What does being a "Liberal" mean? (US)

[classicman]

Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

The crazy train is up an running.

[BigV]

Originally Posted by footfootfoot

Marvin Gardens...

There's a Marvin Gardens downtown.

I'll get a picture tomorrow.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by Fair&Balanced

I dont recall any liberal claiming that he/she is running for president because it is a calling from God, unlike the current crop of conservative Republicans.

Herman Cain: "God said, 'Not yet. I've got something else for you to do.' And it might be to become the president of the United States of America."

Michelle Bachman: "If I felt that's what the Lord was calling me to do, I would do it....When I have sensed that the Lord is calling me to do something, I've said yes to it....If I am called to serve in that realm I would serve"

Rick Santorum: "It really boils down to God's will. What is it that God wants? ... We have prayed a lot about this decision, and we believe with all our hearts that this is what God wants."

So if God telling them all to run, which one is He endorsing?

" But the truth is, is that, our challenge is to get people persuaded that we can make progress when there's not evidence of that in their daily lives. You go into some of these small towns in Pennsylvania, and like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them. And they fell through the Clinton administration, and the Bush administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not. So it's not surprising then that they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." Obama

[BigV]

mercy, you're elusive because you just don't stay on topic. you don't have any compunctions against conflating the most disparate and irrelevant statements. you do this all the time. I want to keep up, but you don't talk in a straight line, with contiguous thoughts. It's frustrating because I bet you have some good ideas, not all the good ideas of course, but the ones you probably have are practically impossible to discern. If I thought you were just being deliberately difficult or nuts, I'd ignore you--I don't think those things.

So, for example, how would you reply to F+B's question? I read your post, it's practically a non-sequitor.

[DanaC]

Originally Posted by BigV

mercy, you're elusive because you just don't stay on topic. you don't have any compunctions against conflating the most disparate and irrelevant statements. you do this all the time. I want to keep up, but you don't talk in a straight line, with contiguous thoughts. It's frustrating because I bet you have some good ideas, not all the good ideas of course, but the ones you probably have are practically impossible to discern. If I thought you were just being deliberately difficult or nuts, I'd ignore you--I don't think those things.

So, for example, how would you reply to F+B's question? I read your post, it's practically a non-sequitor.

This is the main problem I have with arguing with Merc. It's like trying to plait fog.

[Pete Zicato]

Originally Posted by DanaC

It's like trying to plait fog.

I love that turn of phrase.

You sound better, Dana. I'm glad.

[DanaC]

Considerably so, thanks Pete

[Spexxvet]

Some characteristics of a modern American liberal:

- a willingness to compromise.

- a willingness to increase taxes on themselves.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by BigV

mercy, you're elusive because you just don't stay on topic. you don't have any compunctions against conflating the most disparate and irrelevant statements. you do this all the time. I want to keep up, but you don't talk in a straight line, with contiguous thoughts. It's frustrating because I bet you have some good ideas, not all the good ideas of course, but the ones you probably have are practically impossible to discern. If I thought you were just being deliberately difficult or nuts, I'd ignore you--I don't think those things.

No, what you and others want to do is place me and what I think into some nice little box you recognize and understand as a familiar thing. You will never be able to do that.

[TheMercenary]

Originally Posted by BigV

So, for example, how would you reply to F+B's question? I read your post, it's practically a non-sequitor.

My response is exactly how he responded, but it didn't come from an list of quotes from Herman Cain and other Republickin presidential want-to-bes and a discussion of God, it came from Obama and his attacks on rural people who believe in God and guns and all those other evil things that are tearing this country apart. Rigggghhttt...

(And no, I don't even go to church.)

It is an in-kind response.

[ZenGum]

Originally Posted by Spexxvet

Some characteristics of a modern American liberal:

- environmentally friendly gas-guzzlers

- sustainably harvested ammunition

- organic bibles

[Lamplighter]

Originally Posted by Flint

I remember what it was like. I was young and full of ideas--I knew the right answer for everything. There were policies that I believed would be best for the country, and for the human race. Many people didn't agree with these ideas, but that was because, you see, they were stupid. You know, studid, racist, Bible-thumpers.

And if they didn't want to go along with the progress of humanity, they would have to be dragged along kicking and screaming. And once all the obsolete oldtimers passed away, the rest of us could really get on with it. It was importnat to stand for things that needed to change. Old-fashioned ideas that weren't needed anymore.

I believed, at that time (although I never would have admitted to it in these terms, but the concept is unavoidable), that a legitimate use of the government would be to impose ideas on some people "for their own good" simply because the rest of us were so convinced that we had all the answers.

I don't believe that anymore.

I'm still a believer... and much of what you said above is true in PDX.
We are still dragging them kicking and screaming....


Portland Enacts Plastic Bag Ban
By Sophia Bennett
August 24, 2011

Portland is the most recent city to ban plastic bags from many retail stores.

On July 28, 2011, the Portland City Council passed a resolution stating that,
as of October 15, 2011, large grocery stores and various big-box stores cannot
distribute plastic carryout bags to their customers.

“We really wanted to try to reach the biggest generators of plastic bags first,”
says Lisa Libby, Planning and Sustainability Director for Portland Mayor Sam Adams.
That’s why the City Council targeted the stores where people make the most frequent trips.
<snip>

Senate Bill 536 would have banned single-use plastic bags “except in certain cases,”
such as seafood retailers that pack fish on ice.
The bill was approved by the [Oregon] Senate, but ultimately did not pass in the House.
With the failure of SB 536, Portland quickly went back to work finding its own solution.
Libby is still optimistic that a statewide law on plastic bags will pass at some point.
“We hope that resolutions from jurisdictions will move us toward a more comprehensive state policy,” she says.

To help local residents prepare for the bag ban, city officials have been handing out reusable shopping bags for years.

[ZenGum]

We did that a few years back. The sky did not fall, life goes on, and my green hippy bags sit in the car.

[classicman]

Great, so now we use paper bags and kill more trees. Deforestation here we come!

[ZenGum]

Contrariwise; the bags are made from durable cloth and are reusable indefinitely.

Except I saw some idiot TV news-type show warning us about the dangers of getting our reusable bags dirty, then carrying food products in them. Nitwit reporter ends by recommending that we can wash them regularly, or "throw them out and get new ones".