[jaguar]

It's only abstract to you because your rights in this connection are already gone. For me the issue is still quite concete, thanks. And nobody said "absolute" either; there's plenty of ways self-defense rights are abridged. Some I agree with, some I don't.

I don't remember linking that to arms rights. I don't remember linking it ot my rights either. Please stop attempting to put words in my mout, particuarly when you misinterpreting deliberately or not what i said.

(Will you be taking a class in argumentation when you get to college? You *are* going to go to college, right? We haven't heard much about that lately, and September is next month.)

Its called uni here. Yea most likely. THe way my marks are going 'I'll be able to get into my course either some breathing room. Either way what the heck does that have to do with anything? The style of my writing here is terrible. If i handed it in i'd get a D if i was lucky. The crap i write on here is nothing like my actual work, i write this entirely on the fly, no review time, no rewrites, no forward thinking about structure. I've got a bunch of opinionative stuff coming up for school, i might able able to twist one of them towards gun rights (taeacher asked me to submit a list of topics so...) so i might be able to write some real stuff on the issue, factually back up logically structured bulletproof stuff unlike the random rablings i'm usually posting.

Well, I can certainly see that the functioning of your democracy is impaired, whether we're talking obout the right to keep and bear arms or the right to see what you want on the Internet. But then "the price of freedom is eternal vigilance", as long as we're flinging quotes about. Our democracy still seems to be struggling along somehow...not perfect, but arguably still the best deal in town. YMMV.

Thats bloody debateable. TOu have two parties which squeese out a fair competition with anyone else, and your currant leader was elected by the supreme court. In fact just under 1 quarter of your population voted for him. Best deal in town my ass. The only truely effective democracy existed in Ancient Greece, its a pity our sociopolitical structure jsut would not allow such a system. These days Britan inho has the ebst system, although their judicial wing could do with some redessing. Representative democracy is flawed either way.

Oh, dear, we're back to this again. "Anyone who arms themselves for protection must be in the grip of blood lust." Of course, training with and carrying a blade among a disarmed population is noble, it's just firearms that are implicitly evil.

Pardon? Ok i went a little over on the bloodlust stuff, sure ill admit that but where did you pull the knife stuff from?

Yes, weapons are an equalizer in combat between the bigger and stronger and the smaller and weaker. That's a trend since Ogg the caveman first picked up a stick. It's continued through the invention of the spear, the sword, armor, the longbow, and so on. Firearms have removed the last advantage of the brute.The possibility that ordinary people may be legally armed with concealed handguns makes comitting violent crime a much trickier and more dangerous affair--for the criminal. I like it that way. Too bad if you don't. But will you ever stop conflating the desire to not be helpless in the face of violence with the desire to be violent?

It merely makes the criminal more likely to be armed, more nervous and more likely to shoot you. Wonderful, now everyone is equal - until someone gets a bigger gun, a point which you don't seem to willing to address. If everyone is equal you're just as likely to be shot, what have you really gained?

Look, the process of licencing for concealed carry filters out the great preponderance of people likely to commit *any* crime, much less starting a random spray of fire at a disco (which is your violent fantasy) or sneak up behind Sludge and put a bullet in his head, depriving him of a dramatic struggle on some "Mortal Combat" field of honor, may the best man win.

Firstly i'm not sure where you got my "violent fantasty" from. I've got a friend with a plastic kneecap from an incident in a sydney nightclub.

So spare me your "you must be bitter". That's a ludicrous red herring...especially after your jaded assertion that democracy is dead and our rights are dead abstractions. Methinks the pot calls the kettle black.

Hehehehe. I'm not in the least bit jaded about it, i understand hw the system works and how to twist it to my advantage, Why would i be jaded? I find the whole thing quite fun really.