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Old 08-25-2020, 11:29 PM   #10
Squawk
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Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clodfobble View Post
Right... My question is what happens to the determinist who becomes "self aware" of his determinism. You say you brought up the topic because of a cause-and-effect chain--but *knowing* that fact inherently alters the chain. It's not about "what made you do X," it's about "what is STILL making you do X now that you know what made you do X?"

You want to convince me of determinism, right? But as a determinist, you have to believe that whether I will agree with you is preordained by the chain of events that led ME here. Determinism, in this case, means the outcome you desire has nothing to do with you, and everything to do with me. You can't actually have any effect on me, because I'm already primed for the outcome I always would have had. A true determinist has no reason to bother interacting with anyone. And yet you are--which means either determinism isn't real, or else you don't really believe in it like you think you do.
I can't really see how anything you've said is an argument against determinism. Whether I believe myself to be a determinist or not does not in my view change the fact of the matter. I like to think of myself as a free agent, but that's not to say that I actually am. People often hold beliefs which are false or contradictory. And subconscious thought processes can sometimes be the true drivers of behaviour, despite our conscious attributions. I don't like the implications of determinism, but I have mentioned it here because it seems to be a strong argument. I'm happy to hear counter-arguments and I'm prepared to be convinced that I'm wrong.
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