet to the head.

"yeah, you have a right to peaceably assemble, but we'll shoot you anyway, and good luck taking us to court. You'll spend a wad of cash and a month of sundays just to see the affair being handled "internally" maybe a slap on the wrist, and while your at it, expect to be pulled over for routine traffic stops at least three times a day."

It happens around here if you don't keep your nose clean and your mouth shut.

08-14-2006, 01:10 AM

“Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect every one who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are ruined.”
-- Patrick Henry, 3 Elliot, Debates at 45 (Virginia Convention, June 5, 1788).

“God forbid we should ever be 20 years without such a rebellion. The people cannot be all, & always, well informed... what country can preserve it's liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms... The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is it's natural manure.”
-- Thomas Jefferson to William S. Smith on Nov. 13, 1787. The Papers of Thomas Jefferson, ed. Julian P. Boyd, vol. 12, p. 356 (1955).

footfootfoot · 08-15-2006, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flint

If it isn't obvious that I was joking, then we, as a society, are completely fucked.

No it's not we as a society, I am just under a lot of pressure now (think Ferris Bueller, you could stick a lump of coal up my butt and you'd have a diamond in a week) and I am seemingly able only to see in a rather one dimensional way.

I'll be glad when this crazy project is completed.

Elspode · 08-15-2006, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by footfootfoot

Not an option, but it does feel like we're sliding in that direction.

Fortunately, it is all for own protection. We aren't able to decide for ourselves anymore, so thank goodness we have a big, strong President who is taking care of all of that for us.

More thorazine, please. What's on TV? Can I have a new videogame?

08-12-2006, 09:15 PM	#33
JayMcGee Cardigan-wearing man Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Much Binding In The Marsh Posts: 1,082	so it was.... referred to an event in 2003, tho..... refrains from commenting on the timelessness of US media __________________ I like wearing cardigans...... my current favourite is an orange cable-knit with real leatherette buttons.

08-13-2006, 08:02 PM	#39
footfootfoot To shreds, you say? Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: in the house and on the street-how many, many feet we meet! Posts: 18,449	I'm hoping Flint had his sarcasm hand up. Freedom? WTF is freedom is you are being denied your right to peaceably assemble and exercise your 1st ammendment rights. (such as they are) __________________ The internet is a hateful stew of vomit you can never take completely seriously. - Her Fobs

08-13-2006, 08:08 PM	#40
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	If it isn't obvious that I was joking, then we, as a society, are completely fucked. __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio**

08-13-2006, 07:59 PM	#38
rkzenrage Guest Posts: n/a	Unless specifically threatened they don't need to be using them or gas. Cops are out of hand nationwide and have forgotten for whom they work.

08-14-2006, 01:10 AM	#43
rkzenrage Guest Posts: n/a	“Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect every one who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are ruined.” -- Patrick Henry, 3 Elliot, Debates at 45 (Virginia Convention, June 5, 1788). “God forbid we should ever be 20 years without such a rebellion. The people cannot be all, & always, well informed... what country can preserve it's liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms... The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is it's natural manure.” -- Thomas Jefferson to William S. Smith on Nov. 13, 1787. The Papers of Thomas Jefferson, ed. Julian P. Boyd, vol. 12, p. 356 (1955).

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