Progressive Islam - Page 3

xoxoxoBruce · 08-14-2003, 06:47 PM

Cool. Remind them to nail it to the door.....and run like hell.

michelangelo · 08-17-2003, 04:54 AM

I would not make a very big deal out of it. I think you will find this kind of "scary"stuff in almost every religion. I would suggest that this is the reward for becoming a "member"of such a religion.
In order to go through all the trouble of praying and refraining from a lot of activities on gets promised eternal life, bliss and of course to conquer the fools who did not believe!!

This is not only so for muslims, but for chritians, jews, buddist and a few aothers as well.

I would say that every religion is agrassive, even hinduism with theire aggresive "not violence"thing

xoxoxoBruce · 08-17-2003, 01:26 PM

Hi MA, welcome aboard

I think your right about every faith having zealots but the Jehovas Witness zealots seldom come to the door with an AK-47.
The biggest difference seems to be most religious fanatics strive to bring you into the fold whereas the Islamic fanatics just want to kill you for not being in the fold already.
Now I'm sure I'm making an unfair blanket aspersion of Islamics but if a Purple Midget keeps hitting me in the name of Purple and the rest of the Purple Midgets say nothing then as far as I'm concerned all Purple Midgets are bad.

hot_pastrami · 08-18-2003, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by xoxoxoBruce
...if a Purple Midget keeps hitting me in the name of Purple and the rest of the Purple Midgets say nothing then as far as I'm concerned all Purple Midgets are bad.

Purple midgets ARE bad. Don't you watch the news?

Happy Monkey · 08-18-2003, 01:28 PM

Purple midgets very bad. GREEN midgets much better.

michelangelo · 08-18-2003, 02:04 PM

Putting the fun about midgets aside for a moment: I personally have never anybody on my doorstep with an AK-47. I think that islam is a way and a language to bind the forcess oposed to the US or better said the Pax Americana which is forced upon the (Arabic) world by the US and their allies.
For the man in the street in Bagdah, Cairo, Kabul or any other Arab country, the americans are the bad guys. See for yourself on the newnetwork Al-Jazeera, if you dont believe me.
This attitude is a result of the way America has conducted their forreign affairs in the region: supporing dictatorships (Iran, Irak), supproting a royal family without real power (Saudi Arabia), not doing anything in Libanon at the time (in which time by the way you could very well find a christian with an AK-47 at your doorstep) or of course Israel.
The onterforce we are all aware of since 9-11 the much more are liberation movement that a religious movement. The destinction is very relevant here.
Liberal moslims were and are very outspoken about the non-use of force or war. I therefore do not agree with you that the others were silent: they were not, even not is the islamitic countries. You can not jugde an entire faith on the behaviour of some lunatics woh happen to use the same ideology, but for other reasons.

xoxoxoBruce · 08-18-2003, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Liberal moslims were and are very outspoken about the non-use of force or war.

I have not seen this. All I've seen is the Muslim leaders saying it is Allah's will.

michelangelo · 08-19-2003, 12:48 PM

Maybe this is where it al begins. The soft spoken ones, with the leberal and non violent approach, are really to soft or not interesting to the general media or public.
I have heard them on TV and read their opinions in the newspapers. I think one muslim who is opposed and does speak out is enough to take away your general remark anyway.
By making general remarks about a large part of the world population, one cannot start building any trust.
It is by building trust and respect between moslims and non-muslims that one can put a real and to the muslim terrorist movement, by taking away the feelings that feed it.

Whit · 08-19-2003, 01:25 PM

     The way I see it is that people (middle-easterners in this case) often blame those they see as having something (US) for them (middle-easterners) not having it. In this case a small portion of the Middle East blaming the US. Now, these few people then spread their views by talking to those they are closely connected too through a social structure, in this case religion. Thus the views of the few have become the views of the many, but not all. However, on the other side of the ocean all we hear is the threats and all we see are the acts of violence.
     Here's the catch though, when we respond to these actions there is an out cry of "We're not all like that!" This is true. Now, how are we in the US supposed to separate out who is who when the people coming after us are saying it's Muslim vs. Christian? Heck, I'm don't consider myself christian or even religious in any way, yet I'll get killed just as easily. So will my kids for that matter.
     To restate my question, if you are attacked by a group that claims to represent a larger group, and you know they participate in said group, how do you separate the good from bad in said group?
     Blah... that sentence was way to long... I think the point stands though. Hope it makes sense outside my head...

juju · 08-19-2003, 01:45 PM

Yep, I always judge christianity as a whole by those who speak about it to me. And of course, those are always the jerks. I imagine Islam is much the same way.

08-19-2003, 02:19 PM

Yeh, I got one buddy that's a Muslim. Guess what? He shuts the fuck up about it, and he's a cool dude! He doesn't try to convert or anything.

I think that, as a whole, people just don't like others' views being crammed down their throats, be it by killing infidels or riding their bikes to my house in the middle of the fucking winter and interrupting my jerk-off time.

xoxoxoBruce · 08-19-2003, 02:42 PM

Dave, is he reluctant to discuss it if you ask? Or haven't you asked.

xoxoxoBruce · 08-19-2003, 04:19 PM

Well Michael, stories like this certainly don't help.

08-20-2003, 05:39 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by xoxoxoBruce
Dave, is he reluctant to discuss it if you ask? Or haven't you asked.

No, he'll discuss it, but in a completely non-preachy way. If you have any questions that won't offend, I'll ask him. (I don't want to set him off - you know how these Muslims get when you make them angry!

)

xoxoxoBruce · 08-20-2003, 05:54 PM

No thanks Dave, I know a couple myself. They're pretty quiet about it but get quite animated when you ask them why they're terrorists.

08-14-2003, 06:47 PM	#31
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	Cool. Remind them to nail it to the door.....and run like hell. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

08-17-2003, 01:26 PM	#33
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	Hi MA, welcome aboard I think your right about every faith having zealots but the Jehovas Witness zealots seldom come to the door with an AK-47. The biggest difference seems to be most religious fanatics strive to bring you into the fold whereas the Islamic fanatics just want to kill you for not being in the fold already. Now I'm sure I'm making an unfair blanket aspersion of Islamics but if a Purple Midget keeps hitting me in the name of Purple and the rest of the Purple Midgets say nothing then as far as I'm concerned all Purple Midgets are bad. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

08-18-2003, 01:28 PM	#35
Happy Monkey I think this line's mostly filler. Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: DC Posts: 13,575	Green! Purple midgets very bad. GREEN midgets much better. __________________ _________________ \|...............\| We live in the nick of times. \| Len 17, Wid 3 \| \|_______________\| [pics]

08-19-2003, 01:25 PM	#39
Whit Umm ... yeah. Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Arkansas, USA Posts: 949	The way I see it is that people (middle-easterners in this case) often blame those they see as having something (US) for them (middle-easterners) not having it. In this case a small portion of the Middle East blaming the US. Now, these few people then spread their views by talking to those they are closely connected too through a social structure, in this case religion. Thus the views of the few have become the views of the many, but not all. However, on the other side of the ocean all we hear is the threats and all we see are the acts of violence.      Here's the catch though, when we respond to these actions there is an out cry of "We're not all like that!" This is true. Now, how are we in the US supposed to separate out who is who when the people coming after us are saying it's Muslim vs. Christian? Heck, I'm don't consider myself christian or even religious in any way, yet I'll get killed just as easily. So will my kids for that matter.      To restate my question, if you are attacked by a group that claims to represent a larger group, and you know they participate in said group, how do you separate the good from bad in said group?      Blah... that sentence was way to long... I think the point stands though. Hope it makes sense outside my head... __________________ A friend will help you move. A true friend will help you move a body. Last edited by Whit; 08-19-2003 at 01:32 PM.

08-19-2003, 02:42 PM	#42
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	Dave, is he reluctant to discuss it if you ask? Or haven't you asked. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

08-17-2003, 04:54 AM	#32
michelangelo Rapscallion Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: The netherlands Posts: 5	I would not make a very big deal out of it. I think you will find this kind of "scary"stuff in almost every religion. I would suggest that this is the reward for becoming a "member"of such a religion. In order to go through all the trouble of praying and refraining from a lot of activities on gets promised eternal life, bliss and of course to conquer the fools who did not believe!! This is not only so for muslims, but for chritians, jews, buddist and a few aothers as well. I would say that every religion is agrassive, even hinduism with theire aggresive "not violence"thing

08-18-2003, 02:04 PM	#36
michelangelo Rapscallion Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: The netherlands Posts: 5	Putting the fun about midgets aside for a moment: I personally have never anybody on my doorstep with an AK-47. I think that islam is a way and a language to bind the forcess oposed to the US or better said the Pax Americana which is forced upon the (Arabic) world by the US and their allies. For the man in the street in Bagdah, Cairo, Kabul or any other Arab country, the americans are the bad guys. See for yourself on the newnetwork Al-Jazeera, if you dont believe me. This attitude is a result of the way America has conducted their forreign affairs in the region: supporing dictatorships (Iran, Irak), supproting a royal family without real power (Saudi Arabia), not doing anything in Libanon at the time (in which time by the way you could very well find a christian with an AK-47 at your doorstep) or of course Israel. The onterforce we are all aware of since 9-11 the much more are liberation movement that a religious movement. The destinction is very relevant here. Liberal moslims were and are very outspoken about the non-use of force or war. I therefore do not agree with you that the others were silent: they were not, even not is the islamitic countries. You can not jugde an entire faith on the behaviour of some lunatics woh happen to use the same ideology, but for other reasons.

08-19-2003, 12:48 PM	#38
michelangelo Rapscallion Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: The netherlands Posts: 5	Maybe this is where it al begins. The soft spoken ones, with the leberal and non violent approach, are really to soft or not interesting to the general media or public. I have heard them on TV and read their opinions in the newspapers. I think one muslim who is opposed and does speak out is enough to take away your general remark anyway. By making general remarks about a large part of the world population, one cannot start building any trust. It is by building trust and respect between moslims and non-muslims that one can put a real and to the muslim terrorist movement, by taking away the feelings that feed it.

08-19-2003, 01:45 PM	#40
juju no one of consequence Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Arkansas Posts: 2,839	Yep, I always judge christianity as a whole by those who speak about it to me. And of course, those are always the jerks. I imagine Islam is much the same way.

08-19-2003, 02:19 PM	#41
dave Guest Posts: n/a	Yeh, I got one buddy that's a Muslim. Guess what? He shuts the fuck up about it, and he's a cool dude! He doesn't try to convert or anything. I think that, as a whole, people just don't like others' views being crammed down their throats, be it by killing infidels or riding their bikes to my house in the middle of the fucking winter and interrupting my jerk-off time.

08-19-2003, 04:19 PM	#43
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	Well Michael, stories like this certainly don't help. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

08-20-2003, 05:54 PM	#45
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	No thanks Dave, I know a couple myself. They're pretty quiet about it but get quite animated when you ask them why they're terrorists. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump. Last edited by xoxoxoBruce; 08-20-2003 at 05:58 PM.

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