tipping with a credit card
 

I'm not a particularly frugal college student. I eat out at least once a week, and (since arbitrarily deciding my approach to fiscal responsibility after reading a thread here) avoid carrying cash. This leaves me with my check/debit card, and the lingering desire to tip waiters.

When you leave cash on the table, it very clearly goes straight into their pockets. But tips left with a credit card, written into that little line they give you, seem more to be gifts to the institution than the service employees who served you. Do credit card tips actually make their way to the waiters? And if I insist on continuing the justification for not paying waitstaff very well (admittedly, the minimum wage here is up near second-best-in-country), is it worthwhile to carry cash for the purpose?

A credit card tip is converted to cash (and pocketed) as soon as the waiter or waitress returns to the cash register.

Let's see if stacyv has a different take.

Even when paying for a meal by credit card (extremely rare event), I tip in cash. So do most of the people I know ... Don't CC tips get reported to the gubbermint automatically?

I think whether tips get reported depends more on the management of the particular restaurant. When I worked in food service (which was admittedly a long time ago,) the delivery drivers turned in their credit card receipts at the end of the night for cash, and no tips were ever reported.

In some cases I've seen (and only second-hand - I've never done a food service gig myself) the final transaction is recorded as a separate Total and Tip and only the Total is entered as revenue. I'm sure fancy schmancy computer technology makes reporting only food/drink totals and leaving out tips pretty easy. And if waiters were required to fork over 1-2% of tips for merchant fees, I imagine we'd all be serving ourselves when we eat out.

Here's an interesting tipping bit my cousin raised a few weeks ago at dinner: Do you tip x% *before* or *after* tax? She says it should be pre-tax - and here in NYC, where tax is 8.625%, that makes a big difference for any meal over $40-50. I agree with her.

Next time I have to wade through restaurant financials, I'm going to double-check how sales/service tax is booked.

Here in the communist stronghold of DC where the extortionary sales tax on restaurant food (ten percent) is enough to make a loan shark blush, tips are based upon the pre-tax cost of the meal.

The waiter gets a tip on the food, not on tax or alcohol.

If there is a sommelier who does their job well, they get 15% of the wine bill.

-ml

this isn't credit card specific but how about tipping bartenders? are you supposed to? sometimes they have a little jar set out for tips...(I guess these questions gives away the fact that I don't drink much, or that I don't go OUT to drink much)

Waiters/waitresses - I usually tip 15%, but I'll give 20% if they're good.

Bartenders - $1 per drink, if I'm paying cash. If I have a tab going, I usually tip 10-15%.

And as far as I know, they never have a problem collecting their tips from credit cards.

I'd rather get a credit card tip than NO tip.

I tip a buck a drink, and do so as I go rather than waiting for the bill. This accomplishes a couple things:

1. It saves me having to figure out a percentage if I'm a bit too twisted.
2. It helps ensure the waitress will come back often, ensuring that I do get twisted. :)

Well, a restaurant in Philadelphia went under and all of the waiters and waitresses tips placed on credit cards were placed into the pool of assets of the restaurant. The wait staff never saw any of it.

That's not really a normal scenario, though. If the restaurant went under, chances are decent those waitstaff never saw their last paycheck either.

What the hell? Why shouldn't you tip your waitress for alcohol?? :confused:
Because the bar made the drink? well, the kitchen made the food, so why do you tip on that? BECAUSE, I took the damn order, brought you the correct item and brought you refils as needed. In the case of wine, I ordered it, brought you glasses for it and ice if necessary, showed you the label, uncorked it, let you taste it, poured it for you and refilled your glasses. 1 bottle of wine makes 4 glasses. If the bottle of wine is $24, that's $6 per drink (an average price for any alcoholic drink). BUT, I did more work for that bottle than if you had ordered 4 different wines by the glass- so why the hell wouldn't you tip on it?? And don't order a bottle that's more than $24 if you're so f*&^%$^*ing cheap. Don't tip on alcohol? Jesus Christ, I'm still shaking my head over that one. Whatever, that doesn't happen to me. I make 18-20% of my TOTAL sales per shift. BY THE WAY, did you know that your server has to tip the bar out for that alcohol that you didn't tip on??
Yeah, that's right, I have to give the bar anywhere from 8.3% to 10% of my total tips earned per shift- regardless of whether I only sold food and soda or lots of alcoholic beverages. Don't be a fuckin cheapskate. The tax thing? Hey, whatever. I wouldn't get offended by that because it shouldn't put a huge dent in the tip, so be cheap there if it makes you happy. (But again, 99% of my customers don't do that either- it's just so trivial. If you're that worried about spending every cent, you shouldn't be eating out- you should be at the grocery store buying generic brands...)

OKAY, as far as credit card tips go, I never get mad about those!! I would prefer that I get all cash tips, but that's a pipe dream. Some shifts I get mostly credit card tips and that sucks, because yes, I have to claim every cent, but honestly, most of the time there's a nice balance between those who tip with credit cards and those who tip in cash, so that's really not a big deal. Go ahead, tip to your heart's contant on that credit card! :D
One thing to think about, though- they don't do this at my resyaurant, but SOME places actually charge their waitstaff a small fee out of their credit card tips, because businesses have to pay a fee on all credit card sales to a merchant processor...

i dont usually tip, its not what ppl do over here. i think its a rort! you pay for your meal, and they get paid to serve you from their employers.

When i worked in food service (3 yrs ago) you might get maybe $2 or $3 dollars from someone you were extra nice to. never a percentage of the meal like you do over there tho - seeing as meals were about $60 for a steak.

but we never got offened. its just not the custom here.

When i went on a PandO cruise last year they automatically deducted your tips from your card without even asking!! which ticked me off.. i really dont see the point in tipping.

Waiters take your drink order, just like your food order, and bring it to the table, just like your food. They don't prepare either your drinks or your food; how do you justify tipping for one and not the other?

I know many restaurants have their wait staff share tips with the bartenders. So, if you are heavy drinkers like my friends and I, tip on the whole amount, and leave a couple extra % for "rowdiness" factor.

AMEN.

The standard for tipping is the same for bartenders as waitresses. Chainsaw, If I were you, I wouldn't go to the same establishment twice- and start a tab so they don't contaminate your drink after they find out how you tip. If 15% is your high point, you must reserve that for bartenders who are really nice to you and do a very good job. That's kind of cheap for excellent service.
A buck per drink is okay if you don't have a tab, BUT if you order 3 martinis at $8 each and you give the bartender $3, that's about 12.5%. But that works really well for all beers and wines by the glass and basic cocktails...
I wish everyone would be a bartender or waitress for ONE day. God, there wouldn't be a need for these types of conversations. Everyone would just tip 20% and give 15% for bad service with a comment card stating why they tipped like that. Seriously.
But you know what? Here's a tip for you: If you're really old, we actually feel lucky to get 15% out of you. Old farts are an exception. As are minorities, white trash and teens. If you don't fall into one of those categories, if you have all of your teeth, if you don't pronounce the 'T" at the end of merlot, for christ sake, just be generous.

I have a friend who started the nonsense about not tipping on alcohol (you have no idea how hard it just was to spell out the word rather than typing it as ETOH) and I got her corrected on that one ... alcohol is as much a part of the meal as the Death by Chocolate.

Oh, and I tip pre-tax.

At the Sbarro restaurant I work a 'tip' line is printed right on the credit card receipt and a lot of people will write in an amount but we never see any of it. When I first started working there I asked why and was told there was a no tipping policy so I've since advised people that the employees don't receive the tips they are writing in and encourage them not to do so. Why should some fat cat owner of the place get money I deserved for prompt, courteous service?

People that pay in cash will often leave the change from their order with the cashier and it used to be put in a cup and split at the end of the shift. Management put a stop to that too and demanded the change be put in the cash register. Not that I need what amounts to a few bucks at the end of a shift but what the hell, I'm not going to let that fat cat owner get it either, I always give the people their change back. :headshake

That's really fucked up, 404. How on earth do they justify accepting a tip and not distributing it in some manner? That's a deceptive practice that the BBB would love to get its fangs in.

That sounds barely legal to me...but I've never worked in foodservice either.

i never considered the pre/post-tax angle. Let's see. If I make $10 and go to a restaurant (ok, this is a cheap restaurant), my $10 has already been taxed when I earned it. The meal is $5, which will be collected by the restaurant and taxed again, partly as income for the restaurant, and then again when it becomes income for the owner/employees. The tip will be taxed again once it reaches the waitstaff's pockets (assuming they declare it). By now the government has gotten a piece of my $10 from like 4 or 5 directions. So the question now becomes, which puts more spendable income in the waitstaff's pocket? tipping pre- or post-tax?

I'm not good with numbers.

Um, money isn't taxed, transactions are. And some of the transactions you mentioned are deductions for other ones.

And tipping more puts more money in the waitstaff's pocket so unless the tax decreases your bill, calculating the percentage after tax will be more.

Nothing really gets double-taxed in that instance. The restaurant will pay taxes on its bottom line (well, EBITDA = earnings before interest, tax, depreciation and amortization). That amount already accounts for general expenses, including payroll/wages. The money is handed over to employees before it's subject to any corporate taxes.

So, really, the whole sum of your $5 is taxed only once.

And of course post-tax tipping puts more money in the waiter's pocket since it's a higher amount. Just a matter of how much you want to leave and (again) whether the waitstaff declares it.

Edit: Of course, gross dollar transactions are subject to merchant transaction fees, if paid by credit card. I don't know if there are any tax implications there, but I doubt it.

this kind of thing is why i always flunked math. until HM's post, I never really considered that the government is taxing the movement of money, not the money itself. I think that pisses me off more.

It's not like money is created in the paycheck, and destroyed when you spend it. You can't put a checkmark on a $20 bill, and only tax the first time it changes hands.

The closest thing to taxing "money" instead of transactions is the property tax, and I somehow doubt that much enthusiasm could be drummed up for moving from an income (ie transaction) tax to a total holdings ( cash, funds, and assets ) property tax.

Ok, I should maybe clarify the whole wine thing. If I'm eating at our local Chili’s or Roadhouse grill and order a beer or a glass of wine, of course I'm going to include that in the tip, and I usually leave about 20% if the service was good.

But when I eat at the French Laundry in Napa, or at Water Grill here in LA, I'm going to spend $60-100 per person for dinner before tax and wine. 20% of that is more than adequate for the wait staff. Assuming I'm there with a party of 4 that's $80 for them to split however they need to.

Wine is probably going to be another $60-100, depending on their selection and what was ordered. If I am familiar with their wine list and feel comfortable pairing up a bottle, then I won't ask for the sommelier. If the sommelier helps me out and does a particularly good job selecting a wine, then I'm going to tip him for his expertise and service, usually 10-15% of the wine bill.

But here’s the word on it from the expert, and should be remembered by people who are in the service industry:

“Tipping is a recognition of excellent service, not an obligation on the part of the person served. A tip should be accepted, not expected.” – Nina Zagat (Zagat Survey)


-sm

Exactly.

Unfortunately, restauraunts and the government have set up the rules so tips are essentially considered salary.

I personally prefer places with a no-tipping policy. Let the restaurant pay the waitstaff. Unfortunately, now that tipping has invaded American culture, it's unlikely to go away.

at a bar it's a buck a drink. when i was a bartender, any tip that was left in change was swept onto the floor behind the bar and the cleanign crew got it. we were never rude about it, but if someone gave a REAL crap tip (like a buck on a $20 order) we would hand them their dollar and one of our dollars back and kindly (and discretely) tell them they need it worse than we do. it sounds horrible, but once you've seen it in action... it makes perfect sense, and i never had anyone get pissed about it.

one thing on taxes - some places require the establishment to report X% of every order a server/bartender rings up as a received tip.

example: i serve you 5 pints and tell you that the bill is $15. you hand me $16 dollars and tell me to keep the change. the bar is required to report that i received $1.80 tip even though i didn't. (at the time the % was 12%) so keep that in mind when tipping.

as always, a tip should reflect the level of service received.

From My Daughter. I hope this is usefull.

IN regards to tipping with a credit card. Depending on if the restaurant
pools there tips or not that money that you have left on that liitle line
does go to the server. As a server you are logged into the computer system
and as you settle tables with cash/ debit/ credit card it always asks you if
you for the tip amount. Where I work at the end on my shift I print out what
we call a cash out slip adn on there it tells you the amount of money you
made in tips. If you add up all the credit card/debit and cash tips you made
the two numbers should be the same. As for restaurants that pool there tips,
I would only tip the minimun 15% because that money does not all go to your
server. As a student and a server, I really do base my tipping on the service when I go out to eat. No less than 15% though. This is because, the money you do
leave does get slit up between the kitchen staff and bartender.

I wondered if this was going to come up. I got out of restaurant management way back in 1985, but I remember that in the early eighties there was a new law passed concerning the amount of tips that service personnel claimed as income to the IRS. I know my restaurant had to get a new cash register so we could separate dine in orders from carry out orders, and waiters and waitresses HAD to claim a percentage of the dine in sales as cash received in tips. And for the folks who did not - their W-2 form came with a dollar amount typed in the #8 box where it reads "allocated tips", that they had to pay taxes on. Anyone know if this is about how it works these days?

And as for establishments just paying their staff, well, most just don't. With minimum wage at $5.15, some steak houses around here pay $2.10 an hour plus tips, of course. Their attitude is that if you cannot average $5.15 an hour during a shift, then you're not doing your job.

I wish i just got paid per hour- the whole $15-$25 that I actualy make per hour with my tips, but that's never gonna happen. I'm at the customers' mercy and I make $2.13 an hour, which usually amounts to a weekly check that says: "this is not a check"...."you owe $16.26" (for taxes).
So as far as accepting and not expecting a tip, well, if i "expect" to pay my rent and feed myself, I "expect" a friggin tip.

I vary but if the service is shitty it's a lucky day if I tip *anything*. Why the hell would I put 15% for someone to cock up my order and waste my time? If i fuck up a contact I don't paid get anything and rightly so, why should you? On the flipside if it's prompt, polite service handled well I'll tip very well. I think waitors get paid here regardlesss, I noticed the other day in Prague noone seemed to be tipping at all, at least the locals, it's so confusing.

That's kind of the problem in the end, and why I feel guilty enough to leave a tip in all but one instance (it was comedically bad service). I've had a few bad waiters/waitresses, but I suspect there are far more cheapskate customers. 15% is what I pay for the service I expect, and I go up or down from there. Seldom down, but it happens from time to time.

I imagine it's tough to be able to read some customers, but if I expect to leave a friggin tip, I expect the waitstaff to do the following:

1. Come to the table within 5 minutes of sitting down (There's leeway here if the restaurant is very busy)
2. Return with drinks in a timely fashion and take orders
3. Stop by at least once to top off drinks

Eh. It also helps their tip if they're a pretty girl.

Then I "expect" you to get a job that pays you enough to make your rent.

From this <A HREF="http://slate.msn.com/default.aspx?id=2073161">Slate.com</A> articlle:

This is *sort of* what I was about to write. As been said before, tipping has just become engrained in American culture. It's a signal of appreciation for what we expect in return: personal, friendly, helpful service. Americans like to build relationships, and perhaps there's something interpersonal about the amount of tip that is left.

I tend to be overly generous, so I tip well when there is good, attentive service. What the author mentions in her article is true me for, though: I won't necessarily tip better for excellent service (I always gives 20% regardless), but I'll definitely shave off a few bucks if the waitstaff is lousy. On the other hand, because we know waiters don't make squat for salary, we feel guilty and develop a complex about not spreading around the wealth, especially for a service that is essentially unquantifiable.

So, my question is for you folks: Would you rather restaurants automatically add gratuity or raise prices to account for service charges like they do in Europe?

ANother one: What do you do with a gift card? At Morton's, I had a $100 certificate, but I made sure to tip on that amount as well. Well, at least I tried to. I more or less fell out the front door after two bottles of wine an four glasses of whiskey.

well, let's look at real life. i took the family to disney earlier this week.

long waits abound in the sit down restaurants. ESPN zone only averaged 15-20 minutes vs. 90 minute wait at rainforest cafe, so i had opportunity to eat at ESPN a few times.

First night - Shannen was our waitress. it was very busy, but she was standing next to me before i even got my son settled in. she explained that she was very busy so she wouldn't be able to take our order right away, but she wanted to get drinks to us immediately. i appreciated the upfront honesty. i also appreciated that our drinks were on the table within 2 minutes. she was still back and chatting with us inside of 5 minutes. as i took the last drink of my iced tea, she walked up pitcher in hand and refilled it on her way to another table. this happened 3 times. shannen ruled. shannen ended up with a $20 tip. i did the math figuring an average of $10/table/hour and shannen was probably hauling in easily $50/hour at that rate. considering her excellent service, i'm sure she does much better than that.

Second night - Don't know our waitress's name. it wasn't as busy, it took at least 5 minutes before we saw her. she forgot to bring drinks back. she got wife's order wrong, and i had to stop a different server to get more iced tea. the nameless waitress got $5. yes, i felt bad - but i got poor service and i don't feel i need to reward poor service with anything extra. doing the math, i figure even if she got $5/table/hour she was clearing $20/hour - much more than her service justified. i'm sure she was griping about her poor tips later, but what the hell? you want more? do more.

You reminded me of a recent tipping incident, bn. We had a $50 giftcard to the restaurant (won as a raffle prize at some company function) and the meal came out to something like $49.50. We didn't have any cash (because we never do, but that's a different thread) so we told her to put $10 on the credit card.

She said she couldn't do that. The only thing she was allowed to do was put $1 of the meal on the credit card, and take the other $48.50 from the giftcard, and then we could add in the other $9 on the printed tip line.

I would rather the restaurants pay their staff at least minimum wage, and if they have to, raise the price of the meal one dollar or whatever AND STILL ALLOW ME TO TIP.

I wish the government didn't tax tips at all, so that waitstaff like stacey wouldn't need a tip to survive. I've watiressed before, in late 80's Oregon, where I made $2.13 an hour + tips, and they reported 15% of my tickets (subtotal not after tax) to the IRS. Regardless of how much I made in tips that day, I got taxed like every table tipped 15%.

It's a low paying thankless shit job but I never expected my customers to tip me just because I got taxed on their bill. I accepted (and appreciated) a tip because I busted my ass to serve them, and do it quickly, efficiently and happily.

When I got tired of paying more in taxes than I earned, I found another job.

I was in Australia about 2 years ago, where tipping is not the norm. We stayed at an amazing hotel right off of the harbor. We had a party of about 12, and wanted to eat at Doyle's, the restraunt right off of Circular Quay. Well, you can't get a table at Doyle's, certainly not without a reservation well in advance, and certainly not for a group that large.

I asked the concierge at our hotel if he might be able to help. Not only did he get us a table at Doyle's, it was the host table on the second floor overlooking the Sydney Opera house, in a glass atrium with a view all around. Unbelievable.

When I got back to the hotel, I tried to tip the guy by doing the "American Handshake", with a bill folded inside the hand, the kind of thing any concierge or maitre'd in the states would have picked up on. Well, he was so shocked to feel something in my hand that he dropped the bill. When it landed on the counter, he tried to hand it back to me. I tried to explain that it was my way of appreciating his efforts at landing us a table, and he was completely flustered. It was awesome.

Why is the service so much better in countries where tipping is not the norm?

-sm

Maybe it's related to the psychological issue where you stop enjoying something when you start getting paid to do it.

etc. etc (For some reason, I can't fit the whole quote in -?)

I do all of that stuff and like I said, I always make 18-20% of my gross sales in tips. That averages out to $15-$25 hour, depending on how busy it is and it's easy to make over $25 hour in the summer or on a saturday night, so, OC, um, yeah, I HAVE a job that pays the bills.
Sine I know I'm a good waitress (I get good comment cards, good tips in general and I often have people say to me "you read my mind!!" when I bring them a refill without them having to ask), I know that when I get 15% tips it's because they're just fucking cheap.

Yeah, but isn't 15% the "standard" for standard service. Those things I listed above are what I expect out of standard service. Frequency of visits, friendliness of the waitstaff, and other nebulous crap are the things that get me leaving 20-25%.

I don't believe in standard 15% tipping. It's not a gift. It's an expression of appreciation for value received. Or something like that.

I've tipped a lot more, and I've tipped ZERO. You have to exceptionally suck to get ZERO, incidentally.

The one I always have trouble with is ... how much do you give the valet parking guy?

(One strategy I have used so far is that I leave the valet parking tip in the ashtray of my car. If it's still there when they return my car to me, they get the tip.)

15% is just a recommended benchmark. No standard.

Edit: Following on wolf's post, who else do you/don't you tip? I always tip parking attendants a $1 or two, but ONLY if they pull my car up to the front. I've had guys throw me the keys and point to my car in the single-level parking lot (those fuckers on 3rd St. just north of Market). First they double the price for overnight parking (I guess that's reasonable), then they're jerks about it.

I give cab drivers either:about $1 for every $5-8, or about a $1 for each person if there are a whole bunch of us (depending on the length of the ride, of course).

The worst are coat-check girls and the guys in the bathroom that hand you a towel and give you soap. I only tip those dudes if I take a cigarette or some gum. Sometimes more if I need a condom, but that's only been once - I generally try to be prepared at all times. :)

So, you ALWAYS tip the valet, then.

I mean, if you reward his service and his honesty with the tip left in the ashtray, goody for him.

But what do you do if the tip isn't in the ashtray when you get back? Um, where did the tip go?

:eyebrow:

I usually only use the valet service when I'm staying in a fancy-ass hotel ... I'm a park and walk because I'm cheap kinda girl usually ...

Do you vary the valet tip based on the number of times he gets your car out of car purgatory for you? Like if you get it out twice during your stay, do you tip smaller amounts to equal what you'd give at the end??

This last time my car was in valet parking for five days. So the dudes basically watched over my vehicle and kept it safe from harm for that period of time. They put it away once, and brought it out once, so I pulled $5 out of the ashtray and handed it to the guy.

I prefer to do as much stuff on my own as possible ... but the friend I went to Baltimore with had entirely too much crap AND wasn't capable of carrying any of it herself, although why you need and 80 pound suitcase, a carry on bag, and a shopping bag full of snack foods for five days in a hotel with concierge lounge access is beyond me ... so while I had one rolling suitcase, a laptop case and a purse, she need a fucking flatbed to get her stuff up to the room. Under those circumstances, I figure the bellman is worth a buck a bag, right?

i think it depends on where you are at too.

at the really nice places i tip the guy who takes my car from me so that he will keep it somewhere accessible and free of damage. i tip the guy who brings it back to me. dammit, i tip just about anyone who talks to me in those places.

vegas used to make me really uncomfortable because i wasn't sure who i was supposed to tip and who i wasn't. then i just decided i'll tip everyone. everyone with some qualifications, though. i shake damn near everyone's hand. if they shake my hand after providing me with a service (valet, bell service, etc.) they get a tip. no handshake, no tip. if they stick their hand out like they are expecting something - THEIR OUTTA THERE!

when we travel i keep stacks of fives in my wallet for this purpose alone. i never spend $5 bills - they are for tipping only. my wife rolls her eyes, but it is more for my own comfort than anything. i know for $5 to anyone who helps me and shakes my hand, i'm not leaving out anyone who deserves it. and it's built into our travel budget, so what does it hurt?

That's when the manager gets to feel the full wrath of wolf. I don't take any of that "not responsible for valuables" shit.

restaurants are ripping me off?
 

Welcome to the Cellar, Jenlove30. :D
What do you do with your cash tips, pocket them all or give some to the busser?....kitchen? Have you asked the other waiters what they do? When you were hired did anyone explain policy or custom?

getting ripped off
 

Hi :)
The boss told me that she would tip the kitchen from my credit card tips. She told me to keep my cash tips. I do not believe her. There are no industry standards so I don't know what is expected of me. I only work 1 day a week, but it seems fishy. The kitchen keeps complaining that they want me to pay them. But I told them that the boss is supposed to pay them from my credit cards tips. They have complained that they are not getting anything.

I think the boss is taking all the money for herself. How do I prove this?

There is no situation where one coworker should "pay" another directly. If tips are shared, they are collected by a boss/manager and then redistributed. Either the kitchen staff is trying to scam you into just giving them money, or the boss is scamming them by not actually giving them the 20% she is withholding from you. Either way, it isn't really possible for you to prove anything unless you have access to the bookkeeping, which I'm sure you don't. It's the kitchen staff's problem--if they're not getting paid, they should talk to the boss.

It might be customary at that resturant to share with the kitchen but this is your first month isn't it? It's possible, depending on the time frame, your boss took money for the kitchen from you and plans to give it to the on their next payday? I'm just guessing, here.

You could ask your boss why the kitchen is bitching about not getting their money, go to the boss with the kitchen help, or just tell them to see the boss.

Or take a shotgun to work and watch 'em sweat. :lol: