Who's up for roughing it?
 

As a kid and teenager, I went camping all the time with the Boy Scouts and Explorers. And I almost always had a blast--hiking, building fires, goofing off, being out in nature...good stuff!

My favorite trip was actually my last--summer of 1992 at Indiana Dunes State Park near Chicago. We built sand sculptures that drew crowds, climbed the massive dunes, and admired the view of the Chicago skyline. That was great...here's a photo from that trip (though the skyline in this one is actually the Gary steel mills):

http://msdelta.net/~sycamore/chicago5.jpg

In the past year or so, I've had a strong desire to head back out to the woods. And this time of the year is a great time to do so. Sure, it can get rather cold, but you don't have to generally deal with a lot of bugs and critters.

Is anyone in this part of Cellarland interested in doing such a thing? We could chip in on a campsite (or maybe someone will be gracious enough to let us stay on their land) for a weekend...build a big-ass fire, cook over an open flame, drink, smoke, and have a blast.

Anyone?

Before or after Stressmas?

At this point, it might be best to do it after the first of the year. People's calendars should be less crowded.

It's sounding good so far. Any ideas on where? Maybe the state gamelands?

Perhaps. I was thinking either the Poconos or your neck of the woods.

Poconos!? I was thinking something cheap. <a href="http://sites.state.pa.us/PA_Exec/PGC/SGL/ser.htm" <a> Pick a county from the list. </a> Or.....were you not really serious about the roughing it part?

Thats ok, I know you city slickers like yer running water n' all.

And another thing. Bring yer own gear and dont plan on spooning me.

As far as the Poconos, I'm merely referring to a campsite up that way.

The only modern convenience I wouldn't mind is a running toilet nearby (like 10 minutes by car). And we'll bring a cell phone for emergencies (although I'd be on roaming in your area). But that's it on the modern shit.

I'm not at expert at winter camping but I've done it. As far as I know campsites arent really enthusiastic about people being there in winter.

You may very well know a lot more about that then me.

Well, there are places that cater to winter campers...unfortunately, I don't know any in this neck of the woods.

Griff? Anyone? I better do some research on this...

If you want to trek up here, thats cool. I'd like to stay in Pa though.

I might be able to find some of the good MREs. Those with the chemical heaters. That'd make thing's a lot easier.

Here's a link to PA's state parks. They're $26 a night for a tenting group of 20 or less.

Ok, I'm assuming you have a tent? What else will we need, besides a winter trigger for my Garand?

This one is close:

Mt. Pisgah County Park features picnicking, hiking, hunting, rustic camping and scenic vistas.

I could get some info on the "winter camping" and maybe grab some pics.

If yer going in winter you should probably have someone experienced in the lot, I'm thinking.

Yeah I personally would rather do it in the spring :)

I have thought about combining a camping/astronomy weekend... the Delaware Valley Amateur Astornomers uses an area at French Creek State Park for dark-sky observing.

This outting would more than likely be "staying up all night burning wood and telling stories" than actual camping.

Since I'm up all night anyway, I can see myself crashing safely in the car during the day.

You sure we can't be closer than 10 minutes to the potty?

And yeah, spring would be WAY better, unless we hook up on an "all the modern conveniences, especially HEAT RV."

Actually this does sound like a way cool idea, even if it would involve major purchases of camping gear.

We dont need no stinking camping gear!

* Sleep in the car with the motor running during the normal sleeping hours (5am-noonish)

* get up and around during mid-day to gather fuck loads of firewood.

* make a big ass fire through the night, bark at the moon, walk silently through the woods looking for bigfoot.

Rinse, repeat.

What is this heated RV talk?

I've had considerable experience with cold weather camping.
That's why I don't do it.:cool:

Winter camping is easiest when there's a solid layer of snow on the ground (compacted). Snow isn't too soft so it doesn't get into your boots, and you don't have to deal with soggy ground. It's extremely low impact too, since you leave no footprints n stuff.

Tents are no problem - heat rises, so if you think you're going to melt your way into the snow, it won't happen. Just make sure to put a layer or two of tarps/garbage bags beneath your tent and the snow - it does get chilly at night.

Building a fire won't be that difficult either - unlike rain, snow generally doesn't make wood all that soggy. Of course you could just buy a whole sack of pre-cut for $10 - that saves a lot of trouble.

And don't ever eat MREs on a campout, especially a winter one. :P One big pot of beef stroganoff (dehydrated kind, available in most sporting goods stores) with a couple cans or bags of mixed veggies added is solid cold-weather food. If you don't have to hike the food in, big cans of dinty moore beef stew makes for quick 'n easy meals too. If you're adventurous, I have done chicken in white wine sauce and all sorts of fancies on an open fire, but it's tough in the winter when your fingers get cold and you can cut them off without realizing it. Pre-made shish kabobs cook quickly on a fire too.

Plenty of campsites up around the Delaware Water Gap. Close to civilization, good day hikes up the Appalachian and usually isn't too crowded during the winter (who's fucking crazy enough to do that anyway?).

Ok. I assume you have specific experience with MREs. Can you tell me why one shouldnt eat them on a campout?

Having consumed 30 or so just recently, I cant imagine why they'd be a problem.

Voluntary or no? That makes a big difference.

If you guys are going winter camping, I suggest you review the products at this link:

http://www.coleman.com/coleman/Colem...egory_main.asp

I have a SportCat and a BlackCat, and they are hands down the best friend a cold-weather camper ever had.

Dumb question I've always wondered about: How do you wash dishes while camping? Assuming a source of water (say, from the spigot helpfully provided by the campground at each site ;) ), how do you dispose of the dirty dishwater in a site-friendly way?

Or do you just do everything with paper utensils??

Dawn dishwashing soap is fully biodegradable, as are the nasties you wash off the dishes, so it is actually possible to dump same, but most sites have restrictions against greywater dumping.

I usually use the composting toilet or other potty facility for dumping greywater, myself.

Alright, I overstated myself there.

Nutritionally, MREs are pretty solid: 1,200-1,500 calories, all the carbs, minerals and fat needed from food sources. Not that many preservatives either, ever since the development of the pouches they're packed in (though just about everything packed for shelf-life has a fair amount of preservs). And I'll admit the chemical heaters do a good job of lightin' those suckers up.

It takes the fun out of campout cooking, though. And taking advantage of what you're capable of doing is the best way - a freshly prepared meal is still ideal since it'll get you all the protein and carbs needed (most important in wintertime). Add warmth, good hydration from boil-cooking and plenty of leftovers (in some cases).

Dehydrated foods (like Alpineaire and, um, some others that I don't remember the names of) I believe are on the same level nutritionally as MREs (probably a little more sodium & less protein), but there's somthing about cooked food that's much more filling in the cold. I've done both MREs and one-pot meals in very extreme weather, and though it once took us almost an hour to get a fire going during a blizzard (camp stove got wet and it was snowing too hard to try and fix it), we were much happier with a warm pot of stew. Plus an MRE is like $5-7 each, whereas a $6-7 backpack meal can feed 4, if cost is a factor.

One thing for sure: No instant noodles. Zero nutritional value, and just a whole lot of sodium, really. I eat a bowl of noodles at home and still feel hungry, not to mention thirsty.

Tactics I've used:

If you're carrying fresh food, save the bread for last to scrape out bowls and the cooking pot. Save the cleaning for home.

Or take some TP or paper towel, wipe clean and pack it out with your garbage.

Otherwise, use some detergent and boil water in the pot - that usually gets rid of most of the crap on the inside. Then, as Bruce said, pour it down the outhouse potty hole. Some parks have sump holes, which are just plastic drain pipes leading to underground decomp pools. Take say, a paper plate (or two) and poke a bunch of little holes ... pour the water through (slowly) - particles will collect on the plate while water dribbles into the sump (cooking water is pretty much harmless, just want to keep food particles off the ground that would otherwise attract bears, wolves and jersey devils).

Young, dumb and full of........;)

With all the rain we've had, it's a pretty good bet it was soggy when it froze. Yeah wood (the water in) freezes. Plays hell with cutting tools and makes low BTU fires.

Are you going camping with us? You can cook and we'll eat (but I'll have some backup MREs just in case ;) )

Oh I dunno Slangfriend, you looked pretty handy at "Forks" whilst flame cooking your burgers :)

Maybe you should cook ;)

Eating flame charred , raw in the middle burgers is a lot easier after you consume about a half gallon of whiskey.

If I can make it, sure, I'll go. :) Roast beef sound good? Potatos and veggies? Campfire cookies and chocolate cake? (dunno where my dutch oven is though)

[inflate ego]Show y'all a lil bit of that eagle scout spirit.[/deflate]

Ok , whatever. Just remember, you carry your own gear.

Let me just clarify. This is all going to be, you know, "outside", right?


...don't bears live "outside"?

Bears? Not around slangs place... hmmm maybe that power pole fiasco in Mansfield was just a scaled up rodent elimination device?

I have pics somewhere of bears in our campsite, once in New Mexico, the other in upstate NY. Glad we hung the bear bags in the trees those days.

We had a bear break open our Playmate cooler and eat all the strawberry breakfast bars in it. Didn't touch anything else, but he sure fucked up the cooler. I still have it. The latching mechanism doesn't work anymore, but having a bear-clawed cooler makes for good campout conversation.

Hmmm...I have video of that bear...

WHATS ROUGHING IT?

The term "roughing it" refers to vigorous anal sex. If you've ever had it, you'll understand why.

Oh mannnn now I owe my boss a new keyboard!

Dave, that's a classic :)

Dagney

oy! i live right next to french creek in historic elverson, pa!

i also happen to have a working toilet. I don't know if the mrs would let me out unattended for an entire wkend, but if this happens and it happens here, i'll at least visit and bring you dry socks.

i traveled the country for 3-4 mos in late fall and camped every night. still have my gear. anyone ever heard of the "rainbow family"

best time i had was in late oct in a canyon in new mexico...hot springs, big horn sheep, naked hippie chicks (my then girlfirend/ present wife included).....

anyway, i wonder if this will come to be, i somehow doubt it.

but if it does, i have room for several tents in my back yard for those of you who cant hang in the woods

I'm considering going camping this January (if a friend of mine comes to visit), probably in the Cabinet Wilderness Area of Western Mountain. I went camping there last June, and it was incredibly beautiful. I will probably try to get advice from my father, who would from experience know exactly what I should have and do (but might also recommend not to go at all =]).

---

The Rainbow Gathering! I remember one time during my Sophomore year of High School, they had thought of holding the Rainbow Gathering in my [then] neck of the woods. I remember my humor at the reactions of some of my classmates (in my math class. Are math classes more likely not to be on topic or something?): "i'm going to have to be careful to lock my doors at night so that the hippies can't get in!" sort of comments.

My parents may have gone to a Rainbow Gathering in Tungasket at some point, but all I've seen of it is a pamplet of 'this is what the rainbow gathering is about' that my mother kept.

bears hibernate = no prob for us in winter

You don't think my snoring will wake them up?

I remember camping at Watkins Glenn, NY one rainy cold weekend in October for the US Gran Prix. Really miserable, the only relief was the heat from a burning bus. But being the pussy I am, I borrowed Dad's truck camper, loaded it on my truck and 4 of us went in comfort. It got a little warm inside so we opened the sliding side windows a couple inches. From then on all you could see was hands reaching up from below, trying to warm up next to the window. I kept flashing on "Night of the Living Dead".

option
 

I may be a little further North than everybody wants to drive but having cleared it with Pete, we'd be happy to put ya'll up for a weekend in Grifftopia. I'd be thinking late January through February so you guys wouldn't have to put up with severe mental illness man who is scheduled through the so-called "holiday" period.

Fuck yeah!!!

Sweeet!

(reasonable walking distance to the house and the Russian Fireplace, right?)

That can be arranged. :)

O.C. -Northern Tier of PA, about 30 miles from Binghamton, NY

How does -9.2 degrees F grab yah? You folks interested in doin this thing? My dark holiday mood has blown over and I'm ready to see humans again.

The thermometer currently reads 13 degrees at Northeast Philadelphia Airport...wind chill is -3.

But fuck yeah! Let's do this! Who else is up for this? Seriously...

Ain't we neighbors, Griff? I'm in NEPA too...Hazelton area.

Brian

Overnight low -14.2 F ouch.

Yeah Brian. We're maybe an hour and a half apart depending on your route. Lets talk logistics.

I had rather hoped you guys had forgotten all about this ...

This is so fucking cold even snuggling won't help ...

Forget? Ha! Of course, no one said you had to come. ;)

No way we'd do it in weather like this. It would have to be a tad warmer...at least 30s at night. So maybe next month or early March?

Logistics are pretty easy...I got plenty of space for camping and floor space indoors for the faint of heart. Only one bathroom though.

Very few neighbors and they better not complain. I didn't say anything when one decided to burn his bedding in his driveway. Rednecks...

Anyway, Dagney and I plan to hold a cookout somewhere around Independence Day this year. Earlier is doable but don't expect HER to camp out in the cold. Me either for that matter. Even my dog prefers the warm indoors to the frigid outside. But if YOU want to sit in a tent and rub noses, be my guest. Fires are permitted as long as you don't burn any structures, vehicles or woodland. That means no Straw Men!

I welcome visitors...it gets a mite lonely up here all by myself.

Brian

Aw come on Brian! Can't we burn just one car? It won't be yours...I promise.

I just wanna get out of the city for a couple of days, get back to nature a bit and hang out with some of my buddies.

So, here's what we need to figure out:

--What temperature level would be acceptable? I'm cool with 30s at night, but some of you might want it a tad warmer.

--Based on the above, do we want to set a tentative date?

--Who needs gear? I'll probably buy some stuff, but if we can share some items (tents, extra sleeping bags, etc.) and save money, that would be pretty sweet. And if we can get one person to volunteer their grill for food, that would also be cool.

--How are we going to do food, as far as purchasing or chipping in? There may be a few meals we want to commune on (e.g. donuts on Saturday morning, or something like that).

--How are we all going to get there? Most of us coming live in the Philadelphia area. I have a wagon, so I could certainly carry some gear and a couple of bodies. To get there at a decent hour on Friday evening, some of us might have to leave work early or take off on Friday (I personally would leave work early). Or we could go up Saturday morning...though to drive 3+ hours for just one night would be kinda lame.

Let's have some discussions here and we can start doing some serious planning over the next week or 2.

Holy Shit how I envy youz guys.

I wish I could spend a week or two in the wild. Have a good trip and, if it isn't too much trouble, write a daily diairy and post it. I want details - what you noticed, what you felt, what you thought you saw- what it felt like to wake up to the clean mountain air.

:(

Hazelton is 2.5 hours from Phila. Go up the NE ext and get off at Mahoning Valley. Go south on 209 towards Leheighton until you come to 93 north. That runs right through Hazelton.

Don't burn my neighbor's junkyard either, syc. He's pretty attached to his junk cars. Even though they ARE on this property, the landlord allows him to keep them here until he dies. The next day, a fleet of tow trucks will show up. That will always be a kinda dead spot due to leaking oil/fuel/acid/antifreeze etc, but it's not MINE! at least, not yet. I'm tenatively considering buying half the land and this house for a weekend retreat/project house. And this would be a good place to put my woodshop.

Anyway, I don't expect the nighttime temps to go back up to above freezing for three months yet. And don't forget the wind chill. Open fires are permitted but let's not get carried away. I have a fire pit that used to do double duty as a grill...It will be available for use if you can come up with a cooking surface...mine rusted away to nothing. Measurements available upon demand for those handy with metal.

A weekend GTG is cool with me and Dag, I'll clear it with my dog though...you might wander into his personal minefield...you have been warned!

Brian