What does being a "Liberal" mean? (US)

[glatt]

DC started taxing the plastic bags. It's basically a commuter tax. It has worked. When I go into the shops around here to pick up one or two items, I just hold them or put them in my pockets now.

[Undertoad]

I believed, at that time (although I never would have admitted to it in these terms, but the concept is unavoidable), that a legitimate use of the government would be to impose ideas on some people "for their own good" simply because the rest of us were so convinced that we had all the answers.

I don't believe that anymore.

I'm still a believer...

Originally Posted by Wegman's

Myth: Paper bags are a better environmental choice than plastic bags.
Fact: Paper takes more water and energy to produce than plastic and since paper is heaver, the environmental impact is greater to truck paper bags from the manufacturing facility to a warehouse and then to a store. Whatever your choice, paper or plastic, be sure to reuse or recycle them or use a reusable bag.

Believe on, you hippies. It will make you FEEL like you've done something, which is important to you.

Your choice of bag has less impact than the fuel used to start your car to go to the market, and plastic bags are just as easy to recycle as paper, and it takes a ton more manufacturing to make "reusable" bags, and to wash them properly requires hot water and detergent. So the question remains which is actually better... but whatever!

This is like the TSA, where the important thing is for people to FEEL safe, not for people to BE safe. You need to FEEL like you've done something, even if you haven't.

Now this is subtle: while Portland was burning calories telling people which bag to use, how many more meaningful, more important questions were left hanging?

[HungLikeJesus]

Originally Posted by glatt

DC started taxing the plastic bags. It's basically a commuter tax. It has worked. When I go into the shops around here to pick up one or two items, I just hold them or put them in my pockets now.

Is that a loaf of bread in your pocket...?

[Spexxvet]

Originally Posted by classicman

Great, so now we use paper bags and kill more trees. Deforestation here we come!

Cotton: It's what's for dinner, or something...

[glatt]

Originally Posted by HungLikeJesus

Is that a loaf of bread in your pocket...?

No, actually. But it sure is nice to see you.

[Undertoad]

Originally Posted by glatt

DC started taxing the plastic bags. It's basically a commuter tax. It has worked. When I go into the shops around here to pick up one or two items, I just hold them or put them in my pockets now.

Witness unintended consequences: no bag means more trips, means more energy used.

[glatt]

Thing about plastic bags is that some people don't recycle or throw them away properly. They end up on the ground, and then get washed into the gutter and down the storm drain and into the local river, where they get tangled up on the shore and look like crap and also might kill some wildlife. If that happens with a paper bag, when it rains, it just gets all mushy and disintegrates in a few weeks.

[HungLikeJesus]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

Witness unintended consequences: no bag means more trips, means more energy used.

You need more pockets.

[glatt]

For me, it makes no real difference. I'm always on foot when I'm shopping in DC, so I'm only ever buying an item or two. A greeting card, or a book, or a toner cartridge, etc. I would always just take the bag because it was too much effort to talk to the clerk and tell them I didn't want one, and I really didn't care either way. But now that each bag costs 10 cents, or something like that, they always ask, and I always say no.

[Pico and ME]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

Witness unintended consequences: no bag means more trips, means more energy used.

Aldis charges for their bags and I have noticed that a lot of shoppers there are starting to bring their own. If other stores did the same because of a tax, that would end up being the intended consequence.

[Lamplighter]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

Believe on, you hippies. It will make you FEEL like you've done something, which is important to you.

<snip>

Now this is subtle: while Portland was burning calories telling people which bag to use,
how many more meaningful, more important questions were left hanging?

Such as ? Let us know and we'll get right them.
.
.
.

[Happy Monkey]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

Your choice of bag has less impact than the fuel used to start your car to go to the market, and plastic bags are just as easy to recycle as paper, and it takes a ton more manufacturing to make "reusable" bags, and to wash them properly requires hot water and detergent.

Wash them properly?

Watchoo talkin bout Willis? I only wash them if something spills, and even then I just toss them in the next load I'm doing anyway.

As for the disposable bags, when I run low on them I pay the 5 cents to DC, and use plastic ones as garbage can liners, and paper ones ('cause they stand up on their own) to store and transport my recycling.

[Happy Monkey]

Originally Posted by glatt

But now that each bag costs 10 cents, or something like that, they always ask, and I always say no.

5 cents tax, plus some stores (even beforehand) would give a 5 cent rebate for bringing a bag. So bringing a bag can save you 10 cents.

Not using a bag at all only saves you the five, though.

[Undertoad]

Originally Posted by Happy Monkey

Wash them properly?

Watchoo talkin bout Willis? I only wash them if something spills, and even then I just toss them in the next load I'm doing anyway.

Your bag is now contaminated with everything that can contaminate fruits and vegetables, which is more than we suspect. So, if you would wash that cantaloupe this afternoon, wash your bag more often, would be my advice.

[classicman]

Deforestation will always continue, but there are things you can do to help the environment.
Always remember the three "R"s:
Reduce the amount of plastic and waste products you have to use.
Reuse things like water bottles, foam trays, and plastic shopping bags as much as you can.
Recycle bottles, cans, newspaper, cardboard and other recyclables.

70% of Earth’s land animals and plants live in forests, and many cannot survive the deforestation that destroys their homes.

Forest soil is generally moist, but can quickly dry out without the protection of a forest canopy.This can also majorly effect the animals living in that particular climate.

Fewer forests means larger amounts of greenhouse gases entering the atmosphere.