XXXXX Them to Hell! New Katrina Video

[tw]

Originally Posted by MaggieL

No wonder nobody listens to the left anymore.

More quotes from someone that MaggieL considers a lefty extremist:

It is called "the Bush Doctrine." It is a prescription for permanent war for permanent peace, though wars are the death of republics. "No nation," warned Madison, can "preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare." ...

In 2003, the United States invaded a country that did not threaten us, did not attack us, and did not want war with us, to disarm it of weapons we have since discovered it did not have. His war cabinet assured President Bush that weapons of mass destruction would be found, that U.S. forces would be welcome with garlands of flowers, that democracy would flourish in Iraq and spread across the Middle East, that our triumph would convince Israelis and Palestinians to sit down and make peace.

None of this has happened. Those of us who were called unpatriotic for opposing an invasion of Iraq and who warned we would inherit our own Lebanon of 25 million Iraqis were proven right. Now ourt nation is tied down and our army is being daily bled in a war to create a democracy in a country where it has never before existed.

With the guerrilla war, U.S. prestige has plummeted. The hatred of President Bush is pandemic from Marrakech to Mosul. Volunteers to fight the Americans have been trickling into Iraq from Syria, Saudi Arabia, and Iran. In spring 2004, revelations of the sadistic abuse of Iraqi prisoners at Abu Ghriad prison sent U.S. prestige sinking to its lowest levels every in the Arab world. We may have ignited the war of civilizations it was in our vital interest to avoid. Never has America been more resented and reviled in an Islamic world of a billion people. ...

The Bush threat of war upon nations that had not attacked us was unprecedented. Truman never threatened war to stop Stalin from building atomic bombs after Russia tested one in 1949. LBJ did not threaten war on China when it exploded a nuclear weapon in 1964. While it had been U.S. policy to prevent the spread of nuclear weapons, Russia, Britain, France, China, Israel, India, and Pakistan had all acquired nuclear weapons without serious retribution from the United States.

Yet Bush had put Iran, Iraq, and North Korea on notice. Should any of the three seek to enter the circle of nations possessing nuclear weapons - some of which date back to World War I - they risked a preemptive strike and war to disarm them and effect "regime change" in their countries. Though the president may not have known it when he issued his ultimata, North Korea, and Iran already had secret nuclear programs underway.

Still, President Bush had no authority to issue those threats. The Constitution does not empower the president to launch preventive wars. To attain Churchillian heights, Bush's speechwriters had taken him over the top. But, as events would demonstrate, Bush fully intended to go where his rhetoric was leading him. ...

5) We attacked, invaded, and occupied a prostrate Arab nation that did not attack us, and did not want war with us, and could not resist us, on the pretext that Iraq had played a role in the 9/11 horrors and was building weapons of mass destruction to attack us. These were lies to cover up our greed to control the oil wealth of Iraq, destroy a defiant Arab nation, and erect an American empire in the Middle East.
...
By attacking and occupying an Arab nation that had no role in 9/11, no plans to attack us, and no weapons of mass destruction, we played into bin Laden's hand. We have given Muslims from Morocco to Malaysia a unifying cause and recruiting slogan: "Drive the Americans out of Iraq!"

According to MaggieL, above is also lefty rhetoric. She knows because she has been properly indoctrinated into right wing conservatism. Or has she? Maybe she is so wacko extreme right that even right wing conservatives are pinko lefties? The above quotes are from Pat Buchanan - a famous right wing conservative. To MaggieL, Pat Buchanan is a leftist because MaggieL is that wacko right wing extreme. To MaggieL, centrists are also lefty pinko extremists. It happens when political agendas replace intelligent thought.

One can be conservative and smart. Buchanan did not let wacko extremist rhetoric promote lies about WMDs and threats of a toothless Saddam. Remember MaggieL - you were first to post insults without any supporting facts. Poltical dogma is not a replacement for intelligent thought. You could have posted facts in defense of your opinions. But that is not what fringe extremists do.

Intelligent conservatives label George Jr and so many in his administration as incompetent. Apparently it takes longer for logical thought to get out to extremist fringe. Your opinions are even 'right wing extremist' to Pat Buchanan.

Insult - one posts accusations not based in reality and not even justified by facts. MaggieL, that is the difference between what you posted and what a responsible poster does. You would be better advised to provide supporting facts with your posts. Above is an example of how intelligent conservatives reason.

[MaggieL]

Originally Posted by tw

More quotes from someone that MaggieL considers a lefty extremist

I can tell the difference between that level of discourse and chanting "mental midget". Can you?

I don't consider myself a conservative, but rather a small-l libertarian, verging on objectivist. I didn't say anything about "insults" or "fringe" or "extreme". I did mention a "shrill screed", because that's exactly what I saw. I've seen it before...directed at Nixon. I'm not at all a fan of Nixon now nor then, but I recognize the same drumbeat now in the Bush-hating crowd that drove the Nixon-hating crowd then--a crowd I was very much part of at the time.

The problem with that approach to politics is that it confuses "criticism" with "critical thought". It's very comforting to hang out with a crowd of like-thinking Bush haters and swap chimp jokes, or foam at the mouth about the conspiracy theory du jour. In addition to the warm sense of cameraderie it confers upon the participants with the addition frisson of beleving they're not only righteous, but intellectually superior to those poor red-necked red-staters outside the cult.

But the real tragedy of it all is that that style of thought seems to relieve the participants of any need to offer anything viable as an alternative. "I hate Bush, just like alll my friends. Isn't that enough? Hey, do you TiVo the Daily Show?".

In 2000 I voted for Gore. Not enthusiastically. In 2001 I became glad that that was the minority opinion, because the post-cold war pax didn't last anywere near as long as we'd hoped, and the idea of Gore at the helm in such times was almost as chilling as Clinton, or (Goddess help us) Carter.

The truly frustrating thing for me about Bush and his buddies is that there's nobody in the opposition I can like better...and that a pretty low bar to pass.

[tw]

Originally Posted by MaggieL

I can tell the difference between that level of discourse and chanting "mental midget".

Apparently not because you’re political perspective is far right of Pat Buchanan. You defend THE reason for problems rather than admit to reality and the facts. And these are facts - not some shrill cry. George Jr is a mental midget. By now, MaggieL, I would have thought you knew better. The person who identified a ‘mental midget' is the same person who accurately corrected you about WMDs and the 'Pearl Harboring' of Iraq. Accurate because technical facts rather than political rationalization was used. Yes, MaggieL, you must concede that the president who also does not read his memos and PDBs, who provides corporate welfare to airlines, steel companies and big agriculture, and who even keeps drug prices excessively high with government subsidies therefore can only be a mental midget. (this from someone who was also quite critical of Democrats.)

To view Katrina video tapes and not admit George Jr is a mental midget - one can only be a fringe political extremist, or completely naive. Which is it? A "small-l libertarian, verging on objectivist" would never conclude anything less from five years of George Jr mismanagement. The "Mission Accomplishment" declaration alone is enough to suspect George Jr does not have sufficient geo-military-political knowledge. That he did not know what countries border Israel causes you to think he is smart? Objectivist and yet outright deny reality? It is called a contradiction - mutually exclusive. But it explains why Pat Buchanan is a pinko lefty.

Did you read busterb's post before attacking marichko over something irrelevant? Facts that predict, "MaggieL eventually conceded that George Jr is a complete idiot". How long before you decide to address what busterb posted?

Originally Posted by busterb

This flappin thread has lasted for about 20 post and now is about peoples income. What I'd like to know! WTF are any of you going to do about things?
Do you stay on your elected offical's asses about things?

The answer starts by eliminating THE reason for these problems. The president is a mental midget. People died from that mismanagement. I don't see MaggieL providing any facts to prove otherwise. But somehow she just knows this could not be true. A "small-l libertarian, verging on objectivist" would never deny reality? In literally every crisis, this president could not make a decision; instead resorted to political rhetoric and incompetence. My god. Did you bother to notice every decision and every question this President asked in those video tapes? All NONE of them? Do you think his ten wasteful trips to New Orleans will fix things?

No wonder this president so fears Americans as to even wiretap without judicial approval. And now he wants to prosecute patriotic Americans who blew the whistle. But MaggieL somehow sees some intelligence inside this man. Please – fill the world with your wisdom rather than post emotional tirades about “shrill”. Yes, he is just smart enough to even lie, "Nobody expected the levees to be breached". Therefore he is a genius? Therefore busterb’s post is really a lie?

Meanwhile only a right wing fringe extremist would promote this propaganda -

Originally Posted by MaggieL

I think the reflex Bush-haters are making a lot of hay here by ignoring the difference between "overrun" and "breached".

No wonder FEMA is so chock full of lawyers and MBAs. No wonder top professional disaster control experts were removed in 2000. What a genius this president was! Only an extremist would argue some difference between overrun and breached. But then again, even Pat Buchanan is a lefty.

How many more people and science need we kill to the glory of this president? My god - after a $450,000 campaign contribution, even the Davis Besse nuclear reactor with a potential Three Mile Island problem and a hole through its 6" carbon steel containment building was permitted to operate for months. Does the word ‘corruption’ have meaning among the fringe right wing? If the 'Fed is us', then why did WE keep the USS Bataan out of New Orleans as people starved? MaggieL - how many more people must die before you finally conceded this president is a mental midget. "Stupid is what stupid does". Even Forest Gump would not argue an irrelevant difference between 'overrun verses breached' - as you do to defend a mental midget. Clearly you will not help busterb by identifying a 'mental midget' reason for failure. Your denial is not due to a shortage of facts. This president has set the record for incompetance.

Facts say repeatedly that George Jr is a mental midget. Those who protect this mental midget cannot be bothered to admit why this Katrina problem lingers - will even deny what is on the video tape. If you have a problem with ‘mental midget’ – well its called denial – similar to a drug addiction. Pat Buchanan does not seem to have your ‘reality’ problem; attempting critical thought. Meanwhile I have this bad problem of identifying reality long before you are willing disavow your political biases. Others here should be reminded of how you made sweeping declarations in defense of a mental midget decision to invade iraq due to 911 attacks. Somehow you see enemies hiding everywhere. You did so using promises from that president. So how badly did he deceive you with lies three plus years ago? And still he is intelligent? Well, so was the fiendish Dr. Moriarity. Is he also presidential material? Or is he too liberal?

Where is your list of facts that proves intelligence in this president? Why do you forget to post such facts? Something about a shortage? Did he do anything to fix FEMA? Where are all those professional disaster managers brought in to replace George Jr political appointees? Need we wait till hell freezes over before you find some facts? When do you cite a single proposal to fix what makes the Katrina disaster fester so? Is this tenth visit by Air Force One suppose to solve such problems? Why do you have emotional problems with an accurate description: "mental midget"? A fear of reality? MaggieL has nothing but political rhetoric to prove this president is competent. Try looking for facts from Pat Buchanan or from Bill Kristol of the National Review. Oh. They are too pinko lefty. Or is it called reality - the competance of top management- ie the response to Katrina.

And yes, George Jr today called for rebuilding in the Ninth Ward.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Bush says by hurricane season the dikes will be patched and September of next year they'll be up to designed strength....... which is, I believe, CAT-3.
So why not rebuild the 9th ward? I mean, what are the chances of a Cat-4 or 5 every hitting the area?

C'mon, TW. Don't beat around the Bush. You really don't like the guy, do you?

[tw]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

C'mon, TW. Don't beat around the Bush. You really don't like the guy, do you?

My first posts about George Jr suggested that he was a compassionate conservative. I also had doubts about Gore. Noted back then was how George Jr so often did legislation why working more often with Democrats. Then I started learning facts.

The China spy plane incident raised suspicions sharply. Others, I suspect, did not understand how George Jr (back then I attributed this to administration senior officials) all but wanted to get us into a shooting war with China. Destruction of the anti-ballistic missile treaty and militarizing space were decidedly factors that only a fool would propose. This because the anti-ballistic missile system does not work - and a long list of other reasons.

But George Jr did not stop. Statements from a Norwegian foreign minister warning that George Jr would destroy the Oslo Accords proved accurate.

Read the 911 Commission. No senior administration official - and that especially includes George Jr - did anything that day to protect Americans. MaggieL, who is still in denial, is encouraged - outrightly challenged - in her face - to state one thing that George Jr did to defend America that day.

The Indian Ocean Tsunami - five days later is when George Jr would even acknowledge that disaster. And only after other nations - our closest friends - would humiliate America for a 'no response'.

However, those who were still in denial - could not even bother to grasp reality - cannot deny Hurricane Katrina. Those video tapes prove that no one - not anything with minimal intelligence - could claim George Jr is a leader. He never even asked one question. He never once provided any direction. George Jr is incompetence extraordinaire - a mental midget.

George Jr demonstrated incompetence again during Hurricane Katrina. No one with minimal intelligence could deny these facts. No one.

But MaggieL - please tell us one thing George Jr did on 11 September to protect America? A smarter MaggieL will remain silent - because that is the answer.

[xoxoxoBruce]

MaggieL, who is still in denial, is encouraged - outrightly challenged - in her face - to state one thing that George Jr did to defend America that day.

Well, that's easy, he protected the President. What could be more important than that?