War-Losing Faction - Page 3

Griff · 02-05-2007, 08:58 AM

Unfortunately, our foreign policy is run by folks with the same view of history.

Prof. Andrew J. Bacevich of Boston University describes their mindset this way:
This convenient amnesia allowed the ISG to overlook a record of bipartisan bungling and shortsightedness extending over a period of decades. Franklin D. Roosevelt got the ball rolling in 1945, promising protection to the House of Saud in exchange for preferred access to Saudi oil. Dwight D. Eisenhower made his own distinctive contribution, engineering a coup in Tehran and forging a fateful partnership with the Shah. John F. Kennedy chipped in with another CIA-assisted coup, this one bringing the Ba’ath Party to power in Baghdad. Lyndon Johnson and Richard Nixon affirmed the Iranian connection and added another, establishing a costly “special relationship” with Israel. When revolutionaries tossed the Shah out on his ear, Jimmy Carter upped the ante: under the terms of the Carter Doctrine, the United States vowed henceforth to use any means necessary to secure its interests in the Gulf.

Spexxvet · 02-05-2007, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urbane Guerrilla

But seriously, folks: we had far too much of this during Vietnam, and in the end it paved the way for Communist victory and a free hand for their oppressions and abuses, did it not? Not exactly a triumph of the human spirit, here; more a victory for stupidity and weakness -- and for totalitarianism....

Quote:

Originally Posted by Griff

...[i]This convenient amnesia allowed the ISG to overlook a record of bipartisan bungling and shortsightedness extending over a period of decades. Franklin D. Roosevelt got the ball rolling in 1945, promising protection to the House of Saud in exchange for preferred access to Saudi oil. Dwight D. Eisenhower made his own distinctive contribution, engineering a coup in Tehran and forging a fateful partnership with the Shah. John F. Kennedy chipped in with another CIA-assisted coup, this one bringing the Ba’ath Party to power in Baghdad. ...

Wait a minute. The Saudis, the Shah, Saddam, the Contras - they're all oppressive and abusiv..... oh, I get it!

Happy Monkey · 02-05-2007, 02:42 PM

I think you may have stubbed your sarcasm detector.

02-05-2007, 02:57 PM

Hard to tell with text... now that I know, it is very funny. Thanks.

Flint · 02-05-2007, 03:06 PM

Fuckin' hamburgers.

02-05-2007, 03:08 PM

Why is there no ham?

Flint · 02-05-2007, 03:09 PM

No...ham... ??? Good question. "ham" burger ... Oh... from Hamburg.

Happy Monkey · 02-05-2007, 03:10 PM

Exactly. They're made out of Germans.

Flint · 02-05-2007, 03:13 PM

Don't you find it a little strange that Uder disappears, and now they're feeding us this mysterious food, "Uder-braten" ???

glatt · 02-05-2007, 03:15 PM

Well, that's what happened with Frank. The next day the menu had Frank-furters.

Flint · 02-05-2007, 03:16 PM

I don't even wanna know what happened the day before they served us fish tacos.

glatt · 02-05-2007, 03:19 PM

Is Abe Vigoda dead?

Edit: Just checked. He's still alive. What do you mean? "Fish" tacos?

Urbane Guerrilla · 02-05-2007, 10:38 PM

Quote:

I didn't know we were at that stage of the relationship yet

Came as a surprise to me, too! :p Well, if either of us ejaculates mustard, we can use it on the hamburgers...

Dude, I live within pistol shot of Port Hueneme's City Beach. I've got all the ocean front I can stomach! Look again, though, at what we tried there -- at bottom, I can't see anything but a humanitarian impulse, especially with the understanding that international communism is not humanitarian by any definition, even Pravda's.

Your points are well taken; my point is that North Vietnam's winning did guarantee about the worst of all possible government. Pol Pot's government being an example of one that was slightly worse.

Yes, Nixon behaved stupidly -- and the thing about H2Ogate was the seeming routineness of it all. It had the flavor of something that had gone on for a very long time, among almost everyone in the political process, but kept behind the scenes.

For an exhaustive list of Democratic failures, that's going to take some time and offline composition to get it all down. Stay tuned -- but it makes rather dreary reading.

cowhead · 02-06-2007, 07:25 AM

well.. that's why america is the 'great experiment'.. this is an evolving process... damn shame that the thing has been co-opted by the jocks and jarheads.

Urbane Guerrilla · 02-06-2007, 04:28 PM

Perhaps if you're neither, you should really try beating them at their own game, or playing your game better than they play theirs?

There comes a point when bitching is jejune.

02-05-2007, 08:58 AM	#1
Griff still says videotape Join Date: Feb 2001 Posts: 26,813	Unfortunately, our foreign policy is run by folks with the same view of history. Prof. Andrew J. Bacevich of Boston University describes their mindset this way: This convenient amnesia allowed the ISG to overlook a record of bipartisan bungling and shortsightedness extending over a period of decades. Franklin D. Roosevelt got the ball rolling in 1945, promising protection to the House of Saud in exchange for preferred access to Saudi oil. Dwight D. Eisenhower made his own distinctive contribution, engineering a coup in Tehran and forging a fateful partnership with the Shah. John F. Kennedy chipped in with another CIA-assisted coup, this one bringing the Ba’ath Party to power in Baghdad. Lyndon Johnson and Richard Nixon affirmed the Iranian connection and added another, establishing a costly “special relationship” with Israel. When revolutionaries tossed the Shah out on his ear, Jimmy Carter upped the ante: under the terms of the Carter Doctrine, the United States vowed henceforth to use any means necessary to secure its interests in the Gulf. __________________ If you would only recognize that life is hard, things would be so much easier for you. - Louis D. Brandeis

02-05-2007, 02:42 PM	#3
Happy Monkey I think this line's mostly filler. Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: DC Posts: 13,575	I think you may have stubbed your sarcasm detector. __________________ _________________ \|...............\| We live in the nick of times. \| Len 17, Wid 3 \| \|_______________\| [pics]

02-05-2007, 03:06 PM	#5
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	Fuckin' hamburgers. __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio**

02-05-2007, 03:09 PM	#7
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	No...ham... ??? Good question. "ham" burger ... Oh... from Hamburg. __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio**

02-05-2007, 03:10 PM	#8
Happy Monkey I think this line's mostly filler. Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: DC Posts: 13,575	Exactly. They're made out of Germans. __________________ _________________ \|...............\| We live in the nick of times. \| Len 17, Wid 3 \| \|_______________\| [pics]

02-05-2007, 02:57 PM	#4
rkzenrage Guest Posts: n/a	Hard to tell with text... now that I know, it is very funny. Thanks.

02-05-2007, 03:08 PM	#6
rkzenrage Guest Posts: n/a	Why is there no ham?

02-05-2007, 03:13 PM	#9
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	Don't you find it a little strange that Uder disappears, and now they're feeding us this mysterious food, "Uder-braten" ??? __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio**

02-05-2007, 03:15 PM	#10
glatt ™ Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 27,717	Well, that's what happened with Frank. The next day the menu had Frank-furters.

02-05-2007, 03:16 PM	#11
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	I don't even wanna know what happened the day before they served us fish tacos. __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio**

02-05-2007, 03:19 PM	#12
glatt ™ Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 27,717	Is Abe Vigoda dead? Edit: Just checked. He's still alive. What do you mean? "Fish" tacos?

02-06-2007, 07:25 AM	#14
cowhead halve your cake and eat it too. Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Georgia.. by way of Lawrence Kansas Posts: 1,359	well.. that's why america is the 'great experiment'.. this is an evolving process... damn shame that the thing has been co-opted by the jocks and jarheads. __________________ no my child.. this is not my desire..I'm digging for fire.

02-06-2007, 04:28 PM	#15
Urbane Guerrilla Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Southern California Posts: 6,674	Perhaps if you're neither, you should really try beating them at their own game, or playing your game better than they play theirs? There comes a point when bitching is jejune. __________________ Wanna stop school shootings? End Gun-Free Zones, of course.

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