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#226 |
I think this line's mostly filler.
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: DC
Posts: 13,575
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When people try to justify Bush by pointing to actions of previous administrations, it usually turns out to be some combination of less common, less serious, and/or severely regretted after the fact.
A disturbing trend that seems to be boosted by this tendency is the apologia for historical tragedies like McCarthyism and Japanese internment.
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_________________ |...............| We live in the nick of times. | Len 17, Wid 3 | |_______________| [pics] |
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#227 | ||
Goon Squad Leader
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Seattle
Posts: 27,063
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I re-read this thread (fascinating!) and didn't see an entry for this latest bit of business > conservation + law. Apparently, Dick Cheney is guilty too.
Quote:
This story highlights the same Julie MacDonald malfeasance we've recently discussed. Further reading led me to this article: Quote:
Look, I'm no anarchist. Yay capitalism. But I value our country's welfare above the welfare of a given business, or even a given business sector. I don't see that from him. In the spirit of this thread, in this example, the move he puts on the poor saps from Team USA is the ol razzle dazzle, fake to the center--blocked by the Endangered Species Act, spin to the outside directly into the defense of the scientific community's inpenetrable block, (pay attention, here's the tricky trick part) HEY! Look! It's some other scientists! and while everybody looks in the other (mis)direction, he passes to the 19th ranked official at the Interior Department for the easy tip in. Score: farmers and ranchers: 2, fish: -77,000, respect for the law: shut out!, science: taken away on a stretcher and out for the rest of the season. The other side of the stadium goes wild! At halftime, they all stampede down to the gift shop to show their appreciation and allegiance. I don't think it's too much to ask that our elected government officials respect the laws of our nation. Do you?
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Be Just and Fear Not. |
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#228 |
I think this line's mostly filler.
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: DC
Posts: 13,575
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The White House performs some minor edits on a CDC climate report.
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_________________ |...............| We live in the nick of times. | Len 17, Wid 3 | |_______________| [pics] |
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#229 | |
Read? I only know how to write.
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 11,933
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Quote:
Normally it would just be a mistake. But when criminal activity - that would make Nixon proud - is so routine, then why not have FEMA fake a press conference. Anything from the George Jr adminstration is a lie until otherwise proven from honest (independent) sources. White House lawyers are still better scientists? Yes, when the president talks to god. No, that is not even a joke. Only this president is told what to do by god - and admits it. |
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#230 |
The future is unwritten
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 71,105
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Fish don't vote.... or donate.
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The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump. |
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#231 | |
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 27,717
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Is anyone surprised at this shit anymore?
Bush ignores a unanimous recommendation by the scientific advisory panel at the EPA, which is also supported by the American Lung Association, and the National Association of Clean Air Agencies to reduce ozone levels in the air to 60 parts per billion. Instead he embraces the requests of industry lobbyists and sets the level at 75 parts per billion. What's the difference between 60 and 75? Well the article doesn't say, but the difference between 70 and 75 is 2,100 extra dead each year. That's right, Bush is killing well over 2,100 Americans a year so he can side with the lobbyists. Quote:
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#232 | ||
UNDER CONDITIONAL MITIGATION
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 20,012
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Quote:
Quote:
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#233 |
Read? I only know how to write.
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 11,933
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Apathy? Hardly. Cheney's agenda is to 'fix' us. Same 'apathy' that seven years ago declared arsenic in drinking water as acceptable - when the universal scientific consensus was otherwise. Nothing has changed. Cheney is still imposing that same political agenda. His agenda is to save America even by making the presidency a dictatorship. The agenda - not the presidency - has long been Cheney's objective. Same agenda also wanted any excuse for war with Iran; even in this past year.
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#234 | |
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 27,717
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Quote:
So you have 60 on one end, and 80 on the other, and he went with 75, which was well above the upper limit his science advisers gave him. His own agency says it will result in thousands more deaths each year than the other choice. I guess he doesn't value that figure either. |
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#235 |
barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy.
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 23,401
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JUST ASKING - What is the cost differential between say 65 or 70 and 75? Are any of these reasonable limits? Are they reachable, enforceable? Would the mean a loss of jobs or industry.... whatever? Would we have to completely retool and refurbish factories & whatnot?
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"like strapping a pillow on a bull in a china shop" Bullitt |
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#236 |
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 27,717
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I imagine that's the tune the lobbyists were singing. The article doesn't discuss that, so I don't know the costs.
Do some research and let us know. Make sure to include the health care costs of the dying people. |
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#237 | |
Radical Centrist
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Cottage of Prussia
Posts: 31,423
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http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...031202362.html
Quote:
Even northern New Hampshire has a number of 70. I bet 60 is a dream. It looks like it has never been reached, anywhere; the dotted line is the previous "limit" of 84. Looks like there is a lot of play around that word "limit". It doesn't appear to mean what we think it does anyway. I remember the shitty air we had in Philly summers in the late 80s. It is definitely better now. ![]() Via: http://www.epa.gov/airtrends/ozone.html |
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#238 | |
Radical Centrist
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Cottage of Prussia
Posts: 31,423
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California set its limit at 70 three years ago
Heritage Foundation (yeah I know) takes the opposite side. Interesting point, for some time, conditions that are actually too clean have been implicated in asthma: Quote:
They also note that ground-level ozone has the same protective effect against UV radiation as upper-level, so reducing ground-level ozone will increase skin cancer rates. Interesting. |
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#239 |
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 27,717
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Damn, UT. Thanks for looking all that up. I saw the article you linked to this morning, but didn't have a chance to read it.
So according to the EPA, either this rule change will easily pay for itself with lower health care costs, or it won't at all. |
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#240 |
Only looks like a disaster tourist
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: above 7,000 feet
Posts: 7,208
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The real question is, what are each of you doing to reduce ozone levels?
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