Valid Point

rob4963 · 06-30-2006, 07:16 PM

We Are All Forrest Gumps
Karen Kwiatkowski | June 30 2006

Americans are feeling uncomfortable. There is strangeness in the air and we don’t fully understand what is happening. We see things that make no sense, and we wonder, "Am I part of this, or not?" Whether one answers "Yes" or "No," the implications are distinctly terrifying.

A good citizen, we are told, supports the war in Iraq. That this occupation is not a "war," that it is based on Washington, D.C.–generated lies, that it is a permanent part of a still secret and regional strategic agenda, and that it effectively creates terrorists instead of killing them is irrelevant. To be a good citizen, you must support the war in Iraq.

A good citizen does not criticize his President, a.k.a. his or her "commander in chief." It is easy to be confused. We are told that 300 million citizens and 30 million more living in the United States are the same as the 1.4 million on military active duty, who acknowledge the President as a commander in chief during, and only during, times of war. We are told that a selective permanent military occupation of an oil rich state equates to just war. We are told that the First Amendment to the Constitution really doesn’t mean what it says in black and white, much like the rest of the Bill of Rights.

Yet, only moments earlier we were told that the freedom from government interference outlined in the Bill of Rights is sacrosanct, and worth an eternal and global fight to the death.

A good citizen is not a criminal – yet we live in a modern American where one is a criminal if one does not wear a state-mandated seatbelt, if one enters a public building without the appropriate citizen’s identification, if one smokes a cigarette on the wrong sidewalk, if one does not remove clothing as demanded by the Department of Homeland security prior to a commercial plane ride for which one has not only privately purchased, but paid a smorgasbord of additional fees to cover the costs imposed by these same Homeland Security regulations. One must disclose all of one’s activities to the state, in advance if possible. The state must never be placed at risk by the checks we write, the things we buy, the letters we send, the phone calls we make, places we go, the friends we hold dear, the words we say, the ideas we consider.

My local paper, the Shenandoah Valley Herald, ran a front-page article yesterday about a truck driver who was tasered to death less than ten miles from my house on June 20th because he would not submit satisfactorily to the local police queries. He was pepper sprayed, then tasered multiple times until he expired. I don’t know what crimes he committed, but I suspect they will be recorded as many and most serious.

Jon Stewart captured the insanity of the American state in this four-minute clip, where Stewart conducts a Forrest Gump style assessment of the latest FBI and Department of Justice anti-terrorist operation against the notorious Miami Seven. It is absolutely hilarious, as if made for comedy. It stars Attorney General Alberto Gonzales, and his two best men, all playing themselves.

We need to take Forrest Gump in America to a whole new level. Instead of being entertained by Gumpian common sense and wide-eyed amazement, as we are with The Daily Show, every good American ought to aspire to achieve a certain level of personal Gumpism.

Public critics of government excess – in any era – tend to be the educated, the economically and historically sophisticated, the articulate, the intellectually curious, and the morally or religiously devout.

It is always good to criticize governments, starting most vociferously with your own. But Forrest Gump was not educated, articulate, or religiously devout.

Public supporters of government excess, top-down mandates for law and order, moral majorities and central-planning state-allocators of global resources, are not Gumpian either. These flocks are Gump’s immediate enemies. When Forrest is running, it is from this angry, obsessed, jealous prole-mass, whether they are attempting to beat him into submission, punish him for crimes uncommitted, or keep him caged by low expectations.

Forrest Gumps are the living, breathing nemeses of fascism, gang mentalities, and chic utilitarianism. Gumps among us may not speak the whole truth, and they may understand little of what intellectuals and know-it-alls say about "how the world works." But the Forrests of the world trust their gut, and they prefer to believe their real mothers, not their would-be nannies. Forrest Gumps know that stupid is as stupid does.

Gumps believe in hard evidence, and they observe this evidence wherever it rests, without fear. Gumps are not dismayed when those doing stupid things appear powerful, respected and are well-dressed. They are blissfully ignorant of the idea that the wealthy and politically connected have power over the smallest detail of a man’s life. Forrest Gumps, childlike and innocent, will openly observe that the emperor is stark naked, and by extension, powerless over his betters.

With today’s state-loving blowhards busy blowing with all their might, we might consider a third way. The proper response may not be, as in the Three Little Pigs, to build a stronger house. It may be simply be to walk out the back door, change the dynamic, shift the power perspective in our own worldview. It is asymmetric warfare of the finest kind.

Gump’s fictional story is nothing more than a single life lived honestly, damn the consequences. This way of life is remarkably self-centered – yet as the Winston Groom novel shows, this type of life tends to be more influential than the lives of flocks and flocks of those who look to others to know what to think, what to do, and how to behave.

It is good to enjoy Gumpism for its inspirational and entertainment value, but we should go further. We ought to cultivate Gumpian perspectives of American politics, and adopt a Gump-inspired lifestyle in the heart of an increasingly vicious and amoral state.

xoxoxoBruce · 06-30-2006, 08:36 PM

I can't help believing that in our world, the post 9-11 world, Forest Gump would have been jailed or institutionalized rather quickly.

wolf · 07-01-2006, 02:02 AM

rob4963 ... your point in posting other people's copyrighted work in it's entirety with no commentary of your own is??

Beestie · 07-01-2006, 03:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolf

rob4963 ... your point in posting other people's copyrighted work in it's entirety with no commentary of your own is??

that he'll leave his thinking to others. I suppose that's where we come in.

rob4963 · 07-01-2006, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beestie

that he'll leave his thinking to others. I suppose that's where we come in.

I agree with Ms. Kwiatkowski. Her article has captured my attention as well as my sentiments on the on going cursory actions taken by the American public that had been whitewashed by the government surrounding the current events post 9/11.. i.e. the war, terrorist, illegal aliens and terrorism as well as the astounding way our liberties have been interrupted by the abstrusely aforementioned absurdity surrounding politics and the views of most in todays society.

Griff · 07-02-2006, 02:19 PM

She is almost always right. The preferred Cellar method of starting a discussion about it would be a short quote, an explanation of your thoughts, and a link to the article. Usually folks won't read a long article by someone the disagree with unless somebody uses it to back-up their own ideas. Welcome to the Cellar.

rob4963 · 07-02-2006, 04:45 PM

I was just testing the water so to speak.. posting an article like this or even starting a topic as such has brought nothing but accusations of being an UN-grateful, murderous, UN-patriotic American traitor in the past. Thanks for the tip and the welcome Griff.

Undertoad · 07-02-2006, 06:57 PM

This essay doesn't say very much, and what it does say, it says poorly. The Gump analogy strikes me as utterly, utterly ridiculous.

Quote:

My local paper, the Shenandoah Valley Herald, ran a front-page article yesterday about a truck driver who was tasered to death less than ten miles from my house on June 20th because he would not submit satisfactorily to the local police queries. He was pepper sprayed, then tasered multiple times until he expired. I don’t know what crimes he committed, but I suspect they will be recorded as many and most serious.

I was particularly struck by how this paragraph has nothing to do with the whole thing. I went and looked up the incident.

http://www.dailynews-record.com/svh_...D=5051&CHID=43

A pickup truck rolls down an embankment and into a person's back yard at 10:30 at night. The home owner goes and checks on the driver, who is not hurt, but is "incoherent". He calls the cops. When the cop arrives, the driver attacks the cop, and it takes the cop plus three non-cops to hold the driver down even after pepper spraying. Other cops arrive and try to control the guy with tasers. They hit him with the most powerful stuff they have, but he still resists. Finally he just suffers some sort of malady and slumps over and passes out. Emergency personnel fail to revive him and the guy dies at the hospital. Thirty people witnessed the tasering.

Karen Kwiatkowski read that same story and determined it was evidence of a libertarian crisis in her area.

She's clearly not very bright, is she?

wolf · 07-04-2006, 01:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undertoad

A pickup truck rolls down an embankment and into a person's back yard at 10:30 at night. The home owner goes and checks on the driver, who is not hurt, but is "incoherent". He calls the cops. When the cop arrives, the driver attacks the cop, and it takes the cop plus three non-cops to hold the driver down even after pepper spraying. Other cops arrive and try to control the guy with tasers. They hit him with the most powerful stuff they have, but he still resists. Finally he just suffers some sort of malady and slumps over and passes out. Emergency personnel fail to revive him and the guy dies at the hospital. Thirty people witnessed the tasering.

That happens like three times a week ... in my hospital lobby.

Okay, so the tasering thing only happened the one time, and we usually manage to allow people to die somewhere else ... but the rest of it, that's an average night.

Flint · 07-03-2006, 10:32 AM

I only made it half-way through the article, but I never did catch the Forrest Gump reference. In what way exactly are we all like Forrest Gump, and is that a good thing or a bad thing?

For example: was the tasered truck driver a Forrest Gump, or were the cops Forrest Gumps, or does reading about it make us a Forrest Gump, or is it something about our reaction to reading about it that makes us a Forrest Gump?

Oh, wait, I get it. I don't understand the article because I'm stupid.

You know it's good writing when you can't understand it (thus proving that the author is much smarter than you.)

Undertoad · 07-03-2006, 11:25 AM

I'm very smart, and I know it's bad writing when I can't understand it.

The best writers should be able to communicate with a large audience, even drummers.

Normally an analogy helps to get across a more complicated concept. In this case, it's used to muddy it.

skysidhe · 07-03-2006, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undertoad

I'm very smart, and I know it's bad writing when I can't understand it.

The best writers should be able to communicate with a large audience, even drummers.

Normally an analogy helps to get across a more complicated concept. In this case, it's used to muddy it.

She could have at least piggy backed the "life is like a box of chocolates" analogy but then she would have to explain how the ' you never know what your going to get' fits in.

I still want to know what personal gumpism means or not to be a gump while watching the daily show.

I don't like major condradictions in peoples thinking .

Flint · 07-03-2006, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undertoad

The best writers should be able to communicate with a large audience, even drummers.

Maybe she needed to use some SMILIES . . . ???

07-03-2006, 02:14 PM

Welcome to Dubya & Co's Empire & Police State. Get in line bitch.
American now means Cattle or Cop.

07-05-2006, 05:31 AM

I interpret the gist of this writer's Gump analogy to mean that if more citizens boldly acted on conscience and common sense (i.e. "Gumpism) rather than on other people's expectations, this country would be a better place. The writer implies that we don't just have to be entertained and amazed by "Gumpism" when we find it (e.g. The Daily Show); rather, we should practice it. Unfortunately, the writer could have communicated this message much more effectively in a music video by performing a song which states it much more eloquently: The Impossible Dream

The writer also states "The proper response may not be, as in the Three Little Pigs, to build a stronger house. It may be simply be to walk out the back door, change the dynamic, shift the power perspective in our own worldview. It is asymmetric warfare of the finest kind." This may be the worst analogy I've ever read. So the wolf runs around to the back of the house and eats the Three Little Pigs! Ironically, the last time I saw the term "asymmetric warfare" used it was by a Guantanamo Bay Commander who was characterizing the detainee suicides there. This writer seemed to be implying that our best course of action would be either emigration; or, capitulation!

I found the rest of the article to be mostly superficial and disingenuous.

06-30-2006, 07:16 PM	#1
rob4963 Non-Newbie Sort Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 6	Valid Point We Are All Forrest Gumps Karen Kwiatkowski \| June 30 2006 Americans are feeling uncomfortable. There is strangeness in the air and we don’t fully understand what is happening. We see things that make no sense, and we wonder, "Am I part of this, or not?" Whether one answers "Yes" or "No," the implications are distinctly terrifying. A good citizen, we are told, supports the war in Iraq. That this occupation is not a "war," that it is based on Washington, D.C.–generated lies, that it is a permanent part of a still secret and regional strategic agenda, and that it effectively creates terrorists instead of killing them is irrelevant. To be a good citizen, you must support the war in Iraq. A good citizen does not criticize his President, a.k.a. his or her "commander in chief." It is easy to be confused. We are told that 300 million citizens and 30 million more living in the United States are the same as the 1.4 million on military active duty, who acknowledge the President as a commander in chief during, and only during, times of war. We are told that a selective permanent military occupation of an oil rich state equates to just war. We are told that the First Amendment to the Constitution really doesn’t mean what it says in black and white, much like the rest of the Bill of Rights. Yet, only moments earlier we were told that the freedom from government interference outlined in the Bill of Rights is sacrosanct, and worth an eternal and global fight to the death. A good citizen is not a criminal – yet we live in a modern American where one is a criminal if one does not wear a state-mandated seatbelt, if one enters a public building without the appropriate citizen’s identification, if one smokes a cigarette on the wrong sidewalk, if one does not remove clothing as demanded by the Department of Homeland security prior to a commercial plane ride for which one has not only privately purchased, but paid a smorgasbord of additional fees to cover the costs imposed by these same Homeland Security regulations. One must disclose all of one’s activities to the state, in advance if possible. The state must never be placed at risk by the checks we write, the things we buy, the letters we send, the phone calls we make, places we go, the friends we hold dear, the words we say, the ideas we consider. My local paper, the Shenandoah Valley Herald, ran a front-page article yesterday about a truck driver who was tasered to death less than ten miles from my house on June 20th because he would not submit satisfactorily to the local police queries. He was pepper sprayed, then tasered multiple times until he expired. I don’t know what crimes he committed, but I suspect they will be recorded as many and most serious. Jon Stewart captured the insanity of the American state in this four-minute clip, where Stewart conducts a Forrest Gump style assessment of the latest FBI and Department of Justice anti-terrorist operation against the notorious Miami Seven. It is absolutely hilarious, as if made for comedy. It stars Attorney General Alberto Gonzales, and his two best men, all playing themselves. We need to take Forrest Gump in America to a whole new level. Instead of being entertained by Gumpian common sense and wide-eyed amazement, as we are with The Daily Show, every good American ought to aspire to achieve a certain level of personal Gumpism. Public critics of government excess – in any era – tend to be the educated, the economically and historically sophisticated, the articulate, the intellectually curious, and the morally or religiously devout. It is always good to criticize governments, starting most vociferously with your own. But Forrest Gump was not educated, articulate, or religiously devout. Public supporters of government excess, top-down mandates for law and order, moral majorities and central-planning state-allocators of global resources, are not Gumpian either. These flocks are Gump’s immediate enemies. When Forrest is running, it is from this angry, obsessed, jealous prole-mass, whether they are attempting to beat him into submission, punish him for crimes uncommitted, or keep him caged by low expectations. Forrest Gumps are the living, breathing nemeses of fascism, gang mentalities, and chic utilitarianism. Gumps among us may not speak the whole truth, and they may understand little of what intellectuals and know-it-alls say about "how the world works." But the Forrests of the world trust their gut, and they prefer to believe their real mothers, not their would-be nannies. Forrest Gumps know that stupid is as stupid does. Gumps believe in hard evidence, and they observe this evidence wherever it rests, without fear. Gumps are not dismayed when those doing stupid things appear powerful, respected and are well-dressed. They are blissfully ignorant of the idea that the wealthy and politically connected have power over the smallest detail of a man’s life. Forrest Gumps, childlike and innocent, will openly observe that the emperor is stark naked, and by extension, powerless over his betters. With today’s state-loving blowhards busy blowing with all their might, we might consider a third way. The proper response may not be, as in the Three Little Pigs, to build a stronger house. It may be simply be to walk out the back door, change the dynamic, shift the power perspective in our own worldview. It is asymmetric warfare of the finest kind. Gump’s fictional story is nothing more than a single life lived honestly, damn the consequences. This way of life is remarkably self-centered – yet as the Winston Groom novel shows, this type of life tends to be more influential than the lives of flocks and flocks of those who look to others to know what to think, what to do, and how to behave. It is good to enjoy Gumpism for its inspirational and entertainment value, but we should go further. We ought to cultivate Gumpian perspectives of American politics, and adopt a Gump-inspired lifestyle in the heart of an increasingly vicious and amoral state.

06-30-2006, 08:36 PM	#2
xoxoxoBruce The future is unwritten Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 71,105	I can't help believing that in our world, the post 9-11 world, Forest Gump would have been jailed or institutionalized rather quickly. __________________ The descent of man ~ Nixon, Friedman, Reagan, Trump.

07-01-2006, 02:02 AM	#3
wolf lobber of scimitars Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Phila Burbs Posts: 20,774	rob4963 ... your point in posting other people's copyrighted work in it's entirety with no commentary of your own is?? __________________ wolf eht htiw og "Conspiracies are the norm, not the exception." --G. Edward Griffin The Creature from Jekyll Island High Priestess of the Church of the Whale Penis

07-02-2006, 02:19 PM	#6
Griff still says videotape Join Date: Feb 2001 Posts: 26,813	She is almost always right. The preferred Cellar method of starting a discussion about it would be a short quote, an explanation of your thoughts, and a link to the article. Usually folks won't read a long article by someone the disagree with unless somebody uses it to back-up their own ideas. Welcome to the Cellar. __________________ If you would only recognize that life is hard, things would be so much easier for you. - Louis D. Brandeis

07-02-2006, 04:45 PM	#7
rob4963 Non-Newbie Sort Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 6	I was just testing the water so to speak.. posting an article like this or even starting a topic as such has brought nothing but accusations of being an UN-grateful, murderous, UN-patriotic American traitor in the past. Thanks for the tip and the welcome Griff. __________________ "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge"Hosea 4:6

07-03-2006, 10:32 AM	#10
Flint Snowflake Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Dystopia Posts: 13,136	I only made it half-way through the article, but I never did catch the Forrest Gump reference. In what way exactly are we all like Forrest Gump, and is that a good thing or a bad thing? For example: was the tasered truck driver a Forrest Gump, or were the cops Forrest Gumps, or does reading about it make us a Forrest Gump, or is it something about our reaction to reading about it that makes us a Forrest Gump? Oh, wait, I get it. I don't understand the article because I'm stupid. You know it's good writing when you can't understand it (thus proving that the author is much smarter than you.) __________________ **************** There's a level of facility that everyone needs to accomplish, and from there it's a matter of deciding for yourself how important ultra-facility is to your expression. ... I found, like Joseph Campbell said, if you just follow whatever gives you a little joy or excitement or awe, then you're on the right track. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Terry Bozzio**

07-03-2006, 11:25 AM	#11
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	I'm very smart, and I know it's bad writing when I can't understand it. The best writers should be able to communicate with a large audience, even drummers. Normally an analogy helps to get across a more complicated concept. In this case, it's used to muddy it.

07-03-2006, 02:14 PM	#14
rkzenrage Guest Posts: n/a	Welcome to Dubya & Co's Empire & Police State. Get in line bitch. American now means Cattle or Cop.

07-05-2006, 05:31 AM	#15
NoBoxes Guest Posts: n/a	I interpret the gist of this writer's Gump analogy to mean that if more citizens boldly acted on conscience and common sense (i.e. "Gumpism) rather than on other people's expectations, this country would be a better place. The writer implies that we don't just have to be entertained and amazed by "Gumpism" when we find it (e.g. The Daily Show); rather, we should practice it. Unfortunately, the writer could have communicated this message much more effectively in a music video by performing a song which states it much more eloquently: The Impossible Dream The writer also states "The proper response may not be, as in the Three Little Pigs, to build a stronger house. It may be simply be to walk out the back door, change the dynamic, shift the power perspective in our own worldview. It is asymmetric warfare of the finest kind." This may be the worst analogy I've ever read. So the wolf runs around to the back of the house and eats the Three Little Pigs! Ironically, the last time I saw the term "asymmetric warfare" used it was by a Guantanamo Bay Commander who was characterizing the detainee suicides there. This writer seemed to be implying that our best course of action would be either emigration; or, capitulation! I found the rest of the article to be mostly superficial and disingenuous.

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