baltimore

[henry quirk]

If a man burns down his own home out of anger at another, this is crazy.

If a group of folks burn down their neighborhood (its businesses) out of anger at the cops, this is crazy.

That's my point...thanks for straying from it...thanks for makin' your distaste for me known (again).

The distaste goes both ways, I assure you.

#

"in fact if "your" pharmacy was burning and the fire could be put out with your own water you would say you had no interest in the situation and it is not your business and they should manage their own affairs"

Mebbe...but then I wouldn't have started the fire in the first place, so...

Then, again: if that pharmacy was the only one available to me, if I depended on that pharmacy for medicine, I might very well be on the bucket brigade...it's called self interest.

[Happy Monkey]

Originally Posted by henry quirk

If a group of folks burn down their neighborhood (its businesses) out of anger at the cops, this is crazy.

Who started the fires, and how those specific people relate to the "they" whose neighborhood it is? Do you know more than has been reported?

The protest drew people from all over the city, not to mention the country. It drew people who supported the cause, and it drew people who just like to riot at protests. We know nothing about the perpetrators.

Essentially, you lied to your nephew.

[Undertoad]

Originally Posted by henry quirk

That's my point...thanks for straying from it...thanks for makin' your distaste for me known (again).

The distaste goes both ways, I assure you.

I assure you it doesn't. Respectful disagreement is what I founded this place for. Mature people discuss issues without considering it personal. I will point out flaws in your argument without finding you unworthy, and I will field flaws in my own argument without feeling diminished.

"in fact if "your" pharmacy was burning and the fire could be put out with your own water you would say you had no interest in the situation and it is not your business and they should manage their own affairs"

Mebbe...

No "mebbe" about it, if this question had come up in any other thread, you'd be demanding that you have no involvement. I'm not being accusatory here, this is your basic philosophy.

but then I wouldn't have started the fire in the first place, so...

Either they are LITERALLY BURNING THEIR OWN PHARMACIES, or you have constructed a shitty analogy that doesn't even jive with your own basic philosophy. I'm going with B.

And it's a straw man. You have created an analogy that makes no sense: why would someone burn down their own house? It's not their house. It's not their pharmacy. It's not their grocery. I know you agree, it's your basic philosophy. So if you still don't understand, that's entirely on you. You wrote the analogy that you don't understand! Why don't you describe the terms more realistically and see if you understand that?

[Happy Monkey]

Technically, the construction site where granny might eventually have gone for bingo. AND, apparently, might eventually have lived.

The project, planned as roughly 60 senior-citizen apartments and a community center, has been in the works since at least 2006. It is being built by The Woda Group, a low-income housing developer.

[gvidas]

Originally Posted by Happy Monkey

Technically, the construction site where granny might eventually have gone for bingo. AND, apparently, might eventually have lived.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...0-2442fe94f7ff

Fire not related to looting, official says

Julie Zauzmer · April 27, 9:27 PM

The three-alarm fire raging several miles away from protests that have turned violent in Baltimore is not related to the unrest, fire department spokesman Samuel Johnson said.

Johnson said that the fire, which was first reported at 8:49 p.m., appeared to be related to nearby construction. He did not know what started the fire.

The building was unoccupied when it caught fire, he said.

Johnson said that 94 firefighters were on the scene as of about 9:25 p.m.

[DanaC]

Rioting is an expression of anger with no outlet - and it is not directed inwards at all. Those who see this in terms of inwardly directed destruction, such as burning down one's own house, or destroying one's own community, presuppose a sense of community which includes shops and businesses. For many people, and I would imagine this is particularly acute for young people, their sense of community is much narrower.

[Gravdigr]

Not just Baltimore, but:

[DanaC]

Ha!

That is a good point.

People - even reasonable, law-abiding, gentle people, can be very different in a crowd. It shifts the dynamic.

I've been involved in several major demonstrations, mainly when I was much younger. Several of them turned nasty (the big Poll Tax demo in London in 1990, for example - and the anti-racism demo after the first BNP councillor was elected to a seat on the Isle of Dogs).

The poll tax demo turned into a full on riot, with around a quarter of a million marchers and full on riot police, with shields and batons, mounted police and police dogs. It was mayhem. It was terrifying - and was exhilirating.

The sense of righteous anger and collective response was powerful. It is a very strange feeling - being involved in a riot. It's like you become part of some larger organism. Really weird.

[Lamplighter]

"...It was terrifying - and was exhilirating..."

Great expression ! Next time you need to invite all of us too.

[Lamplighter]

Only rarely do I pay attention to the NY Times' "Quotation of the Day"
But I hope they are usually better than this one...

QUOTATION OF THE DAY
"There was a lot of economic damage. But the greater damage is to the future.
How many retailers will want to come to Baltimore?
How many conventions will stay away? How many hotel rooms will stay empty?"

ANIRBAN BASU, a Baltimore economist, on the arson, looting and riots that erupted
after the funeral of Freddie Gray, a black man who died in police custody.

This guy just doesn't get it... it's not about the $



,

[DanaC]

Originally Posted by Lamplighter

"...It was terrifying - and was exhilirating..."

Great expression ! Next time you need to invite all of us too.

Ha! I leave such hi-jinks to the childer.

The idea of being in that situation now scares me. I am left somewhat shaking my head in bemusement at my younger self . I remember me and J running along the outer edge of the poll tax demo, trying to get to the front where the demo met the police. Saw several people coming the other way, back from what had turned into a frontline battle, with headwounds - some lay on the grass verge being tended to by first aiders.

We kept running along the sides, pushing past to get to the action. What the fuck was going on in my head?

It's all very different when you're 18 and immortal.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Here's a list of some of the other 89 people the cops killed this MONTH.
I'm sure some must have been justified.

Update: This list says 101 for April.

[Undertoad]

perfect time to visit the National Aquarium will be over the next few months. I haven't been in about 5 years or so. Wow normally it's impossible to get mid-day tickets. I bet you could get them today.

[henry quirk]

Dana,

“presuppose a sense of community which includes shops and businesses”

Doesn’t take a sense of community to understand (before you set the fire) that burning out a business you rely on is not in your best interest…what it takes is a little ‘thinking’ and a lot less ‘feeling’.


“collective response”

I see this any time a gaggle of kids get together…the high spirits of one infect the others and before long you got a ‘pack’.

I expect adults (young and old) to resist such impulses…my expectations are, I suppose, unrealistic.

#

Happy Monkey,

“Essentially, you lied to your nephew.”

I answered his question honestly, in a way he can understand, using the information available at the time.

I may be mistaken in my assessments but I didn’t lie.

#

Lamp,

“Should that be interpreted that it is OK to settle grievances against law enforcement, so long as only the jails, the police stations, cop cars, or local cop's personal houses... are torched ?”

You can interpret as you like…what I say is: if you have a beef, take it up with the one who has insulted or damaged you, not with innocent folks and certainly not by doing self-injury (and, mebbe, if you aren't party to the insult or injury you ought to just butt the fuck out).


“This guy just doesn't get it... it's not about the $”

I disagree…but: even if you’re right ‘today’ he will most certainly be right ‘tomorrow’.

#

Toad,

“your basic philosophy”

What is my ‘basic philosophy’?


“I assure you it doesn't.”

I disagree, but: as you like.

[tw]

Nobody can honestly say we did not see this coming. A Cambridge professor is harassed by a cop because the professor was trying to get into his house. We have seen this both nationally and I have watched local municipal meetings where residents were complaining about same - in an upscale residential community for one.