Obama: "I'm ready to negotiate with you, Iran." Iran: "Fuck you."

[sugarpop]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

I think it can be won if they(we) don't make the mistake of thinking it's a conventional war, (which doesn't exist anymore)and use counter-insurgency tactics Petraus proved effective way back in the beginning of the Iraq war, then used later to break the stalemate nationwide. The key is not to try to lock down the country with military might, but win the support of the locals by providing security in exchange for their cooperation. Unlike Iraq, the locals already know what it's like to live under Taliban control.

Michael Yon.

McCain and Lieberman.

Great. Now we are the world's security force. *heavy sigh*

I think Pakistan is more of a problem, actually.

[classicman]

I saw the interview last night. Sharp guy, very guarded comments and he sees no out other than to put a lot more troops on the ground lie 10 to 15 times what we have there now. There is no way thats gonna happen. There is no real win.

[Undertoad]

Obama:

Invoking art, history and “the common humanity that binds us,” President Obama offered a “new day” in America’s relationship with Iran, using a videotaped message released on the Internet to make an unusual appeal directly to Iranians for a shift away from decades of confrontation.

Iran: FUCK

But in the first government reaction to the video, Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's press adviser said "minor changes will not end the differences" between Tehran and Washington.

"Obama has talked of change but has taken no practical measures to address America's past mistakes in Iran. If Mr. Obama takes concrete actions and makes fundamental changes in U.S. foreign policy toward other nations including Iran, the Iranian government and people will not turn their back on him," Ali Akbar Javanfekr told the Iranian state-run English-language Press TV satellite station.

YOU

In an almost simultaneous announcement, from Iran's energy minister, Parviz Fattah, said that the country would "finish and operate" its controversial Russian-built Bushehr nuclear plant by the end of the year.

"Iran has chosen a direction for achieving peaceful nuclear energy. We have mainly reached this aim," he said at the World Water Forum in Istanbul.

"Exactly 20 days from now we will have another celebration for celebrating the achievements we have gained for peaceful nuclear energy. You will hear about the news," he said.

"Iran will finish and operate the Bushehr nuclear plant by the end of this year."

[piercehawkeye45]

Eh...lets see what happens after the Iranian elections. Hopefully Ahmadinejad will bust.

History suggests that Afghanistan is a near impossible place for outside invaders/occupiers to "win."

But I do like the Obama approach of a "civilian surge" to "boost its political and economic development" in addition to more troops.

The State Department hopes to dispatch 51 civilians to Afghanistan while other government agencies also plan to send people there to boost its political and economic development, department spokesman Robert Wood said.....

....under the soon-to-be-complete review on Afghan policy hundreds of civilians will be sent to the central Asian country, and that Obama will announce the move next week.
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp...Y3HzleN7SSy9LA

With the Brits agreeing to join in that approach as well

British officials have played a central role in helping President Obama's National Security Council devise the plan, designed to win the allegiance of local Afghan leaders by showing that Nato countries are committed to rebuilding the country.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...ghanistan.html

there might be hope for some level of success.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by Redux

History suggests that Afghanistan is a near impossible place for outside invaders/occupiers to "win."

I think you could safely remove the word "near" from that statement.
That's why I think we have to empower the locals to win out over the Taliban.

But I do like the Obama approach of a "civilian surge" to "boost its political and economic development" in addition to more troops.

I agree the "civilian surge" is necessary, but it won't do squat if the locals are not safe in their villages.

[classicman]

So Obama wants to basically use Patreus' idea and call it the Obama plan? Isn't that special.

Originally Posted by classicman

So Obama wants to basically use Patreus' idea and call it the Obama plan? Isn't that special.

I dont know anyone calling it the Obama plan other than you.

Obama campaigned on putting more troops in Afghanistan (I didnt agree with just more troops) and refocusing efforts against those who potentially pose the greatest threath to the US that are in the Afghan-Pakistan border regions...as opposed to six years of diverting resources from that front to engage in the "central front on the war on terrorism" in Iraq, which posed no direct threat to the US.

The idea of a "civilian surge" to accompany more troops deployed in a more targeted manner was developed jointly by the US in consultation with NATO allies.

So whats your beef? Stealing the terminology of "surge" from Petreaus?

In case you forgot, both Petreaus and Gates are now on the Obama team.

[classicman]

[quote=Redux;547900]I dont know anyone calling it the Obama plan other than you. /QUOTE]

Since I read this as a petty demeaning reply, I will respond to it.
Try Googling it and see what you get. From MSNBC, ABC, CBS, Fox, Reuters, Bloomberg .... there are hundreds of relevant hits.

Originally Posted by classicman

Since I read this as a petty demeaning reply, I will respond to it.
Try Googling it and see what you get. From MSNBC, ABC, CBS, Fox, Reuters, Bloomberg .... there are hundreds of relevant hits.

I stand corrected...the media is calling it Obama's plan in their story lines.

Obama is calling it a plan developed in consultation with his defense and national security team and NATO allies.

I honestly just didnt see the point of what I read as your cynical post of how "special" it was that Obama was basically using Petreaus' idea, particularly when most defense and national security experts and advisors said the Iraq type surge would not work in Afghanistan.

If I was wrong to interpret your post as being cynical about how 'special it was...using Petreaus' idea", perhaps you can expand on it.

[classicman]

Originally Posted by Redux

I stand corrected...the media is calling it Obama's plan in their story lines.

Obama is calling it a plan developed in consultation with his defense and national security team and NATO allies.

I honestly just didnt see the point of your post of how "special" it was that Obama was basically using Petreaus's idea.

cough/bullshit/cough - whatever dude.

[classicman]

lol.

[Undertoad]

Iran Supreme Leader mullah Ayatollah Ali Khamenei: "In case my underlings weren't totally clear yesterday, fuck you."

"He (Obama) insulted the Islamic Republic of Iran from the first day. If you are right that change has come, where is that change? What is the sign of that change? Make it clear for us what has changed."

[xoxoxoBruce]

Originally Posted by Undertoad

Iran Supreme Leader mullah Ayatollah Ali Khamenei: "In case my underlings weren't totally clear yesterday, fuck you."

Doesn't make any difference, we could kiss their ass and give them the world, but without the US as the enemy they can't justify cracking down on their people. Israel alone is not a big enough boogieman without the US.

Ok...so i guess you wont expand on your post.

The fact remains that most defense and national security advisors, including Petreaus, said the Iraq type surge would not work in Afghanistan.

If you think its "special" and "using Petreaus idea"....hey, that your interpretation.

I think such an interpretation is "cough/bullshit/cough"