Scouts get pwned

[BigV]

What you can do to encourage the Boy Scouts of America to end their policy of discrimination:

Originally Posted by suggestions from Todd Bieber's video

Join your local Boy Scout Council
Contact your local Boy Scouts of America Council
Sign a petition
Share the video posted above
Some recommended websites:
ScoutsForEquality.com
Change.org
Scouting.org

[Lamplighter]

Originally Posted by BigV

What you can do to encourage the Boy Scouts of America to end their policy of discrimination:

Well, somebody was able to do it...


USA Today

The Boy Scouts of America will accept openly gay youths starting on New Year's Day,
a historic change that has prompted the BSA to ponder a host of potential complications
— ranging from policies on tentmates and showers to whether Scouts can march in gay pride parades.
<snip>
"My hope is there will be the same effect this Jan. 1 as the Y2K scare," said Brad Haddock,
a BSA national executive board member who chairs the policy implementation committee.
"It's business as usual, nothing happens and we move forward."

Some churches are dropping their sponsorship of Scout units because of the new policy
and some families are switching to a new conservative alternative called Trail Life USA.
But massive defections haven't materialized and most major sponsors,
including the Roman Catholic and Mormon churches, are maintaining ties.
<snip>

GOOD ON THEM ... the BSA and the 2 churches !!!

[glatt]

The question pissed me off too. It's the only one I remember. They may have said "make" instead of "force" but the meaning was the same. Assign an unwilling scout to sleep with the gay one.

I'm not sure how sleeping arrangements should be made though. As they get older, it matters more. Hopefully the boys are all mature about it and just work it out.

[Clodfobble]

There will always be bad troops. One of my college boyfriends detailed to me how he was actively discriminated against and harassed by both the scouts and the adult leaders in his first troop, because he was ("openly") Jewish. As in, the nicest boy in the group would say things like, "I feel so bad for you, that you're going to burn in hell," while the mean ones would refuse to sit near him and call him disgusting because he wasn't "washed clean" by Jesus. The adults who overheard would shrug at him like, "What can you do? They're right after all..."

I'm sure the issue of who had to share a tent with him would have come up, if he'd stayed long enough to experience a camping trip with them. Instead, he quickly left the troop and joined a better one. And that's really all it takes, is for good people to leave the discriminatory troops and join (or form, if necessary) better ones.

[BigV]

I've been thinking about the phrasing of that hypothetical situation. I'd like to extend and modify my answer.

I *can* imagine a situation where sleeping arrangements could be "assigned". Assuming there are no volunteers to buddy-up with teh gay scout; assuming there had to be a match, I can imagine having to make an executive decision to make such an assignment.

Then I think, "so what?".

It comes down to the idea glatt presented, getting a scout to do something they're unwilling to do. It isn't about "making a straight scout to sleep with a gay scout". oooOOOOOoooo scandalous. That's what that kind of baiting hypothetical is supposed to engender. To getcha all riled up. But, pfffft. I have to get scouts and other scout aged youngsters to do stuff they're unwilling to do all the time. That's part of being a grown up around children. It's possible to do everything using "because I'm the Dad, that's why!" method but fuck that sounds exhausting just saying it here. There are lots of other tools in the kit, aren't there? Lots.

The question's a trick. It's a fig leaf, a smoke screen to obscure the vision of the old bigoted homophobes in positions of authority so they don't have to acknowledge the reality that their attitudes will die with them. More and more younger people, scouts and adults, are becoming less and less apoplectic about homosexuality. This dumb, unmeasurable, unenforceable (insert giant eyeroll here) policy is just a thumb sucking security blanket for ignorant micromanagers. Let them have it, let them choke on it. It won't last.

---

Y'know, the BSA is a private organization. Let them control who they want to associate with and who they want to exclude. I'm fine with that. But, of course, I don't want my support to go to outfits that don't reflect my values. MOSTLY, the BSA does reflect my values, this stupid psychic contortion to avoid catching the gay is the most prominent exception. That's ok. DADT, fine, I have no intention of lifting a fucking pinkie to support, much less enforce this idiocy.

[glatt]

You didn't include the part about openly gay adult leaders still being banned.

Which is amusing to me, that the idea of a gay scoutmaster sleeping a couple tents away from innocent Tommy is scarier than the idea of little Tommy actually sharing a tent alone with gay 17 year old Bobby.

[Lamplighter]

You didn't include the part about openly gay adult leaders still being banned....

Slow down, Grasshopper.

For 20 years I've been despising the BSA for it's anti-gay policies.
I need to give them at least 24 hours celebration for this decision.

Next year...

[Clodfobble]

It makes sense to me--not the "gay scoutmasters are dangerous" bit, just the "gay scoutmasters are scarier than gay scouts" hierarchy. An adult is going to be much more experienced in interpersonal relationships, and may be quite skilled at grooming their victim, including pretending to be straight in order to label any questionable contact "okay" in the mind of the victim.

On the other hand, think about how terrified most straight teen boys are to flirt with girls their age. Gay teen boys are just as terrified, plus more so, because they know the object of their affections might get extremely angry if they are not also gay. They're not just risking rejection from their crush, they're risking rejection from the entire social group for making an unfair pass at a straight friend.

Now, if little Tommy and little Bobby are gay, then yeah, you'd best make sure they stay in different tents, because otherwise there's going to be some hot action going on in those woods...

[Sundae]

Aha! I've just worked out what JBKlyde's problem with homosexuality is.
He can't work out which partner is supposed to be loved and which one respected, because presumably they can both smash eachother in the face.

When they're not doing their nails that is.

[Clodfobble]

Originally Posted by glatt

At the national level, they make these rules, but as you get down to the individual level, you don't have uniform agreement with those rules, and in my experience, people sometimes look the other way when it comes to some of the more ridiculous ones.

That's been our experience too. There's even a troop near us that has a girl in it, because as she quite rightfully points out, "Girl scouts are dumb and I want to be a boy scout."

[Lamplighter]

Boy Scouts president calls for end to ban on gay troop leaders (+video)
Christian Science Monitor Cristina Maza - May 21, 2015

The move could be a step toward ending a policy against gay leaders that has increasingly divided the Boy Scouts.

The days of the Boy Scouts long-standing ban on gay troop leaders may be numbered.

Boy Scouts of America president, Robert Gates, called for an end to the controversial ban
while addressing the organization's annual meeting.
The move could be a step toward ending a policy that has divided members
of one of the largest youth organizations in the country, advocates say.

In 2013 the organization revoked its ban on the membership of gay youth.
Nevertheless, openly gay adults are still prohibited from serving in the organization.

The 2014 selection of Mr. Gates, who as United States secretary of Defense
helped end the "don't ask, don't tell" policy that barred openly gay individuals
from serving in the military, was seen by some as an opportunity to revisit the debate
over the organization’s policy.
<snip>

Isn't there some irony in this announcement being delivered by former Sec of Defense,
Robert Gates, who did almost everything he could to avoid/delay the end of DADT in the military.

Maybe he has changed his mind ... ya think ?

[Lamplighter]

So, today may yet be another day...

Boy Scouts Are Poised to End Ban on Gay Leaders
NY Times - ERIK ECKHOLMJULY 26, 2015

The Boy Scouts of America is expected on Monday to end its blanket ban on gay leaders
— a turning point for an organization that has been in turmoil over the issue.
But some scouting groups will still be able to limit leadership jobs to heterosexuals.

But...

To gain the acquiescence of conservative religious groups that sponsor many packs and troops,
like the Mormon and Roman Catholic Churches, the policy will allow church-run units to pick leaders
who agree with their moral precepts.

Here in Oregon, and I suspect elsewhere too, these exclusion policies of the BSA
resulted all local Scouting groups to be excluded from the United Way fund-raising network.

I had hoped that if the Scouts formally changed their ways, they would get back into United Way.
But this hanging on to "exceptions" may still be reason enough to keep them out.

Simply put, these religious groups need to get over their bad selves and
come out of the dark ages when it comes to public organizations like the BSA.

[xoxoxoBruce]

How do packs/troops choose leaders? Eons ago in small town New England, the Den Mother/Scoutmaster job was left to any sucker person who would take it.

[glatt]

In practice, that's my experience too. However, on paper, the charter organization approves all leadership. So theoretically, the church running the troop could require the leader to be straight. All the packs/troops I've been involved in have basically just rubber stamped what the troop parents came up with.

[Happy Monkey]

That's still the case, for the most part, as far as I know.