Longshoremen strike: fuck them

Undertoad · 10-06-2002, 08:37 PM

From here,

<i>Full-time West Coast dockworkers who load and unload ships make on average nearly $100,000 a year, while clerks who keep track of cargo movements average $120,000. Not only does the medical coverage for active longshoremen require no out-of-pocket expenses, but the same holds true for retirees.

The benefits package, according to management, averages $42,000 a year, more than many Americans make in a year.

One other benefit: They get a paid day off to celebrate the birth of their Marxist founder, Harry Bridges.</i>

Cam · 10-06-2002, 08:43 PM

Damn, what a bunch of assholes, they not only are costing thousands of business money, other people are losing pay becuase of this. And the people who are losing pay are probably making less than half of what the dockworkers make.

elSicomoro · 10-06-2002, 09:25 PM

Apparently, the union was pissed last week that management brought bodyguards with them to negotiations. I don't blame them...if I had to attend a meeting here with Johnny Doc, I'd bring bodyguards too.

UT and the other Philadelphians here already know what a Union-thug town this city is. It's why the Convention Center is about two steps from going to hell and why we have a shitty mayor. Not to mention, that Council Rock strike seemed farcical.

When unions were created, I think they were a noble idea...to take care of the workers who were busting their balls building this country. However, nowadays, I doubt their relevance. When I see what these workers are making, what their work conditions generally are, and what type of benefits they receive, it boggles my mind. There is nothing wrong with necessarily wanting more...but at what cost to others?

This current strike is going to wind up hurting us in the long run, IMO. Although it will apparently make some American goods cheaper (since there are a glut of them), it will raise the price of imported goods that arrive via sea. And let's face it, we import a ton of shit from overseas.

I don't like seeing people lose their jobs, but that is the price of technology. These longshoremen will be replaced by robots...it's going to come sooner or later. With the money that their union is making, those workers losing jobs could be retrained to do something new.

I'm willing to pay a little more for stuff or be out of it for a little while if the port operators can either bring the union to its knees or break it.

hermit22 · 10-07-2002, 03:24 AM

Though I generally agree with that union sentiment, I don't think it's time to end unions altogether. I, for one, would join an IT union in a heartbeat if it meant I could actually get some benefits and decent pay.

jaguar · 10-07-2002, 07:34 AM

There are good unions and bad unions. There are good employers and bad employers. In the end i think unions do more good than bad, and unions tend to become more miltant when they are attacked by businesses and government. Frankly the union in the end is about benifiting the workers, businesses are about extracting every last dollar from anything they can, i know which i'd prefer to look after me. On the other hand none of the employment ideas i'm looking at involve unions.

These guys do so well BECAUSE they have a union, because as a workforce they can actually tell an employer to get fucked, they have POWER. individual workers do not, and thus will be payed the lowest the business can get away with.

russotto · 10-07-2002, 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jaguar
Frankly the union in the end is about benifiting the workers, businesses are about extracting every last dollar from anything they can, i know which i'd prefer to look after me.

You can't really be that naive, can you?

jaguar · 10-07-2002, 04:45 PM

Depends on the union entirely, some are jsut as bad if not worse =)
Trust is a relative word.

elSicomoro · 10-07-2002, 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jaguar
These guys do so well BECAUSE they have a union, because as a workforce they can actually tell an employer to get fucked, they have POWER. individual workers do not, and thus will be payed the lowest the business can get away with.

Spoken like a true commie pinko.

10-06-2002, 08:37 PM	#1
Undertoad Radical Centrist Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Cottage of Prussia Posts: 31,423	Longshoremen strike: fuck them From here, <i>Full-time West Coast dockworkers who load and unload ships make on average nearly $100,000 a year, while clerks who keep track of cargo movements average $120,000. Not only does the medical coverage for active longshoremen require no out-of-pocket expenses, but the same holds true for retirees. The benefits package, according to management, averages $42,000 a year, more than many Americans make in a year. One other benefit: They get a paid day off to celebrate the birth of their Marxist founder, Harry Bridges.</i>

10-06-2002, 08:43 PM	#2
Cam dripping with ignorance Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Grand Forks ND Posts: 642	Damn, what a bunch of assholes, they not only are costing thousands of business money, other people are losing pay becuase of this. And the people who are losing pay are probably making less than half of what the dockworkers make. __________________ After the seventh beer I generally try and stay away from the keyboard, I apologize for what happens when I fail.

10-07-2002, 03:24 AM	#4
hermit22 sleep. Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: So Cal. Posts: 257	Though I generally agree with that union sentiment, I don't think it's time to end unions altogether. I, for one, would join an IT union in a heartbeat if it meant I could actually get some benefits and decent pay. __________________ blippety blah bluh blah blah

10-07-2002, 07:34 AM	#5
jaguar whig Join Date: Apr 2001 Posts: 5,075	There are good unions and bad unions. There are good employers and bad employers. In the end i think unions do more good than bad, and unions tend to become more miltant when they are attacked by businesses and government. Frankly the union in the end is about benifiting the workers, businesses are about extracting every last dollar from anything they can, i know which i'd prefer to look after me. On the other hand none of the employment ideas i'm looking at involve unions. These guys do so well BECAUSE they have a union, because as a workforce they can actually tell an employer to get fucked, they have POWER. individual workers do not, and thus will be payed the lowest the business can get away with. __________________ Good friends, good books and a sleepy conscience: this is the ideal life. - Twain Last edited by jaguar; 10-07-2002 at 07:37 AM.

10-07-2002, 04:45 PM	#7
jaguar whig Join Date: Apr 2001 Posts: 5,075	Depends on the union entirely, some are jsut as bad if not worse =) Trust is a relative word. __________________ Good friends, good books and a sleepy conscience: this is the ideal life. - Twain

10-06-2002, 09:25 PM	#3
elSicomoro Person who doesn't update the user title Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 12,486	Apparently, the union was pissed last week that management brought bodyguards with them to negotiations. I don't blame them...if I had to attend a meeting here with Johnny Doc, I'd bring bodyguards too. UT and the other Philadelphians here already know what a Union-thug town this city is. It's why the Convention Center is about two steps from going to hell and why we have a shitty mayor. Not to mention, that Council Rock strike seemed farcical. When unions were created, I think they were a noble idea...to take care of the workers who were busting their balls building this country. However, nowadays, I doubt their relevance. When I see what these workers are making, what their work conditions generally are, and what type of benefits they receive, it boggles my mind. There is nothing wrong with necessarily wanting more...but at what cost to others? This current strike is going to wind up hurting us in the long run, IMO. Although it will apparently make some American goods cheaper (since there are a glut of them), it will raise the price of imported goods that arrive via sea. And let's face it, we import a ton of shit from overseas. I don't like seeing people lose their jobs, but that is the price of technology. These longshoremen will be replaced by robots...it's going to come sooner or later. With the money that their union is making, those workers losing jobs could be retrained to do something new. I'm willing to pay a little more for stuff or be out of it for a little while if the port operators can either bring the union to its knees or break it.

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