Guns don't kill people .... - Page 5

BigV · 03-01-2012, 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by classicman

I'll start with whichever adult allowed a child access to a loaded weapon or a weapon and ammo.

Or were you assuming the gun went to the store, bought ammunition,
loaded itself, jumped into the student's backpack and then fired a round by itself?

The boy is responsible. He's 9.

That's the law in Washington. The mom's not responsible, nobody else. He's being charged.

Who *should* be responsible, tha's a different conversation.

Big Sarge · 03-01-2012, 06:05 PM

Why are we blaming guns for this? When I grew up I carried a pocket knife at school and usually had a gun in the rack of my pick up. We often hunted just before or after school. We never had these problems until about 15 years ago.

Aliantha · 03-01-2012, 06:12 PM

I think this is a terrible situation.

I think the real issue that needs to be addressed is the marginalisation of some students. In I think just about every case of a school shooting, it's a victim of bullying who's lost the plot and pulled the trigger.

That speaks more to me of the fact that these kids are never taught any coping skills by their parents or the education system.

It's a huge problem.

Big Sarge · 03-01-2012, 06:29 PM

Ali - I agree it is a terrible problem. I'm just so surprised things have changed. Can you believe we even had a smoking area at school?

Aliantha · 03-01-2012, 06:37 PM

We didn't have a smoking area, but there were 'smoking areas' lol

Aliantha · 03-01-2012, 06:42 PM

You know, the other thing I think about with this issue is that more teenagers are killed or seriously and sometimes permanently injured in hand to hand combat than with guns.

Kids are violent.

They learn it from us grown ups.

ZenGum · 03-01-2012, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aliantha

You know, the other thing I think about with this issue is that more teenagers are killed or seriously and sometimes permanently injured playing rugby or footy than with guns.

Kids are violent.

They learn it from us grown ups.

FIFY.

Then we let them drive cars. It's a wonder we're not extinct.

sexobon · 03-01-2012, 08:17 PM

In addition to the charges brought against the boy, the boy's mother would seem to be culpable of reckless endangerment for not securing the firearm (there's nothing about the boy trespassing in the mother's home to get it). The firearm can be configured for safe carry in the backpack even under the conditions of the pack being slammed down; so, it was a matter of human negligence that the firearm was either left "cocked and with the safety off" by the mother; or, configured that way by the boy. That was neither a safe configuration for firearm storage nor any manner of carry. The safety should not be off until one is ready to pull the trigger. For backpack carry, there shouldn't have been a round in the chamber either.

The boy claimed he was going to run away. A similar situation could have developed if his mother had recklessly left her car keys in her car and the boy got in and drove away then hit someone because he didn't know how to properly control the vehicle.

classicman · 03-01-2012, 08:21 PM

People don't kill people, cars do!

Big Sarge · 03-01-2012, 10:13 PM

That's another sign of the times. We no longer teach kids safe & proper gun handling. Ya'll have seen pics of my 4 year old shooting. We've taught the kids they can look at or handle any weapon in our home as long as they ask first & we go thru the proper clearing procedures. This way the guns aren't a mystery or forbidden fruit. They learn they are a tool that has to be treated the same way as my chainsaw, circular saw, etc.

BTW, my 28 year old still comments on his first gun lesson. I took him out and shot a cantaloupe. I told him that is what would happen to his head if he messed with a loaded gun. Funny the things that stick in their minds

classicman · 03-01-2012, 11:49 PM

Oh, well its Washington ... you should have said that.
Ya know what they say about peeps in Washington, right

BigV · 03-02-2012, 12:01 AM

Don't mess with nine year olds.

classicman · 03-02-2012, 12:05 AM

OK, on a more serious note, you stated "in your opinion."

After reading the article I took this out...

Quote:

the boy said
he got the gun from his mother's house, and brought it to school because he planned to run away.

"I just want everyone to know that
my kid made a mistake." the boy's father said.

If the bail is met,
the boy would be released to his uncle, who is his legal guardian
and who also sat by his side in the courthouse.

Huh??? Gotta be more to that part of this story.

ALets look into this some more ...

Quote:

the boy got the gun from the glovebox of his mother's boyfriend's car.

Quote:

The boy's mother and father relinquished custody of their son,
and his uncle is now his legal guardian.

Quote:

At a court hearing Thursday, Kitsap County officials said
the boy's parents had extensive criminal records.

Court documents show [the mother] has been in and out of the court system//
//she was arrested for possession of meth
She also was convicted of marijuana delivery and forgery.

[the father] has been convicted multiple times for violating protection orders regarding [the mother]

[the father]said the gun belongs to Chaffin's boyfriend and wants police to investigate her.

glatt · 03-02-2012, 07:32 AM

In third grade, I was in Tuscon AZ for a year. A kid in my class brought a handgun to school for show and tell. I'm a little hazy on the details, but I'm pretty sure the teacher held onto it for the boy for the day but let him hold it and show it in front of the class for show and tell. She didn't let him pass it around. And I think she asked him if it was loaded, and he said it wasn't, but I never saw her check for herself. That part of the memory is pretty foggy.

He had found it in the desert on the edge of town and had gone shooting with it. He told the story of when he shot a prickly pear cactus, and when he went to look at the bullet hole, he saw that he had killed a lizard or some other small animal that was behind the cactus.

This was 1976. Different times.

Spexxvet · 03-02-2012, 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by classicman

OK, on a more serious note, you stated "in your opinion."

After reading the article I took this out...

Huh??? Gotta be more to that part of this story.

ALets look into this some more ...

Guns don't kill people, parents kill people

03-01-2012, 06:05 PM	#2
Big Sarge Werepandas - lurking in your shadows Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: In the Deep South Posts: 3,408	Why are we blaming guns for this? When I grew up I carried a pocket knife at school and usually had a gun in the rack of my pick up. We often hunted just before or after school. We never had these problems until about 15 years ago. __________________ Give a man a match, & he'll be warm for 20 seconds. But toss that man a white phosphorus grenade and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

03-01-2012, 06:12 PM	#3
Aliantha trying hard to be a better person Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 16,493	I think this is a terrible situation. I think the real issue that needs to be addressed is the marginalisation of some students. In I think just about every case of a school shooting, it's a victim of bullying who's lost the plot and pulled the trigger. That speaks more to me of the fact that these kids are never taught any coping skills by their parents or the education system. It's a huge problem. __________________ Kind words are the music of the world. F. W. Faber

03-01-2012, 06:29 PM	#4
Big Sarge Werepandas - lurking in your shadows Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: In the Deep South Posts: 3,408	Ali - I agree it is a terrible problem. I'm just so surprised things have changed. Can you believe we even had a smoking area at school? __________________ Give a man a match, & he'll be warm for 20 seconds. But toss that man a white phosphorus grenade and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

03-01-2012, 06:37 PM	#5
Aliantha trying hard to be a better person Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 16,493	We didn't have a smoking area, but there were 'smoking areas' lol __________________ Kind words are the music of the world. F. W. Faber

03-01-2012, 06:42 PM	#6
Aliantha trying hard to be a better person Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 16,493	You know, the other thing I think about with this issue is that more teenagers are killed or seriously and sometimes permanently injured in hand to hand combat than with guns. Kids are violent. They learn it from us grown ups. __________________ Kind words are the music of the world. F. W. Faber

03-01-2012, 08:17 PM	#8
sexobon I love it when a plan comes together. Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 9,793	In addition to the charges brought against the boy, the boy's mother would seem to be culpable of reckless endangerment for not securing the firearm (there's nothing about the boy trespassing in the mother's home to get it). The firearm can be configured for safe carry in the backpack even under the conditions of the pack being slammed down; so, it was a matter of human negligence that the firearm was either left "cocked and with the safety off" by the mother; or, configured that way by the boy. That was neither a safe configuration for firearm storage nor any manner of carry. The safety should not be off until one is ready to pull the trigger. For backpack carry, there shouldn't have been a round in the chamber either. The boy claimed he was going to run away. A similar situation could have developed if his mother had recklessly left her car keys in her car and the boy got in and drove away then hit someone because he didn't know how to properly control the vehicle.

03-01-2012, 08:21 PM	#9
classicman barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy. Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 23,401	People don't kill people, cars do! __________________ "like strapping a pillow on a bull in a china shop" Bullitt

03-01-2012, 10:13 PM	#10
Big Sarge Werepandas - lurking in your shadows Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: In the Deep South Posts: 3,408	That's another sign of the times. We no longer teach kids safe & proper gun handling. Ya'll have seen pics of my 4 year old shooting. We've taught the kids they can look at or handle any weapon in our home as long as they ask first & we go thru the proper clearing procedures. This way the guns aren't a mystery or forbidden fruit. They learn they are a tool that has to be treated the same way as my chainsaw, circular saw, etc. BTW, my 28 year old still comments on his first gun lesson. I took him out and shot a cantaloupe. I told him that is what would happen to his head if he messed with a loaded gun. Funny the things that stick in their minds __________________ Give a man a match, & he'll be warm for 20 seconds. But toss that man a white phosphorus grenade and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

03-01-2012, 11:49 PM	#11
classicman barely disguised asshole, keeper of all that is holy. Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 23,401	Oh, well its Washington ... you should have said that. Ya know what they say about peeps in Washington, right __________________ "like strapping a pillow on a bull in a china shop" Bullitt

03-02-2012, 12:01 AM	#12
BigV Goon Squad Leader Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Seattle Posts: 27,063	Don't mess with nine year olds. __________________ Be Just and Fear Not.

03-02-2012, 07:32 AM	#14
glatt ™ Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 27,717	In third grade, I was in Tuscon AZ for a year. A kid in my class brought a handgun to school for show and tell. I'm a little hazy on the details, but I'm pretty sure the teacher held onto it for the boy for the day but let him hold it and show it in front of the class for show and tell. She didn't let him pass it around. And I think she asked him if it was loaded, and he said it wasn't, but I never saw her check for herself. That part of the memory is pretty foggy. He had found it in the desert on the edge of town and had gone shooting with it. He told the story of when he shot a prickly pear cactus, and when he went to look at the bullet hole, he saw that he had killed a lizard or some other small animal that was behind the cactus. This was 1976. Different times.

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