My message

[Rucita]

Why do you, cellar, have deleted my message about Iraq war? I think it was a respectful message.

Is here some type of censorship?

[Undertoad]

It was, but the registration message warns against posting something with a link in your first post because we have been overwhelmed with spam.

[Rucita]

Well, unfortunately this is the war, the war that U.S. and U.K. government, with the Spanish President's support, have promoted, so I think there is a little cynicism when you don't watch what you are doing in Iraq.

Anyway, I repost my message here, whitout that links:


I'm writting to you from Spain. I believe the U.S.A. is a democratic country and that the american people, above all, believe in defending and protecting human rights. So I would appreciate it for you all to continue reading this humble message from an ordinary person and reflect on the Iraq war and what is really going on all over the world these days.

It is true that our President, Jose María Aznar, is supportting the war against Iraq, but against the wishes of 91% of Spanish population. Although we all condemn the horrible terrorist strike that you suffered on September 11th, we are against what we strongly believe is an illegal strike on the sovreign nation of Iraq, because of many reasons the principal ones being:

1.- We know there is no link between Al Qaeda and Iraq, and even less between Al Qaeda and the civilian people who are right now dying in that country as we every day can watch on T.V. and newspapers, including children, women and ¡babies! The proof and evidence that your State Secretary, Collin Powell presented to U.N.O. were false as himself admitted a few days after. Anyway, we do believe that this war is not the way to manage the end of international terrorism, and we are in the conviction that this war will only bring on us all worse effects.

2.- About the hypothetic Iraq's weapons of mass destruction: There are many countries which do posses these types of weapons and for many many years too, and nobody ever has attacked them. Anyway at this time Iraq has not used its so-called weapons of mass destruction. And, most of all, I really believe that the war can be a great pretext for other countries to get these types of weapons, so the world will be an increasingly unsafe place.

3.- I our opinion U.S.A. and United Kingdom, with our President's support, have violated international legality, and broken the purpose of U.N.O. because there is no a resolution which authorizes or which approve the strike to Iraq. And further more it is against the UN Charter.

These are some of the reasons, but the most important one is that a lot of people are dying in Iraq: by now more than 1.250 civilians (children included) and your soldiers too. Saddam Hussein is a monster, yes, he is a terrible dictator, but it doesn’t justify the strike to Iraq and all these deaths.

Also I think the U.S. people is not being informed about the war's consequences, because the self-censorship of T.V. and other media. So I ask you to find out by yourself about what is happening right now in Iraq. You can visit some Spanish web sites (http://www.noalaguerra.org, http://www.culturacontralaguerra.org, http://www.elpais.es, http://www.elmundo.es, http://www.cadenaser.com) and get real information about the war.

These links don't overwhelm, so I hope you don't delete them at this time.

I am gratefull for your time in reading this.

Kisses and Peace for all.

The fact that the same post has been re-posted, word for word, makes it look prepared - and spam-a-riffic.

[Undertoad]

Yeah, but this is the first time a spammer has hung around to check on the status of their message so you never know.

[perth]

antibland stuck around. i think hes still lurking too.

~james

[Undertoad]

Oh yeah. Well that one was different because he wanted to have a contest. Well that's OK, readers are almost as valuable as writers, but if they really want their opinion to stick they have to stick around and talk to us and convince us.

[Rucita]

Originally posted by Undertoad
Oh yeah. Well that one was different because he wanted to have a contest.

"She", Undertoad, "she": I'm a girl.

I don't like any type of violence, so I don't want to have a "writting-fighting" (I don't know if this word really exist, but I hope you understand me). I only wanted to give you all my modest opinion. Just that. Nothing else.

[perth]

Originally posted by Rucita
"She", Undertoad, "she": I'm a girl.

but antibland was (is) a "he".

~james

[Undertoad]

Well Ru, you have chosen exactly the wrong moment in history for your message. At the very minute you sent it, this was happening.

[Rucita]

Yes, Undertoad, I know and I feel happy for that. I hate Saddam, so I want freedom for iraqi people, but I want a real freedom for that nation. Once the war started I wanted the coalition to win, of course.

What I'm trying to tell you is that I believe we all could have avoided that war, so we all could have avoided a lot of unnecesary deaths. That's all.

Rucita, this is totally off topic, but I have a question...

I have had debates before over the actual Spanish pronunciation of the word "Yo". I have been told, from those that supposedly know, that in Spain it is pronounced kind of like the english "Joe", maybe kind of with a "zh" sound like in "Asiago" - "Zho"... but a lot of people insist that it's just regular ol' "Yo"... settle it for me?

[Rucita]

Originally posted by dave
Rucita, this is totally off topic, but I have a question...

I have had debates before over the actual Spanish pronunciation of the word "Yo". I have been told, from those that supposedly know, that in Spain it is pronounced kind of like the english "Joe", maybe kind of with a "zh" sound like in "Asiago" - "Zho"... but a lot of people insist that it's just regular ol' "Yo"... settle it for me?

Let's see. We, Spanish people, pronounce "yo" like English "Joe" (yes, I think is the most similar pronuntiation). But there is in the world a lot of people from other nation that speak Spanish too, and they pronounce some letter in a different way than us, for example Argentine people, who they, certainly, pronounce "yo" like "zho".

Are you Dave studing Spanish?

I'm studing English by my own but you can see I'm not very good on that

[elSicomoro]

Rucita, understand that I do not support this war. However, it is my opinion that your reasoning is flawed.

--You cited that 91% of your population is against the war, without providing a source. Hopefully, you do not put too much stock in those polls, as polls can be misleading.

--When did Powell say that his evidence was false? Could you provide a source for that?

--Yes, many nations have weapons of mass destruction; however, Iraq is required to get rid of theirs as a result of the 1991 Gulf War. You can look up the UN resolutions on their website.

--As far as the war being illegal, that depends on the lawyer you talk to. The Bush administration has cited not only 1441, but earlier UN resolutions as justification for war. It's all in the interpretation.

--It saddens me that civilians are being killed. That being said, the numbers are lower that I would have thought, and the Coalition must be given credit for keeping those casualties to a minimum. And besides...war kills innocent people. That should be expected.

--As far as the media, there are plenty of media outlets in the US that provide a wide variety of views. Just today on NPR, an Iranian-American was talking about how the crowds of Iraqis greeting Coalition forces were smaller than anticipated. And intelligent folks in this country don't rely on just one news source, and not necessarily on the American media.

At least you didn't try the "this is only about oil" or the "illegitimate US election" deal, which is good.

So again, understand, I don't support this war. But my problem is, I hear too many people try to use the same rationales in being against the war. This bothers me b/c people don't qualify themselves, thinking that they know facts, when it's merely their opinions...they say things that either simply aren't true, or cannot be confirmed. And it's disappointing quite frankly...but I guess it should be expected.

Originally posted by Rucita
Let's see. We, Spanish people, pronounce "yo" like English "Joe" (yes, I think is the most similar pronuntiation). But there is in the world a lot of people from other nation that speak Spanish too, and they pronounce some letter in a different way than us, for example Argentine people, who they, certainly, pronounce "yo" like "zho".

Yes! A-ha! I am going to tell all the naysayers to go jump in a lake.

Are you Dave studing Spanish?

I took three years of Spanish in high school, and I was really in love with learning another language, but my teacher totally and completely turned me off from it. She made Spanish a horrible ordeal and by the end of my third year, I quit it. However, when I was studying, I tried to be as perfect at is as I could - working on my accent, grammar, etc. My teachers all thought I was going to be fluent by the end of five years, but like I said, I never got there.

Fortunately, in the last year or so I've rediscovered my love of language. I am not <b>currently</b> studying Spanish because I had a house fire just after I had bought a bunch of Spanish books and they were all destroyed. But in another month or so, I should be back on the right track.

It's funny, because I haven't sat down and thought about saying anything in Spanish in almost six years, but sometimes I'll just rattle something off in conversation without even thinking about it. I was particularly happy with myself when I ran into a girl at the Metro (I live near Washington, D.C.) and she needed money to make a phone call. She spoke zero English and was trying to communicate with me. I understood her Spanish perfectly and told her, in Spanish, that I had some change and she could have it, no need to give me a dollar for a few quarters. I don't even remember what I <b>said</b>, but I said it perfectly and she understood it like I <b>was</b> fluent. It was awesome.

So anyway, I guess there's some left under the surface, and I just need to awaken it.

(I am also studying German - I love languages, and plan to spend the rest of my life learning as many of them as possible.)

I'm studing English by my own but you can see I'm not very good on that

Nonsense! Your English is actually very good. I wouldn't mistake you for someone who has spent their life studying the language, but I certainly wouldn't mistake you for someone who's only been studying a few months either. If you and I were face to face, I would have absolutely no trouble understanding you. Living where I do, I know a <b>lot</b> of people for whom English is a second (or seventh) language, and a vast majority of them are much worse with it than you.

If you want any help with English, let me know. I'm perfectly happy to show you what's correct and tell you why. (I think everyone should be multilingual, and to those that are making an effort to learn my native language, I offer nothing but assistance. Multiculturalism should be encouraged.)