Cellar moving again, outage pending

Undertoad · 02-14-2006, 05:04 PM

The Cellar will be unavailable on Friday 2/17, from approx. 11am to approx. 2pm. At that time it will be on the fastest, bestest connection it has ever been on. It will also be more expensive than ever, but not the crazy price I would have to pay if I stayed with the current provider (Netreach/neonetix/nntx).

It is not unfair google fodder to say that Neonetix seriously lost it with their business plan. The evidence is here, for those geeky/interested:

http://www.nntx.net/Services/CoLocation.asp

This page describes the pricing for placing a server in Netreach/neonetics server room. The key figure is "Throughput (monthly max)". You notice that, at the $150 "enhanced" rate, the maximum throughput you can get is "30Gb". The lower-case b, it turns out, is important.

It indicates that your maximum throughput is 30 gigabits. The problem here is that every other provider on the net lists that figure in gigaBYTES.

If you've taken CompSci 101 you might recall that there are 8 bits in a byte. It's a little worse than that, because the traffic that's measured in bits includes bits dedicated to controlling the protocol. So let's say the difference between a GB and a Gb is ten-fold.

Therefore, by making that b lower-case, Netreach/neonetix set its monthly limits at a point where the Cellar, at the $150/month package, reached the limit in 2 days.

20 days would not have surprised me. But if a simple forum maxes your "enhanced" package out in 2 days, your business plan is hosed.

Now look at the "additional bandwidth" pricing at the bottom of the page. They insisted that the $595 price for 1.5mb/sec is their price for unmetered bandwidth, not affected by the monthly max. So the actual retail price to me, for three servers, would be $775/month.

The competition offered me $389/month for three servers at 10mb/sec unmetered.

Again, either $775 for 1.5mb/sec unmetered, or $389 for 10mb/sec unmetered.

Griff · 02-14-2006, 05:25 PM

Speaking of slacking off, I need to hit the tip jar... advising others to to likewise. thanks Tony.

BigV · 02-14-2006, 05:28 PM

Your last sentence make clear which is the better choice.

qq:

$389/month PER server for three servers? or for all three servers (or however many servers you have...)? or 129/server/month?

Also, in my experience, the "unmetered" tagline is, shall we say, fuzzy. They may actually not meter it. They may meter it and don't quanitfy / charge for it. But I'm certain that if your resources are a large load on their systems then you *will* get a call and a renegotiation will commence.

I would say that your first defense is a thorough reading of the contract. You have demonstrated your skill at this. But a high speed connection like that (10Mb/sec, pretty good) which is better than I could find in a short local search, may be too good to be true too.

Undertoad · 02-14-2006, 05:33 PM

I should say that a good portion of that monthly nut will come from my two other clients, so not all of that 389 will come out of the Cellar funds... probably 159. Tip jar hits are appreciated nonetheless

xoxoxoBruce · 02-14-2006, 05:38 PM

Check's in the mail.

Griff · 02-14-2006, 05:40 PM

So two sailors a Pole and a Chech are swept off the deck of their whaler...you know the rest.

Undertoad · 02-14-2006, 05:46 PM

$389 for all 3, BigV.

I might also note that similar services are available at different rates all over the net. For example, you can go to 1and1.com, click on "root server" and see they will sell you 1000GB of transfer per month PLUS THE SERVER for $99/month. (Unfortunately the server is only 40 GB hard drive...) Or burst.net, click on colocation and there's 2000GB/month for $109.95 or 10mb/sec unlimited for $329.95.

Or if I was really serious I might go here and get an entire half-rack with 2mb/sec for the same price as neonetix. Then I would be right at the peering hub of a lot of major providers.

Fuck, it hardly even pays to understand all this shit when someone can screw you over by making their b lower-case.

lumberjim · 02-14-2006, 06:14 PM

this thread brought to you by the letter "b"

lumberjim · 02-14-2006, 06:14 PM

should we do another fund raiser?

lotta new folks that don't have cellar tshirts, pens, coffee mugs or mousepads out there.

Undertoad · 02-14-2006, 06:22 PM

Bake sale?

No seriously I bet there are T-shirt places on the web that are better than cafepress and let you submit designs.

lumberjim · 02-14-2006, 07:08 PM

custom ink dot com.

http://www.customink.com/cink/r.jsp?...e/retrieve.jsp

retirieve saved designs use email address :jhelm3ATdejazzd.com

zippyt · 02-14-2006, 07:53 PM

I'm in for a fund raiser

Undertoad · 02-14-2006, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lumberjim

retirieve saved designs use email address :jhelm3ATdejazzd.com

And forget about that one marked "titles". That was just an idea.

wolf · 02-15-2006, 12:55 AM

Very cool shirts. Especially since they can do them in black.

The blue glass coffee mug is more than classy. I would need several. I fear breakage.

Elspode · 02-15-2006, 12:52 PM

Can we get our Cellar handles added to these shirts somehow?

02-14-2006, 05:04 PM	#1
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	Cellar moving again, outage pending The Cellar will be unavailable on Friday 2/17, from approx. 11am to approx. 2pm. At that time it will be on the fastest, bestest connection it has ever been on. It will also be more expensive than ever, but not the crazy price I would have to pay if I stayed with the current provider (Netreach/neonetix/nntx). It is not unfair google fodder to say that Neonetix seriously lost it with their business plan. The evidence is here, for those geeky/interested: http://www.nntx.net/Services/CoLocation.asp This page describes the pricing for placing a server in Netreach/neonetics server room. The key figure is "Throughput (monthly max)". You notice that, at the $150 "enhanced" rate, the maximum throughput you can get is "30Gb". The lower-case b, it turns out, is important. It indicates that your maximum throughput is 30 gigabits. The problem here is that every other provider on the net lists that figure in gigaBYTES. If you've taken CompSci 101 you might recall that there are 8 bits in a byte. It's a little worse than that, because the traffic that's measured in bits includes bits dedicated to controlling the protocol. So let's say the difference between a GB and a Gb is ten-fold. Therefore, by making that b lower-case, Netreach/neonetix set its monthly limits at a point where the Cellar, at the $150/month package, reached the limit in 2 days. 20 days would not have surprised me. But if a simple forum maxes your "enhanced" package out in 2 days, your business plan is hosed. Now look at the "additional bandwidth" pricing at the bottom of the page. They insisted that the $595 price for 1.5mb/sec is their price for unmetered bandwidth, not affected by the monthly max. So the actual retail price to me, for three servers, would be $775/month. The competition offered me $389/month for three servers at 10mb/sec unmetered. Again, either $775 for 1.5mb/sec unmetered, or $389 for 10mb/sec unmetered.

02-14-2006, 05:25 PM	#2
Griff still says videotape Join Date: Feb 2001 Posts: 26,813	Speaking of slacking off, I need to hit the tip jar... advising others to to likewise. thanks Tony. __________________ If you would only recognize that life is hard, things would be so much easier for you. - Louis D. Brandeis

02-14-2006, 05:28 PM	#3
BigV Goon Squad Leader Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Seattle Posts: 27,063	Your last sentence make clear which is the better choice. qq: $389/month PER server for three servers? or for all three servers (or however many servers you have...)? or 129/server/month? Also, in my experience, the "unmetered" tagline is, shall we say, fuzzy. They may actually not meter it. They may meter it and don't quanitfy / charge for it. But I'm certain that if your resources are a large load on their systems then you will get a call and a renegotiation will commence. I would say that your first defense is a thorough reading of the contract. You have demonstrated your skill at this. But a high speed connection like that (10Mb/sec, pretty good) which is better than I could find in a short local search, may be too good to be true too. __________________ Be Just and Fear Not.

02-14-2006, 05:38 PM	#5
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	Check's in the mail. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

02-14-2006, 05:40 PM	#6
Griff still says videotape Join Date: Feb 2001 Posts: 26,813	So two sailors a Pole and a Chech are swept off the deck of their whaler...you know the rest. __________________ If you would only recognize that life is hard, things would be so much easier for you. - Louis D. Brandeis

02-14-2006, 05:33 PM	#4
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	I should say that a good portion of that monthly nut will come from my two other clients, so not all of that 389 will come out of the Cellar funds... probably 159. Tip jar hits are appreciated nonetheless

02-14-2006, 05:46 PM	#7
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	$389 for all 3, BigV. I might also note that similar services are available at different rates all over the net. For example, you can go to 1and1.com, click on "root server" and see they will sell you 1000GB of transfer per month PLUS THE SERVER for $99/month. (Unfortunately the server is only 40 GB hard drive...) Or burst.net, click on colocation and there's 2000GB/month for $109.95 or 10mb/sec unlimited for $329.95. Or if I was really serious I might go here and get an entire half-rack with 2mb/sec for the same price as neonetix. Then I would be right at the peering hub of a lot of major providers. Fuck, it hardly even pays to understand all this shit when someone can screw you over by making their b lower-case.

02-14-2006, 06:14 PM	#8
lumberjim I can hear my ears Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 25,571	this thread brought to you by the letter "b" __________________ This body holding me reminds me of my own mortality Embrace this moment, remember We are eternal, all this pain is an illusion ~MJKeenan

02-14-2006, 06:22 PM	#10
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	Bake sale? No seriously I bet there are T-shirt places on the web that are better than cafepress and let you submit designs.

02-14-2006, 07:08 PM	#11
lumberjim I can hear my ears Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 25,571	custom ink dot com. http://www.customink.com/cink/r.jsp?...e/retrieve.jsp retirieve saved designs use email address :jhelm3ATdejazzd.com __________________ This body holding me reminds me of my own mortality Embrace this moment, remember We are eternal, all this pain is an illusion ~MJKeenan

02-14-2006, 07:53 PM	#12
zippyt LONG LIVE KING ZIPPY! per Feetz Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Arkansas Posts: 7,661	I'm in for a fund raiser __________________ "Success is getting what you want. Happiness is wanting what you get. " Brother Dave Gardner

02-15-2006, 12:55 AM	#14
wolf lobber of scimitars Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Phila Burbs Posts: 20,774	Very cool shirts. Especially since they can do them in black. The blue glass coffee mug is more than classy. I would need several. I fear breakage. __________________ wolf eht htiw og "Conspiracies are the norm, not the exception." --G. Edward Griffin The Creature from Jekyll Island High Priestess of the Church of the Whale Penis

02-15-2006, 12:52 PM	#15
Elspode When Do I Get Virtual Unreality? Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Raytown, Missouri Posts: 12,719	Can we get our Cellar handles added to these shirts somehow? __________________ "To those of you who are wearing ties, I think my dad would appreciate it if you took them off." - Robert Moog

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