Illinois drops death penalty

Pete Zicato · 03-10-2011, 09:01 AM

I am strongly ambivalent.

Spexxvet · 03-10-2011, 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete Zicato

I am strongly ambivalent.

I agree half-heartedly

Sundae · 03-10-2011, 02:11 PM

I will be watching closely.
Let's see those crimes escalate WAY out of control.
Because the Death Penalty is all about reducing crime.

My Dad will be horrified that one of the only Western Civilisations to still kill its criminals is turning its back on capital punishment state by state. I'll tell him tomorrow, put him off his Branflakes.
Maybe it's time he converted to Islam. Because everyone knows about the zero crime rate in Muslim countries... Although they see it as divinely accorded punishment, rather than justice. Sheesh - it seems you can't win either way.

footfootfoot · 03-10-2011, 03:16 PM

The death penalty is about revenge and the big payback. The idea that it is a deterrent was promulgated by folks who didn't want to seem barbaric and engaging in the same behavior as those whom they were killing. It's the old "This is hurting me more than it's hurting you" rationale.

plthijinx · 03-10-2011, 03:16 PM

it may be about reducing crime, but, and i speak from experience, being locked up for life is way worse than the death penalty. when someone commits a heinous crime worthy of the death penalty then make sure they get life. am i for the death penalty? in a way yes and no. sitting in solitary waiting for your day on the bed is one thing...but being locked up until the day you naturally die is another. it is a seemly endless wait. now i had a friend that only had a 4 year sentence but he died after i left south texas. his sentence turned into a life sentence. he had 6 months left to go to freedom. but thanks to tdcj and their exquisite medical staff he had a ruptured appendix and died from it. they sent him back to his dorm knowing something was wrong. i'm getting off key here but yeah, do away with the death penalty. it;s cheaper for the state and longer for the inmate. being locked up sucks balls.

footfootfoot · 03-10-2011, 03:19 PM

Despite having never been in prison (except visiting) I agree with you. I'd rather have the chair than spend life behind bars.

Happy Monkey · 03-10-2011, 03:42 PM

If they're guilty, I don't really care which they'd prefer.

If they're innocent, then any day they're not killed is a day they may be able to prove it.

plthijinx · 03-10-2011, 04:38 PM

and that is another reason to abolish the death penalty. the DA's do get it wrong sometimes. but yet they produce a conviction when it wasn;t warranted because they acted out and convinced a jury that they were right and the defense was wrong. fucking lawyers. there is no justice for the innocent when the prosecution is dead fast on convicting someone. they only care about their freakin resumes. not whether the defense is innocent or not. political gain. they don;t give a rats ass. i;m getting very pissed. i digress. and am stepping away from this thread. there is not one thing that any of you could say to change my mind on this one.

plthijinx · 03-10-2011, 04:39 PM

oh what i meant was this....if someone has a life sentence and then gets exonerated then at least they are alive to gain freedom. kinda sucks if you get exonerated after you have been slaughtered. which happens.

BrianR · 03-11-2011, 11:54 AM

What he just said.

Spexxvet · 03-11-2011, 12:01 PM

I've heard that it is more expensive to the taxpayers to execute a prisoner, than to incarcerate one for life.

Shawnee123 · 03-11-2011, 12:56 PM

Well duh!

Urbane Guerrilla · 03-11-2011, 04:58 PM

Spexx, Shawnee: that is because of the care we take over it. It is not inherently expensive to kill somebody.

How much does a single Kalashnikov round cost the Red Chinese? That's their standard execution method.

Having a death penalty, however carefully implemented, is a sign that you are prepared to resist evil to the ultimate degree. Is this somehow not how evil should be resisted? Illinois dropped the ball.

Fair&Balanced · 03-11-2011, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urbane Guerrilla

Spexx, Shawnee: that is because of the care we take over it. It is not inherently expensive to kill somebody.
...

Despite that care, Illinois was found to have wrongfully convicted 15 people.

That wrong can be corrected if those convicted were given life in prison. Not so easy to correct after being put to death.

Urbane Guerrilla · 03-11-2011, 07:28 PM

Agreed. It is not. And is that sufficient reason to limit the vigor with which the good shall resist the evil? I don't see it that way -- I don't much care for decadence, and I see no reason to place arbitrary limits on damage control. There are some lives over which death adds up to improvement. We should not fail to understand this. I certainly don't, but I don't know what kind of thinking motivates the opposition. Moral cowardice, maybe. Makes you duck my central question with every fiber of your being. I'd be ashamed to do that.

03-10-2011, 09:01 AM	#1
Pete Zicato Turns out my CRS is a symptom of TMB. Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Chicago suburbs Posts: 2,916	Illinois drops death penalty I am strongly ambivalent. __________________ Talk nerdy to me.

03-10-2011, 03:16 PM	#4
footfootfoot To shreds, you say? Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: in the house and on the street-how many, many feet we meet! Posts: 18,449	The death penalty is about revenge and the big payback. The idea that it is a deterrent was promulgated by folks who didn't want to seem barbaric and engaging in the same behavior as those whom they were killing. It's the old "This is hurting me more than it's hurting you" rationale. __________________ The internet is a hateful stew of vomit you can never take completely seriously. - Her Fobs

03-10-2011, 03:16 PM	#5
plthijinx Master Dwellar Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 4,197	it may be about reducing crime, but, and i speak from experience, being locked up for life is way worse than the death penalty. when someone commits a heinous crime worthy of the death penalty then make sure they get life. am i for the death penalty? in a way yes and no. sitting in solitary waiting for your day on the bed is one thing...but being locked up until the day you naturally die is another. it is a seemly endless wait. now i had a friend that only had a 4 year sentence but he died after i left south texas. his sentence turned into a life sentence. he had 6 months left to go to freedom. but thanks to tdcj and their exquisite medical staff he had a ruptured appendix and died from it. they sent him back to his dorm knowing something was wrong. i'm getting off key here but yeah, do away with the death penalty. it;s cheaper for the state and longer for the inmate. being locked up sucks balls. __________________ For your dreams to come true, you must first have a dream.

03-10-2011, 03:19 PM	#6
footfootfoot To shreds, you say? Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: in the house and on the street-how many, many feet we meet! Posts: 18,449	Despite having never been in prison (except visiting) I agree with you. I'd rather have the chair than spend life behind bars. __________________ The internet is a hateful stew of vomit you can never take completely seriously. - Her Fobs

03-10-2011, 03:42 PM	#7
Happy Monkey I think this line's mostly filler. Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: DC Posts: 13,575	If they're guilty, I don't really care which they'd prefer. If they're innocent, then any day they're not killed is a day they may be able to prove it. __________________ _________________ \|...............\| We live in the nick of times. \| Len 17, Wid 3 \| \|_______________\| [pics]

03-10-2011, 02:11 PM	#3
Sundae polaroid of perfection Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 24,185	I will be watching closely. Let's see those crimes escalate WAY out of control. Because the Death Penalty is all about reducing crime. My Dad will be horrified that one of the only Western Civilisations to still kill its criminals is turning its back on capital punishment state by state. I'll tell him tomorrow, put him off his Branflakes. Maybe it's time he converted to Islam. Because everyone knows about the zero crime rate in Muslim countries... Although they see it as divinely accorded punishment, rather than justice. Sheesh - it seems you can't win either way.

03-10-2011, 04:38 PM	#8
plthijinx Master Dwellar Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 4,197	and that is another reason to abolish the death penalty. the DA's do get it wrong sometimes. but yet they produce a conviction when it wasn;t warranted because they acted out and convinced a jury that they were right and the defense was wrong. fucking lawyers. there is no justice for the innocent when the prosecution is dead fast on convicting someone. they only care about their freakin resumes. not whether the defense is innocent or not. political gain. they don;t give a rats ass. i;m getting very pissed. i digress. and am stepping away from this thread. there is not one thing that any of you could say to change my mind on this one. __________________ For your dreams to come true, you must first have a dream.

03-10-2011, 04:39 PM	#9
plthijinx Master Dwellar Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 4,197	oh what i meant was this....if someone has a life sentence and then gets exonerated then at least they are alive to gain freedom. kinda sucks if you get exonerated after you have been slaughtered. which happens. __________________ For your dreams to come true, you must first have a dream.

03-11-2011, 11:54 AM	#10
BrianR Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 3,338	What he just said. __________________ Never be afraid to tell the world who you are. -- Anonymous

03-11-2011, 12:01 PM	#11
Spexxvet Makes some feel uncomfortable Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 10,346	I've heard that it is more expensive to the taxpayers to execute a prisoner, than to incarcerate one for life. __________________ "I'm certainly free, nay compelled, to spread the gospel of Spex. " - xoxoxoBruce Last edited by Spexxvet; 03-11-2011 at 01:59 PM.

03-11-2011, 12:56 PM	#12
Shawnee123 Why, you're a regular Alfred E Einstein, ain't ya? Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 21,206	Well duh! __________________ A word to the wise ain't necessary - it's the stupid ones who need the advice. --Bill Cosby

03-11-2011, 04:58 PM	#13
Urbane Guerrilla Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Southern California Posts: 6,674	Spexx, Shawnee: that is because of the care we take over it. It is not inherently expensive to kill somebody. How much does a single Kalashnikov round cost the Red Chinese? That's their standard execution method. Having a death penalty, however carefully implemented, is a sign that you are prepared to resist evil to the ultimate degree. Is this somehow not how evil should be resisted? Illinois dropped the ball. __________________ Wanna stop school shootings? End Gun-Free Zones, of course.

03-11-2011, 07:28 PM	#15
Urbane Guerrilla Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Southern California Posts: 6,674	Agreed. It is not. And is that sufficient reason to limit the vigor with which the good shall resist the evil? I don't see it that way -- I don't much care for decadence, and I see no reason to place arbitrary limits on damage control. There are some lives over which death adds up to improvement. We should not fail to understand this. I certainly don't, but I don't know what kind of thinking motivates the opposition. Moral cowardice, maybe. Makes you duck my central question with every fiber of your being. I'd be ashamed to do that. __________________ Wanna stop school shootings? End Gun-Free Zones, of course.

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