Perverting science for politics

[spudcon]

I've just opened this thread for the first time today, on page 19. I'm not going to bother with the rest, as it appears to be a subsidiary of the NY Times. I won't bother with that again either. "All the news that's shit to print"

[Clodfobble]

Hell, there are tons of things I'm not going to do today--cut my hair, go to the movies, feed a dog--I just thought it would be polite to refrain from wasting your time telling you about them.

[lookout123]

shhh. he's our counterbalance to TW.


UG doesn't count since he has an orbit all his own.

[Troubleshooter]

Originally Posted by BigV

Why is Cheney allergic to science?

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5h...mn9AgD91PN4N00

Because he's a clogged-up douche nozzle?

Because he has a complete inability to see beyond his own, or his master's (whoever that may be) desires?

Because people thought they were getting a conservative for VP but got a sociopath instead?

Just a thought.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by Troubleshooter

Just a thought.

[richlevy]

From here

Bush pollution gaffe surprises G-8 leaders


RUSUTSU, Japan — President Bush has been known for unguarded comments at previous meetings of world leaders, but British newspapers reported Thursday that he surprised a number of them with a joke about environmental policy as he left the G-8 summit in Japan.
Bush, who has been criticized for being reluctant to join international efforts to combat global warming, reportedly ended a private meeting with the words: "Goodbye from the world's biggest polluter."
The Web sites of the British newspapers The Independent and the Telegraph both reported that he then punched the air while grinning.

Well, at least he was honest.

[classicman]

idgit

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by richlevy

From here



Well, at least he was honest.

He was just relishing in our position until China and India take over. Again, he had bad intell on his joke, since China has been a bigger polluter for greater than a year. Anyone see the pics of China's polluted air as they attempt to clean up for the Games?:
China takes over as largest CO2 emitter.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environmen...9/china.usnews

[glatt]

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

China has been a bigger polluter for greater than a year. Anyone see the pics of China's polluted air as they attempt to clean up for the Games?:
China takes over as largest CO2 emitter.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environmen...9/china.usnews

While this is true, it's misleading. China has a much larger population, so you would expect it to be polluting more.

On a per capita basis, the average American produces around 4 times as much CO2 as the average Chinese citizen. This is even mentioned in the article you linked.

[Troubleshooter]

We keep electing incrementally more retarded politicians, and it's only going to get worse.

Slowly...

Term by term...

We need to just get it over with.

We can do:



Or we can do:

[TheMercenary]

The fact remains that China and India far surpass the US in the amount they pollute in all areas including CO2 emissions. The world wants to point fingers at the US and get us to change the way we do business at great cost to our economy and give nations like China and India a pass while they pollute non-stop with minimal regulation because of an economic disparity. I call bull shit on that. We can reign in when they reign in. Make it a level playing field. It is not. Which is why we will never sign one-sided agreements like The Kyoto Protocol.

[glatt]

Originally Posted by TheMercenary

Make it a level playing field. It is not.

If we were to make it a level playing field, that would mean you would have to reduce your personal CO2 footprint by 3/4 to meet China's current per capita level.

Or do you reject the per capita measure, and think that all countries, regardless of their size, should have the same CO2 output? Luxembourg and the USA should have the same total level of emissions?

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by glatt

If we were to make it a level playing field, that would mean you would have to reduce your personal CO2 footprint by 3/4 to meet China's current per capita level.

Or do you reject the per capita measure, and think that all countries, regardless of their size, should have the same CO2 output? Luxembourg and the USA should have the same total level of emissions?

It will never be level on an average per person basis, nor should it. That is trying get apples and oranges to be the same fruit, they are not and never will be. China and India will never be like the US, and hopefully the US will never be like China or India. "per capita" measurements are nothing more than statistical measures which simplify the comparisons. They do not work. Fun to look at and use as points in an argument but they are not practical from the standpoint of parity between developing nations who pollute to no end and a developed nation like the US or many Western European nations which are highly technically industrialized. I completely reject anything which uses simple statistical measures such as "per capita".

[Undertoad]

We are the highest per capita because we are the most productive per capita. What you really want to measure is carbon use across productivity.

The worst solution would be to do less with less, what we really need is to do more with less.

[glatt]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

The worst solution would be to do less with less, what we really need is to do more with less.

I think the worst solution would be to do less with more.