Voters unhappy with Bush; Congress

[Urbane Guerrilla]

Griff got in ahead of me -- I went off to make the scene of the Deathly Hallows midnight-plus-one -- hey, as I type we just looked under the front doormat and there's our copy; UPS must not be ringing doorbells today to speed their operation, so there's in our house -- but yeah, Article I Section 8-11. Section 8 enumerates the Constitutional powers of Congress. It does NOT state that Congress has the sole power to call out the troops; indeed it doesn't seem to give it such power at all. Calling up the troops really seems much more directly related to the Commander In Chief anyway.

America has been in about a hundred and fifty shootin' conflicts, and if gunfire is quacks, well, they'll certainly do. Only five of these were Congressionally declared. Undeclared conflicts started almost immediately with an undeclared naval war with France -- the Quasi-War with France, 1797-1800, over treaty provisions that had come into what must have been regarded as very unfortunate conflict. After a couple of years, negotiation and claims adjustment, basically, settled things. Some of them -- a few claims continued unsettled into the twentieth century. I'm quite surprised to read here in the National Archives' Prologue Magazine that this ruckus led directly to the Louisiana Purchase as an integral part of trying to get matters settled.

[yesman065]

I guess they are on their own side, patiently waiting for the republicans to exit power so that they can implement all their own plans and agendas.

[Urbane Guerrilla]

And if they contrive to lose the war -- while trying their damnedest to blame it on the Iraqis -- it redounds to the Republicans' credit.

If they contrive to lose the war there is greater probability that we will have another major terrorist attack on U.S. soil. How about if it's a mushroom cloud over a port city? That too redounds to the Republicans' credit, in effect, by completely wiping out that of the Democrats.

[richlevy]

Originally Posted by Urbane Guerrilla

How about if it's a mushroom cloud over a port city?

So you're arguing that the 2 billion dollars a week we're spending on Iraq wouldn't be better spent on port security, especially since we have outsourced the real hunt for Al-Qaeda to the Pakistanis?

You really think in the unlikely event that they did acquire a real nuke, that it would be delivered from Iraq, and not Afghanistan, Pakistan, or Saudi Arabia?

You think that the terrorists are all concentrated in Iraq and are incapable or multi-tasking, especially since they probably favor a cell structure?

I'm guessing that your military career wasn't in intelligence. Or maybe, heaven help us, it was.

[Urbane Guerrilla]

For any interested parties, the Wiki:

33rd_Waffen_Grenadier_Division_of_the_SS_Charlemagne_(1st_French)

[DanaC]

What the French did under the Nazis has no bearing on the current situation in Iraq. Apart from anything else the cultural differences are vast enough to render any such comparison facile.

'evil people' galvanised to fight on one side and 'good people' galvanised to the other.....nothing like the crude simplifications of a Hollywood story to facillitate solutions in one of the most politically and socially complex areas of the globe.


As an interesting aside. Do you take much notice of the place names on the map? Nineveh and Nimrud, Baghdad and Babylon. These names, some of which are older than any of our written histories. Nineveh fell, and one of the ancient world's greatest empires with it, in 612 B.C. Next the Babylonians and the Medes, the Achaemenid Persians and the Macedonians, Romans.....and on across two thousand and more years. The culture of Iraq has some very deep roots.

[piercehawkeye45]

No Dana, Iraq is exactly like Texas, they will accept our western democracy with open arms.

I also have a question for UG. Which is worse, admitting you have lost or refusing to admit that you have lost?

[DanaC]

I'm guessing that your military career wasn't in intelligence. Or maybe, heaven help us, it was.

Oh dear God what a frightening thought.

FYI...
Recent Congressional Votes -
Senate: Higher Education Amendments of 2007
Senate: Department of Homeland Security Appropriations Act, 2008
Senate: Improving America's Security Act of 2007
House: Departments of Transportation, and Housing and Urban Development and Related Agencies Appropriations, FY 2008
House: Departments of Commerce and Justice, and Science, and Related Agencies Appropriations for FY 2008
House: Farm, Nutrition, and Bioenergy Act
House: Improving America's Security Act of 2007

Upcoming Congressional Bills -
Senate: Honest Leadership and Open Government Act
House: 2008 Agriculture, Rural Development, Food and Drug Administration, and Related Agencies Appropriations Act
House: 2008 Defense Appropriations Act

Please write your people and let them know you care.

Upcoming Votes

Honest Leadership and Open Government Act - H.R.2316

The Senate is scheduled to work on this ethics bill.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2008 Agriculture, Rural Development, Food and Drug Administration, and Related Agencies Appropriations Act - H.R.3161

This $90.7 billion bill would fund the Department of Agriculture, FDA, Commodity Futures Trading Commission and Farm Credit Administration for the upcoming fiscal year.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2008 Defense Appropriations Act - H.R.____

This $459.6 billion bill would fund the Department of Defense for the upcoming fiscal year.

If you want to know how, PM me or I can post it.

[yesman065]

Presidential Approval Ratings

Congressional Approval Ratings

Get all the current polling info

[deadbeater]

Congress approval ratings will get lower because they swallowed--yet again--concerning warrantless wiretapping. Fitting they passed the law during the dead of might.

[Urbane Guerrilla]

Signals intelligence, to be exact, Rich. Sure, we -- the West, DanaC -- suffered defeat upon defeat in the Eighties, eh? Heh heh.

I'm arguing that the place to spend a couple billion a week is over in their backyards -- which has worked for four years and more now. The best defense is not the defense you're calling for, Rich, but a good offense, and what we've got now is far better than a defense.

No one, repeat no one, critical of our offense has a better offense. Such people are jackasses, braying. The Jackass Party is only now, four to six years behind time, growing any sense of national responsibility. This is not yet being paired with foreign-policy competence.

No, the nuke wouldn't be delivered by Iraq. Pakistan would be my pick. Iran second -- more motivation, less current capability. And I wouldn't assign a high likelihood to either one, as they'd have too much to lose in return. You can imagine what we'd do if the Rose of Sauron were to bloom over one of our cities.

[yesman065]

Bush: there will be no pullout from Iraq while I'm president

Making it clear he will resist congressional pressure next month for an early withdrawal, he signalled that US troops, whom he hailed as the "greatest force for human liberation the world has ever known", will be in Iraq as long as he is president. He also said the consequences of leaving "without getting the job done would be devastating", and "the enemy would follow us home".

Gen Petraeus is expected to say that the surge has produced military successes but that there has only been limited progress on the political front.

Freedom's Watch, a conservative group, yesterday launched a $15m (£7.5m) advertising campaign in 20 states saying: "It's no time to quit. It's no time for politics."

Mr Bush's former White House spokesman, Ari Fleischer, who works for the group, said: "We want to get the message to both Democrats and Republicans: don't cut and run, fully fund the troops, and victory is the only objective."

The White House has been emboldened by a Gallup poll published yesterday showing approval ratings for the Democratic-led Congress had dropped to 18%, the lowest since the survey of the public views of the legislature began in 1974, and an earlier Gallup poll showing support for the surge had jumped in a month from 22% to 31%.

Two of the most influential senators on military affairs, the Democratic chairman of the armed services committee, Carl Levin, an advocate of an early withdrawal, and John Warner, a veteran Republican who recently broke ranks with Mr Bush over the war, issued a statement this week lauding the surge's "tangible results".

[xoxoxoBruce]

The fact remains we can't win this war. Only the Iraqis can win or lose their country, to the radicals that want it.
Recent events indicate the man in the street is disillusioned with the type of regime the radicals will install and severely enforce. But all they are doing is switching support for different foreigners... us. They have to get their shit together, and not stand by, while any foreigners control their country, including us.