[Whit]

I have absolutely backed it up. I've given you a website that proves irrefutably that the 16th amendment was not legally ratified. That means it's NOT in effect. I've also shown you where the supreme court said that any laws that are in contradiction to the constitution are null and void. What more do you want?

     I want to see where the courts have said it was unconstitutional. Reality check, dude. The 16th Amendment is. I looked at the site you specified. It was a guy giving a good argument why it should be thrown out, but that doesn't change the fact that it is.
     How 'bout this then? Show me where saying that the 16th amendment is illegitimate has been successfully used in court. I will accept this as proof. Having you or some guy with a web site saying it does not make it so. That's all I'm asking.
     As UT mentioned, until it's a part of case law then it's just what you think it should be. Nothing more.
     Also, I'm very disappointed. When I have a discussion I believe that both parties should be open to what is said. You are not. You are merely using this forum to try and spread your ideas. Guess what? You have a partial success with me. I think it's ratification is crap.
     Guess what else? I look at the Constitution and the 16th is there. All court challenges have failed. There have been many challenges by the way, everyone I could find had the arguements cut down. So, I accept that it is. If it should be is a seperate issue.

Congress is full of collectivists who want to give government more and more power and more of our money even though they have no authority to do so as I've proven several times now.

     This is the only thing I found that you might have been refering to when you say you proved it.

Since government gets its powers from individuals, it may not have any powers that individuals themselves don't have. A goup of individuals don't have any more rights or authority than a single individual. So if the government makes a law regarding drugs, suicide, or abortion, they have no such authority because we as individuals have no authority to tell our neighbors they may not smoke.

     Using this logic then jails are illegal, since it's illegal to lock up a neighbor. Hmm, so are speeding tickets and there's no reason I can't own a nuke. Funny, you had kinda struck me as a pro-death penalty kinda guy. I was obviously wrong about this, since we can't electrocute scum bags that deserve it at home. Maybe I should walk around with a gun on my hip like the cops do. This logic could be fun, if I didn't think it would get me arrested. No, I'd have to say that when the goverment was formed it was given powers of authority beyond that of the common man. The power to govern us specificaly. Maybe that's why they call it 'Goverment'? Root word Govern. Screw it, that must be a word out of swahili.
So, where else did you 'prove it'? You say you did so several times, could you show me?

     Oh yeah. Let's leave the Patriot Act stuff for another thread. We can rant in unison about the evils of that. If you go back a little bit I'm sure you can find a thread I started under the Patriot act II's proper name. That's a more proper thread to talk about it on.