[Griff]

"... problems are directly traceable to top management " I actually like this Pope but we agree, the repression of sexuality among the lay people is problematic, leading directly to abortions and alienating gays. I'd say our society goes to far the other way placing way to much emphasis on serving the animal in man. There is a middle ground there somewhere to be sought by each individual. Much of the commentary, I've read comes from folks who left the church before Vatican IIs gradual effects were felt, natural acts like masturbation are no longer being criticized in the confessional, where confessionals are still used, at least by priests who are with the times. Eventually this stuff will trickle up to the hierarchy. I don't know how I reached the conclusion that you were disinterested in the spiritual, if I gave offense beyond our usual jabs, I'm sorry.