New Camera, Dream

busterb · 10-14-2006, 07:23 PM

Thinking about a new camera. One w/a faster shutter speed. I don't make many photos, but when I try sometimes I get shakes.
Am looking at these.
Canon PowerShot A710 IS
PowerShot S3 IS
KODAK EasyShare P850 Zoom 5.1 Megapixel Digital Camera.
Any ideas about these?
I have an old Fuji? 2 megpix and my cards won't fit any on these. So maybe I can give it away. Thanks BB

SteveDallas · 10-14-2006, 07:31 PM

Don't know anything specific about those cameras (dpreview.com is good), but fast shutter speed alone won't do it. I mean that'll stop the motion, but then maybe you won't have enough light. So also look at the light sensitivity (ISO) setting. Though a high sensitivity often gives "noise" so there's a tradeoff. Some cameras are now offering image stablilization. I don't know how well it works.

Undertoad · 10-14-2006, 07:43 PM

I have an image stabilization camera, the Panasonic Lumix. I strongly recommend it, not just for people with shaky hands, but for everyone! The Canon cameras marked "IS" have it. The Kodak doesn't, I think.

With the Panasonic, you can literally jump up and down while shooting and still get a clear image. The only way it doesn't work is with a long optical zoom.

So I can recommend adding any of the Lumix family. The one I have is the DMC-FZ7. It is not the most compact camera in the family, but does have 10x optical zoom. Not everyone really needs that kind of zoom, and I think 3-4x is a long enough zoom for practical purposes.

busterb · 10-14-2006, 08:17 PM

Toad thanks. I see 2 the DMC-FZ7K and DMC-FZ7S. I'll add them to my list.

Bullitt · 10-14-2006, 08:18 PM

I second everything you just said UT (and I have the same camera too!). Three basic things about digital cameras: shutter speed, aperture, and ISO. The right combination of all three of these will produce the image you want. We'll start with ISO:
ISO: the sensitivity rating of film, applied to the image sensor of digital cameras. Basically, the ISO rating shows how sensitive the camera's sensor is to light. The higher the ISO, the more sensative the senor is to the light soming in through the lens. The high the ISO however, the more noise there will be in an image. And likewise, the lower rating used the less noise there will be. This isn't noise as in how loud the camera is, this is the grain so to speak of the image. Basically, the more noise, the crappier image (with few exceptions, depending upon the kind of shot you are going for). Noise is also determined by the physical size of the image sensor. The cool camera with wow 10mp and it fits in your jeans pocket is great and all.. but cramming all the information from 10 million pixels onto a tiny sensor will result in more noise.
Shutter speed: Simple one here, how fast the cameras shutter is when actuated. A longer (bigger number) shutter speed, the more light that is allowed into the camera, and thus a brighter image. However, with slower shutter speeds needed for low light situations, you will get blurry images if you don't use a tripod.
Aperture: Basically how big the hole in the camera is that allows light onto the sensor. This also determines focusing distance. A lower aperture (2.8 is the most common lowest one), will allow more light into the camera, but will also have less of the image in focus (closer stuff will be, further stuff will not). The higher the aperture, the smaller the hole will be pretty much, but more of the image will be in focus (landscape photography for example).

Extras: Image stabilization, zoom, noise reduction
IS: two different types: in camera and in the lens. In lens IS is the best, the camera senses hand movement and makes minute immediate adjustments to the lenses in order to keep the light coming into the sensor stationary. When light hits the sensor, it basically draws the image on there. When you use a slow shutter speed, the light comes in for longer and thus the sharpness of the image is at the mercy of any movement at all of the camera.
Zoom: long zoom is great.. for outdoors. The longer you have your zoom out, the higher your lowest available aperture is. Also, it is much harder to keep the image steady when your zoom is out at all, thus making shooting in low light situations with your zoom difficult.
Noise reduction: Seems like a God-send right.. not exactly. Noise reduction will indeed eliminate the appearance of noise on your image, however it comes at a price. The more noise reduction used, the less detail you will have in your images. So cropping an image significantly becomes a problem at this point because even though there will be less grainy look to the image, you will have traded that for less detail, making crops not as sharp as the full origional image.

short conclusion: IS in the lens is great (the Panasonic models.. I dont know who else has it), but it cannot substitute for a tripod, but tripods will not be good for every situations you might find yourself in.

and this concludes the longest post i have ever made in this forum.. any questions feel free to ask, or make clarifications or whatever. I'm not a pro by any means, nor do I know everything (and dont mean to act like i do), but hopefully this will help out.

10-14-2006, 08:49 PM

I have that Kodak, ask away if you have any questions. I could not be happier with it. With my disability I am not steady at all and it helps me out more than I thought it ever would.

rock9995 · 10-14-2006, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bullitt

and this concludes the longest post i have ever made in this forum.

Well said Bullitt. Good overview for sure.

Buster you may want to consider the Canon as it is the only one that uses OPTICAL image stabilization (using a "floating" lens connected to a gyroscope) as opposed to the electronic I/S of the other cameras, including the new Nikons (which are called also "anti-shake" which do the deal electronically). Canon has been in the optical I/S business since it's highly successful line of stabilized binoculars several years back which means that you can birdwatch or look at stars or ball games, etc., with much higher magnification without all the unsteadiness. Always go Optical I/S, although they tend to be a little more costly.

Elspode · 10-15-2006, 12:05 AM

Buster, don't forget about monopods. They come in real handy for stabilizing the camera when shooting. I don't have shaky hands, but I still get better pics since I bought one.

Bullitt · 10-15-2006, 04:40 AM

Good one Elspode I forgot about those. Little tricks like controlling and timing your breathing, leaning your shoulder against a post, tucking your arms in, using your view finder instead of holding the camera out in front of you, and a host of other things can also help you steady your camera while shooting in those tough lighting situations.
I took some pictures at our homecoming dance tonight and the IS really helped out alot.. it is a feature that is very nice to have without a doubt. Also, I will vouch for Canon cameras heavily (they really do make quality products), however if you like the S3-IS but want a lower cost alternative (that comes with a lens hood!) check out the DMC-FZ7 that UT and I have.

busterb · 10-18-2006, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elspode

Buster, don't forget about monopods. They come in real handy for stabilizing the camera when shooting. I don't have shaky hands, but I still get better pics since I bought one.

I have one I made to use w/camcorder for "Shine" I ordered one yesterday, a Trailblazer Monopod.

glatt · 11-17-2006, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undertoad

I have an image stabilization camera, the Panasonic Lumix. I strongly recommend it, not just for people with shaky hands, but for everyone! The Canon cameras marked "IS" have it. The Kodak doesn't, I think.

With the Panasonic, you can literally jump up and down while shooting and still get a clear image. The only way it doesn't work is with a long optical zoom.

So I can recommend adding any of the Lumix family. The one I have is the DMC-FZ7. It is not the most compact camera in the family, but does have 10x optical zoom. Not everyone really needs that kind of zoom, and I think 3-4x is a long enough zoom for practical purposes.

Hey Undertoad, I'm thinking about taking the plunge and getting a new camera. My trusty old Coolpix 950 is showing its age. My knowledge of digital cameras is about 7-8 years out of date, so maybe this is a dumb question, but how's the battery management of the Lumix? I'm used to a having a couple of sets of rechargable AAs ready to go when they are eaten by the hungry Coolpix. What's the setup with the Lumix? Do you carry extras with you, or do you have to find a place to plug the camera in? In everyday use, are batteries ever a problem?

I've gotten used to things like 3-4 seconds of shutter lag and batteries being eaten like candy, so I don't really know what is standard in cameras today. I know I want a camera with about 5-6 megapixels, image stabilization, great quality images, less than a second of shutter lag, and a nice zoom lens. Good close-ups would be nice, and my pipe dream would be to have a swivel body like the Coolpix. Nobody makes swivel bodies any more, which is crazy, since they just make sense.

zippyt · 10-15-2006, 09:41 AM

so the camera is screwed in , inside the 2 handels , How does that help ???

busterb · 10-15-2006, 10:40 AM

More to hold on to.

richlevy · 10-15-2006, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by busterb

More to hold on to.

Also a good reason to date fat women.

busterb · 10-15-2006, 02:15 PM

The PowerShot S3 IS made the cut, $342.36 from Dell. Now I need help with the cards. It uses SD/Multimedia Memory Cards. So which is best, and are the new faster cards better? Steve's has a primer on cards,
http://www.steves-digicams.com/flash_memory.html But I haven't read all yet.

10-14-2006, 07:23 PM	#1
busterb NSABFD Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: MS. usa Posts: 3,908	New Camera, Dream Thinking about a new camera. One w/a faster shutter speed. I don't make many photos, but when I try sometimes I get shakes. Am looking at these. Canon PowerShot A710 IS PowerShot S3 IS KODAK EasyShare P850 Zoom 5.1 Megapixel Digital Camera. Any ideas about these? I have an old Fuji? 2 megpix and my cards won't fit any on these. So maybe I can give it away. Thanks BB __________________ I've haven't left very deep footprints in the sands of time. But, boy I've left a bunch.

10-14-2006, 08:17 PM	#4
busterb NSABFD Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: MS. usa Posts: 3,908	Toad thanks. I see 2 the DMC-FZ7K and DMC-FZ7S. I'll add them to my list. __________________ I've haven't left very deep footprints in the sands of time. But, boy I've left a bunch.

10-14-2006, 08:18 PM	#5
Bullitt This is a fully functional babe lair Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Akron, OH Posts: 2,324	I second everything you just said UT (and I have the same camera too!). Three basic things about digital cameras: shutter speed, aperture, and ISO. The right combination of all three of these will produce the image you want. We'll start with ISO: ISO: the sensitivity rating of film, applied to the image sensor of digital cameras. Basically, the ISO rating shows how sensitive the camera's sensor is to light. The higher the ISO, the more sensative the senor is to the light soming in through the lens. The high the ISO however, the more noise there will be in an image. And likewise, the lower rating used the less noise there will be. This isn't noise as in how loud the camera is, this is the grain so to speak of the image. Basically, the more noise, the crappier image (with few exceptions, depending upon the kind of shot you are going for). Noise is also determined by the physical size of the image sensor. The cool camera with wow 10mp and it fits in your jeans pocket is great and all.. but cramming all the information from 10 million pixels onto a tiny sensor will result in more noise. Shutter speed: Simple one here, how fast the cameras shutter is when actuated. A longer (bigger number) shutter speed, the more light that is allowed into the camera, and thus a brighter image. However, with slower shutter speeds needed for low light situations, you will get blurry images if you don't use a tripod. Aperture: Basically how big the hole in the camera is that allows light onto the sensor. This also determines focusing distance. A lower aperture (2.8 is the most common lowest one), will allow more light into the camera, but will also have less of the image in focus (closer stuff will be, further stuff will not). The higher the aperture, the smaller the hole will be pretty much, but more of the image will be in focus (landscape photography for example). Extras: Image stabilization, zoom, noise reduction IS: two different types: in camera and in the lens. In lens IS is the best, the camera senses hand movement and makes minute immediate adjustments to the lenses in order to keep the light coming into the sensor stationary. When light hits the sensor, it basically draws the image on there. When you use a slow shutter speed, the light comes in for longer and thus the sharpness of the image is at the mercy of any movement at all of the camera. Zoom: long zoom is great.. for outdoors. The longer you have your zoom out, the higher your lowest available aperture is. Also, it is much harder to keep the image steady when your zoom is out at all, thus making shooting in low light situations with your zoom difficult. Noise reduction: Seems like a God-send right.. not exactly. Noise reduction will indeed eliminate the appearance of noise on your image, however it comes at a price. The more noise reduction used, the less detail you will have in your images. So cropping an image significantly becomes a problem at this point because even though there will be less grainy look to the image, you will have traded that for less detail, making crops not as sharp as the full origional image. short conclusion: IS in the lens is great (the Panasonic models.. I dont know who else has it), but it cannot substitute for a tripod, but tripods will not be good for every situations you might find yourself in. and this concludes the longest post i have ever made in this forum.. any questions feel free to ask, or make clarifications or whatever. I'm not a pro by any means, nor do I know everything (and dont mean to act like i do), but hopefully this will help out. __________________ Kiss my white Irish ass. Last edited by Bullitt; 10-14-2006 at 08:23 PM.

10-15-2006, 12:05 AM	#8
Elspode When Do I Get Virtual Unreality? Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Raytown, Missouri Posts: 12,719	Buster, don't forget about monopods. They come in real handy for stabilizing the camera when shooting. I don't have shaky hands, but I still get better pics since I bought one. __________________ "To those of you who are wearing ties, I think my dad would appreciate it if you took them off." - Robert Moog

10-15-2006, 04:40 AM	#9
Bullitt This is a fully functional babe lair Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Akron, OH Posts: 2,324	Good one Elspode I forgot about those. Little tricks like controlling and timing your breathing, leaning your shoulder against a post, tucking your arms in, using your view finder instead of holding the camera out in front of you, and a host of other things can also help you steady your camera while shooting in those tough lighting situations. I took some pictures at our homecoming dance tonight and the IS really helped out alot.. it is a feature that is very nice to have without a doubt. Also, I will vouch for Canon cameras heavily (they really do make quality products), however if you like the S3-IS but want a lower cost alternative (that comes with a lens hood!) check out the DMC-FZ7 that UT and I have. __________________ Kiss my white Irish ass.

10-14-2006, 07:31 PM	#2
SteveDallas Your Bartender Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Philly Burbs, PA Posts: 7,651	Don't know anything specific about those cameras (dpreview.com is good), but fast shutter speed alone won't do it. I mean that'll stop the motion, but then maybe you won't have enough light. So also look at the light sensitivity (ISO) setting. Though a high sensitivity often gives "noise" so there's a tradeoff. Some cameras are now offering image stablilization. I don't know how well it works.

10-14-2006, 07:43 PM	#3
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	I have an image stabilization camera, the Panasonic Lumix. I strongly recommend it, not just for people with shaky hands, but for everyone! The Canon cameras marked "IS" have it. The Kodak doesn't, I think. With the Panasonic, you can literally jump up and down while shooting and still get a clear image. The only way it doesn't work is with a long optical zoom. So I can recommend adding any of the Lumix family. The one I have is the DMC-FZ7. It is not the most compact camera in the family, but does have 10x optical zoom. Not everyone really needs that kind of zoom, and I think 3-4x is a long enough zoom for practical purposes.

10-14-2006, 08:49 PM	#6
rkzenrage Guest Posts: n/a	I have that Kodak, ask away if you have any questions. I could not be happier with it. With my disability I am not steady at all and it helps me out more than I thought it ever would.

10-15-2006, 09:41 AM	#12
zippyt LONG LIVE KING ZIPPY! per Feetz Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Arkansas Posts: 7,661	so the camera is screwed in , inside the 2 handels , How does that help ??? __________________ "Success is getting what you want. Happiness is wanting what you get. " Brother Dave Gardner

10-15-2006, 10:40 AM	#13
busterb NSABFD Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: MS. usa Posts: 3,908	More to hold on to. __________________ I've haven't left very deep footprints in the sands of time. But, boy I've left a bunch.

10-15-2006, 02:15 PM	#15
busterb NSABFD Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: MS. usa Posts: 3,908	The PowerShot S3 IS made the cut, $342.36 from Dell. Now I need help with the cards. It uses SD/Multimedia Memory Cards. So which is best, and are the new faster cards better? Steve's has a primer on cards, http://www.steves-digicams.com/flash_memory.html But I haven't read all yet. __________________ I've haven't left very deep footprints in the sands of time. But, boy I've left a bunch.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)