The sound bite that would win the election - Page 2

Undertoad · 02-11-2004, 04:42 PM

But he wouldn't be able to pry open the budget of a Republican house to pass or expand programs for his own political benefit.

slang · 02-12-2004, 12:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kitsune
I just think the world is different now................ kinds of salaries and still survive.

Ok. Lets say you are elected President , what would you change regarding the export of jobs to India?

Is there any way to stop this? By doing so if we could, might we be creating even more problems by interfering with the job markets?

You certainly have a clearer understanding of the cause and effects to the overall economy than I do.

Kitsune · 02-12-2004, 09:22 AM

Lets say you are elected President , what would you change regarding the export of jobs to India?

I dunno, really. There isn't an easy answer to this, if one at all.

You certainly have a clearer understanding of the cause and effects to the overall economy than I do.

Not likely. I'm only basing my concern over this through what I see. That doesn't translate to anything in the larger economy.

warch · 02-12-2004, 10:32 AM

Dustin Hoffman was tipped that the future was plastics. I hear now the ticket is bioinformatics. ( I dont really know exactly what that is...)

slang · 02-12-2004, 12:49 PM

If I were the pres, I'd nuke every country not on the NAM continent. That'd solve a lot of the problems. *

* - Not really.

ladysycamore · 02-12-2004, 01:08 PM

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Conservative television news anchor Bill O'Reilly said on Tuesday he was now skeptical about the Bush administration and apologized to viewers for supporting prewar claims that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction.

Wait...does this mean hell indeed has frozen over???

Undertoad · 02-12-2004, 01:37 PM

Y'know, for a long time I just didn't watch O'Reilly at all, but I've watched about 10 shows now in the last month. My opinion is that he's not all that intelligent, but he's not a total blowhard like Limbaugh. He's full of himself like Limbaugh, but he's nicer, and he does take his guests' opinions seriously when they don't agree with him.

There's no real reason to watch, though, unless there's nothing else on (check) and you have no life (check).

Undertoad · 03-22-2004, 07:14 AM

Just following up on this post - yesterday night I saw an ad from a small issues group that used this sound bite.

The group's name was not the focus of the ad, wo I can't remember what it was, but it wasn't moveon.org. It was some labor organization.

It showed a Chinese factory (with big Chinese lettering on it to make sure you knew what it was) and emphasized Chinese jobs.

Unfortunately it was slightly xenophobic. Anti-trade ads are going to be xenophobic like the Willie Horton ads were racist - not really the focus of the problem, but it's the conclusion that a lot of voters will draw, and if you help them draw it, no foul will be called.

tw · 03-22-2004, 10:22 PM

A simple question. How many CS trained people can even do a Karnaugh map? A basic and essential tool for logic minimization. I even had a waiter who could do it. So how many highly paid programmers can do what this Green Card immigrant could do?

In the meantime, most programmer I knew had no CS training. Desperate for a job, they eventually fell into programming. Most programmers I knew were schooled as English majors, et al. Rarely did any programmer have a clue as to what the hardware even did. Should they be called high tech employees - or just unskilled labor?

Who here (simply those who already posted in this thread) can even say what a Karnaugh map is? A simple question limited only to those who already posted - just to see how technically trained we computer people really are.

Happy Monkey · 03-22-2004, 11:35 PM

I do, but since I don't do embedded or logic-intensive code, I'd have to brush up on the details.

It involves making a matrix of desired on/off values with a dimension for each input, and circling certain groups of ones or zeroes to find the smallest number of gates required for the given matrix. Or was that something else?

russotto · 03-23-2004, 01:14 PM

If Karnaugh maps had any sort of application to the kind of coding I do (and they don't), you might have some sort of point. But I certainly don't know what sort.

Undertoad · 03-23-2004, 01:36 PM

I believe they are an EE thing.

As usual, tw assumes that his and only his view of the world is important.

dar512 · 03-23-2004, 01:40 PM

If you're trying to equate Karnaugh map with well-trained CS, then I think you're off-base.

I have a mid-90s CS degree - systems programming track (Magna Cum Laude - pats self on back). I just did a quick check of Introduction to Algorithms by Cormen, Leiserson, and Rivest, as well as Algorithms in C by Sedgewick. Neither one mentions Karnaugh.

I think an understanding of NP Completeness, or knowledge of the backpack problem or some such would be a better differentiator.

But all that aside, I didn't get what you're trying to prove with this test.

Happy Monkey · 03-23-2004, 02:01 PM

They are indeed an EE thing. I used them in my one EE course during my CS major, and never saw them in any of my CS classes. These days, clarity in code is much more important than minimizing the number of ANDs.

02-12-2004, 01:08 PM	#21
ladysycamore "I may not always be perfect, but I'm always me." Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: In Sycamore's boxers Posts: 1,341	WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Conservative television news anchor Bill O'Reilly said on Tuesday he was now skeptical about the Bush administration and apologized to viewers for supporting prewar claims that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction. Wait...does this mean hell indeed has frozen over??? __________________ "Freedom is not given. It is our right at birth. But there are some moments when it must be taken." ~Tagline from the movie "Amistad"~ "The Akan concept of Sankofa: In order to move forward we first have to take a step back. In other words, before we can be prepared for the future, we must comprehend the past." From "We Did It, They Hid It"

03-22-2004, 11:35 PM	#25
Happy Monkey I think this line's mostly filler. Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: DC Posts: 13,575	I do, but since I don't do embedded or logic-intensive code, I'd have to brush up on the details. It involves making a matrix of desired on/off values with a dimension for each input, and circling certain groups of ones or zeroes to find the smallest number of gates required for the given matrix. Or was that something else? __________________ _________________ \|...............\| We live in the nick of times. \| Len 17, Wid 3 \| \|_______________\| [pics]

03-23-2004, 02:01 PM	#29
Happy Monkey I think this line's mostly filler. Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: DC Posts: 13,575	They are indeed an EE thing. I used them in my one EE course during my CS major, and never saw them in any of my CS classes. These days, clarity in code is much more important than minimizing the number of ANDs. __________________ _________________ \|...............\| We live in the nick of times. \| Len 17, Wid 3 \| \|_______________\| [pics]

02-11-2004, 04:42 PM	#16
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	But he wouldn't be able to pry open the budget of a Republican house to pass or expand programs for his own political benefit.

02-12-2004, 09:22 AM	#18
Kitsune still eats dirt Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Tampa, FL Posts: 3,031	Lets say you are elected President , what would you change regarding the export of jobs to India? I dunno, really. There isn't an easy answer to this, if one at all. You certainly have a clearer understanding of the cause and effects to the overall economy than I do. Not likely. I'm only basing my concern over this through what I see. That doesn't translate to anything in the larger economy.

02-12-2004, 10:32 AM	#19
warch lurkin old school Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Minnesota Posts: 2,796	Dustin Hoffman was tipped that the future was plastics. I hear now the ticket is bioinformatics. ( I dont really know exactly what that is...)

02-12-2004, 12:49 PM	#20
slang St Petersburg, Florida Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 3,423	If I were the pres, I'd nuke every country not on the NAM continent. That'd solve a lot of the problems. * * - Not really.

02-12-2004, 01:37 PM	#22
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	Y'know, for a long time I just didn't watch O'Reilly at all, but I've watched about 10 shows now in the last month. My opinion is that he's not all that intelligent, but he's not a total blowhard like Limbaugh. He's full of himself like Limbaugh, but he's nicer, and he does take his guests' opinions seriously when they don't agree with him. There's no real reason to watch, though, unless there's nothing else on (check) and you have no life (check).

03-22-2004, 07:14 AM	#23
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	Just following up on this post - yesterday night I saw an ad from a small issues group that used this sound bite. The group's name was not the focus of the ad, wo I can't remember what it was, but it wasn't moveon.org. It was some labor organization. It showed a Chinese factory (with big Chinese lettering on it to make sure you knew what it was) and emphasized Chinese jobs. Unfortunately it was slightly xenophobic. Anti-trade ads are going to be xenophobic like the Willie Horton ads were racist - not really the focus of the problem, but it's the conclusion that a lot of voters will draw, and if you help them draw it, no foul will be called.

03-22-2004, 10:22 PM	#24
tw Read? I only know how to write. Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 11,933	A simple question. How many CS trained people can even do a Karnaugh map? A basic and essential tool for logic minimization. I even had a waiter who could do it. So how many highly paid programmers can do what this Green Card immigrant could do? In the meantime, most programmer I knew had no CS training. Desperate for a job, they eventually fell into programming. Most programmers I knew were schooled as English majors, et al. Rarely did any programmer have a clue as to what the hardware even did. Should they be called high tech employees - or just unskilled labor? Who here (simply those who already posted in this thread) can even say what a Karnaugh map is? A simple question limited only to those who already posted - just to see how technically trained we computer people really are.

03-23-2004, 01:14 PM	#26
russotto Professor Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 1,788	If Karnaugh maps had any sort of application to the kind of coding I do (and they don't), you might have some sort of point. But I certainly don't know what sort.

03-23-2004, 01:36 PM	#27
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	I believe they are an EE thing. As usual, tw assumes that his and only his view of the world is important.

03-23-2004, 01:40 PM	#28
dar512 dar512 is now Pete Zicato Join Date: May 2003 Location: Chicago suburb Posts: 4,968	If you're trying to equate Karnaugh map with well-trained CS, then I think you're off-base. I have a mid-90s CS degree - systems programming track (Magna Cum Laude - pats self on back). I just did a quick check of Introduction to Algorithms by Cormen, Leiserson, and Rivest, as well as Algorithms in C by Sedgewick. Neither one mentions Karnaugh. I think an understanding of NP Completeness, or knowledge of the backpack problem or some such would be a better differentiator. But all that aside, I didn't get what you're trying to prove with this test.

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