Libertarian land ownership theory - Page 2

xoxoxoBruce · 08-07-2006, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by footfootfoot

I can outrun him.

Then you're not seizing and holding his house and chattel.

footfootfoot · 08-08-2006, 07:40 AM

It's getting more and more complicated...

Happy Monkey · 08-08-2006, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Radar

Historically? Yes.

So Libertarianism is another instance of "whoever has the biggest guns owns everything"?

Stormieweather · 08-08-2006, 11:49 AM

Does this theory include any capturing and ravishing of maidens?

Ibby · 08-08-2006, 12:05 PM

I think Radar's original point has totally flipped over on its back and died like a cockroach.

Radar · 08-08-2006, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happy Monkey

So Libertarianism is another instance of "whoever has the biggest guns owns everything"?

No. It's whomever has the biggest guns is the most secure in their honestly aquired property. Libertarians don't support imperialism, foreign military interventionism, or any other initiation of force, especially for political gain or social engineering.

If you've got enough guns, people can't take your land. If they've got more guns than you, chances are they can and there's nothing you can do about it.

Flint · 08-08-2006, 01:29 PM

Maybe the conversation just took a horrible wrong turn somewhere?

Happy Monkey · 08-08-2006, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Radar

If you've got enough guns, people can't take your land. If they've got more guns than you, chances are they can and there's nothing you can do about it.

And then it's theirs.

So whoever has the biggest guns owns everything.

Flint · 08-08-2006, 04:02 PM

So instead of investing in a 401-K, I should be building a stockpile of black market assault rifles?

Radar · 08-08-2006, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happy Monkey

And then it's theirs.

So whoever has the biggest guns owns everything.

Not necessarily so. There are lots of people who have less guns than the guy with the most guns, and they could combine their guns together to take down the guy with the most guns. This prevents any one person (or country) from having everything.

Power is constantly shifting.

Ibby · 08-08-2006, 05:19 PM

So what youre saying is...

...

...israel has the right to the land, but if the terrorists get powerful enough to take it then tough shit for israel?

xoxoxoBruce · 08-08-2006, 06:51 PM

That's right. Has it ever been any other way?

Radar · 08-08-2006, 07:57 PM

Pretty much.... though they'd have to have more guns than Israel and America which isn't likely since the U.S. military budget is larger than the next 20 largest military spenders combined. Israel is the 12th largest military spender.

Flint · 08-08-2006, 08:17 PM

And this...is...the main part of being...Libertarian...?

I have to say...this really doesn't sound like a new idea...

Radar · 08-08-2006, 08:57 PM

Actually the root of all libertarianism comes down to a couple of principles.

1. Self ownership - You own yourself and nobody else has any claim on your body or the fruits of your labor. Our property is an extension of ourselves. We have the right to defend ourselves, our rights, and our property with any level of force needed (including deadly force)

2. Personal Responsibility - While you're free to make your own decisions, you are responsible for those decisions and can't expect others to pay for your mistakes.

3. Non-Aggression Principle - Nobody has the right to use force other than in thier own defense, or in the defense of those who hire you as an agent. This means it's never ok to start aggression against someone else, but it's always ok to use aggression in your defense. When it comes to nations, it's never ok to start wars or practice military interventionism. It's not ok to take sides in disputes, to arm other nations, to use our military to defend other nations or to "liberate" oppressed people, etc.

08-08-2006, 07:40 AM	#17
footfootfoot To shreds, you say? Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: in the house and on the street-how many, many feet we meet! Posts: 18,449	It's getting more and more complicated... __________________ The internet is a hateful stew of vomit you can never take completely seriously. - Her Fobs

08-08-2006, 11:49 AM	#19
Stormieweather Wearing her bitch boots Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Floriduh Posts: 1,181	Does this theory include any capturing and ravishing of maidens? __________________ "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." - Mahatma Gandhi

08-08-2006, 12:05 PM	#20
Ibby erika Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: "the high up north" Posts: 6,127	I think Radar's original point has totally flipped over on its back and died like a cockroach. __________________ not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh

08-08-2006, 01:29 PM	#22
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	Maybe the conversation just took a horrible wrong turn somewhere? __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio**

08-08-2006, 04:02 PM	#24
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	So instead of investing in a 401-K, I should be building a stockpile of black market assault rifles? __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio**

08-08-2006, 05:19 PM	#26
Ibby erika Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: "the high up north" Posts: 6,127	So what youre saying is... ... ...israel has the right to the land, but if the terrorists get powerful enough to take it then tough shit for israel? __________________ not really back, you didn't see me, i was never here shhhhhh

08-08-2006, 06:51 PM	#27
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	That's right. Has it ever been any other way? __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

08-08-2006, 07:57 PM	#28
Radar Constitutional Scholar Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Ocala, FL Posts: 4,006	Pretty much.... though they'd have to have more guns than Israel and America which isn't likely since the U.S. military budget is larger than the next 20 largest military spenders combined. Israel is the 12th largest military spender. __________________ "I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death." - George Carlin

08-08-2006, 08:17 PM	#29
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	And this...is...the main part of being...Libertarian...? I have to say...this really doesn't sound like a new idea... __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio**

08-08-2006, 08:57 PM	#30
Radar Constitutional Scholar Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Ocala, FL Posts: 4,006	Actually the root of all libertarianism comes down to a couple of principles. 1. Self ownership - You own yourself and nobody else has any claim on your body or the fruits of your labor. Our property is an extension of ourselves. We have the right to defend ourselves, our rights, and our property with any level of force needed (including deadly force) 2. Personal Responsibility - While you're free to make your own decisions, you are responsible for those decisions and can't expect others to pay for your mistakes. 3. Non-Aggression Principle - Nobody has the right to use force other than in thier own defense, or in the defense of those who hire you as an agent. This means it's never ok to start aggression against someone else, but it's always ok to use aggression in your defense. When it comes to nations, it's never ok to start wars or practice military interventionism. It's not ok to take sides in disputes, to arm other nations, to use our military to defend other nations or to "liberate" oppressed people, etc. __________________ "I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death." - George Carlin

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