My Son the Idiot

[ladysycamore]

OnyxCougar I'm so totally with you on the points that you made. I get so goddamned tired of people not being accountable.

ThisOleMiss: I hope things work out for you and your son, I really do.

*STILL glad as hell to be childfree*

[Scopulus Argentarius]

The 'tude you've got is correct and just. Keep it up.


Sincerely, ThisLSUTiger

[wolf]

ThisOleMiss ...

Speaking as someone who deals with people like the GF, the GF's mom, and your son on a very regular basis, I have to say, you RULE.

Your son decided some time ago that he was going to make his own decisions.

He made them, and has been dealing with the consequences for ever since.

You are also quite correct in not footing the bill for these consequences.

Certainly the three of them can be overly enmeshed in their little nest of chaos that they've built. Sooner or later someone's gonna realize that three parasites cannot live off each other for long, and a new host will be sought.

(That's the bullet that you just dodged.)

Continued good luck and strength.

[xoxoxoBruce]

You could have sent them plane tickets to your house and buried the bodies under the goat pen.

[slang]

Originally posted by ladysycamore
*STILL glad as hell to be childfree*

Yeah, like syc is an adult. Come on!

[lumberjim]

olemiss,

I have to agree with your stance on cutting those apron strings, and the gf's mom should be ashamed of herself for even asking for your help, much less demanding it and trying to give you a guilt trip.

*crosses eyes like Colombo*

I just have one question:

What did you do to your son in his earlier teen years to make this walking fireplug and her transient lifestyle seem attractive?

nothing personal, as i don't know you, but I think usually when we have a problem with someone and it seems like they are totally in the wrong, it is still a good idea to look at ourselves at the same time to see if we have caused or contributed to the problem.

be honest, I am not judging you, it just seems like part of this story is missing.

[Riddil]

Also I think it's important to keep in mind that "travelling nurse" is a fairly weak excuse. I used to date a girl who was getting her nursing degree, and planned to become a travelling nurse just b/c the pay was better.

But, the end result is that nurses are in demand *everywhere*. All you have to do is apply to a few area hospitals/clinics and you WILL find a position if you have any half-way stable credentials.

It really sounds like the mother has a victim's mindset. She can see her current plight, but even though it would be simple to remedy it, she feels powerless to actually take action to fix her problems.

[OnyxCougar]

Originally posted by lumberjim

What did you do to your son in his earlier teen years to make this walking fireplug and her transient lifestyle seem attractive?

Come on, Jim, isn't that sort of a bullshit question? Blaming the parent for the child's mistakes? My parents were hard workers, I never wanted for anything, and they tried to instill morals and ethics into me. So of course, I "rebel" against them and go get knocked up at 16 with a murderer. (Granted, I didn't know he was gonna be a murderer, but still.) It's nothing my parents did, it was me being a dumb ass.

That's like asking the parents of any teen that shoots at his/her classmates, "What did you do to them to make them killers?" Oftentimes, they didn't do anything "to" them. Many times, they were hard working, loving parents.

Through the decades, in America, children have rebelled against the parents. In the 50's it was rock and roll. In the 60's and 70's it was make love not war. The habit of blaming your parents for everything wrong in your life started in the 80's (Wolf would probably have a way better take on this than me.) and continued into the 90's. That turned into "I'm gonna call CPS on you if you hit me/make me do my homework/make me eat broccoli." And they did. And then CPS got overzealous and we have a whole new generation of kids that run rampant and there is little you can do to stop a headstrong kid from making mistakes now.

Now I'm not saying bad people are never the parents' fault. But I am saying that bad people don't always have bad parents.

I don't know ThisOleMiss either, but from her posts, I think she raised this child well, and he is either rebelling against her, or is experimenting with a new lifestyle because he never was in a position of being able to be with mentally ill tattooed women with transient mothers. Now he's over 18 and can make his own stupid decisions (instead of being forced into the better choices by his parent). And here we are.

And yet, it's undeniable: we are products of our environment.

His mom <b>did</b> have something to do with this, whether or not you want to admit it. Children are affected by how they are raised. I never "rebelled" the way you folks are talking about it. My musical tastes are different, but I never felt the need to go do drugs or get drunk. I was raised pretty well in that sense. Others are not.

To suggest that parents don't have a hand in forming their childrens' attitudes is absurd. He is ultimately responsible for his decisions, and I think ThisOleMiss acted 100% appropriately, but lumberjim's question is valid.

[lumberjim]

yeah, it is a bullshit question. I wasn't throwing omiss under the bus, just reminding her to consider what events or atmosphere may have contributed to the choices he has made. I'll tell you that the reason it occured to me (other than my wife the lurker saying something about it) was that she would call her son an idiot in a public way like that.

i do have some personal exp with this topic....my sister moved to s dakota with a pagan(biker gang) when she was 17......it was resultant of the divorce of my parents, and my fathers dumping on her constantly...among other things. I think olemiss is doing the right thing now, i am just wondering about the motive.....is it tough love or is it just easier to wash her hands of it?

just asking questions.....not in a position to judge

[OnyxCougar]

I only partially agree, dave.

Yes, parents are responsible for how they raise their children. It is their job to instill morals and ethics and as much common sense and responsibility as possible.

Sometimes bad people have siblings that are good people, raised the same way by the same people. Sometimes really good people come out of really bad homes with really bad parents.

I am not suggesting that parents don't have a hand in shaping their children's attitudes. That WOULD be absurd.

But I am not responsible for what my 24 year old son finds attractive. The boy had a job. He was in college. She allowed this walking problem into her home and gave her a shot. She GAVE him the lecture, she tried to tell him this wasn't a good idea. He didn't listen. That, in and of itself, tells me that he was raised properly, he KNEW this was a bad decision going in, and he figured, well why not? Mom will bail me out. It's a mistake of youth and judgement, not upbringing.



And Jim, the experience with your sister isn't even close to the same thing. First, she was underage (17), TOM's son was 23 and in college. The fundamental difference is that she wasn't even legally old enough to make a decision to go anywhere, where's TOM's son was fully an adult, by legal standards.

But your point about your sister does have validity, in that she ran off with a biker gang at 17, and you didn't. What was the difference in your upbringing?

[lumberjim]

Originally posted by OnyxCougar
I only partially agree, dave.

What was the difference in your upbringing?

my incredible talent for apathy. it's a gift, i know.


Also, I never had a biker make me feel special! my sis is fine now, just had a new baby....you'd like her, she's a witch too.

again, cougar, i wasn't blaming ole miss. just asking for more background...

[Beestie]

Originally posted by lumberjim

again, cougar, i wasn't blaming ole miss. just asking for more background...

I think it was an on-point question but its easy to misinterpret one's intentions - especially since the underpinning of the thread is "who's responsibile for what."

Its sort of a water-under-the-bridge question for me unless there are still children in the nest. Otherwise its really about damage control and doing the right thing today and tomorrow.

Also, I never had a biker make me feel special!

Well, I'm sorry to hear that

[lumberjim]

Originally posted by OnyxCougar


But your point about your sister does have validity, in that she ran off with a biker gang at 17, and you didn't. What was the difference in your upbringing?

just to clarify....it was one biker...not the whole gang...i put (biker gang) in there to differentiate (sp?) so as not to offend the Pagans(druid wierdos) on here.

[hot_pastrami]

Originally posted by lumberjim
What did you do to your son in his earlier teen years to make this walking fireplug and her transient lifestyle seem attractive?

A valid question, but poorly worded... it seems to implicate the mother. Perhaps a better way to ask would be "Did you do anything to your son in his earlier teen years..."

There are so many ingredients that go into life decisions that it's tricky to cite any one thing as a primary cause. Of course it all boils down to Environment and Character, but each of those things are a tangled maze of details. As others pointed out, bad upbringing can result in "good" kids, and good upbringing can result in "bad" kids. I'm one of the latter... my mother raised me as a good Mormon boy, and now I'm a godless, alcohol-drinking, cigar-smoking man who shacked up with his girlfriend for months before getting married.

When kids pull stupid shit, it is wise to look inwardly, to see what you might have done wrong. But sometimes, they just made a stupid mistake, and there was nothing you could have done to prevent it. And most of the time, you'll never know for sure, and the best thing you can do is to make smart decisions now.