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-   -   Most & Least Favorite Ways to Cope (http://cellar.org/showthread.php?t=3888)

Whit 09-01-2003 11:24 PM

Most & Least Favorite Ways to Cope
 
     We all cope with hordes of crap. No adult hasn't had to deal with some hellish situation or another. Be it the loss of a loved one or a relationship gone awry. Life often time does suck. This being the case means that we have to cope with it. So, what is your favorite way and what is the coping mechanism you hate the most? Oh, and if you don't mind, throw in your reasoning for it. Good and bad points are a plus too.

     My personal favorite, my emotional lifeline if you will, is humor. Make a joke. Family member dies, tell a funny story. Lose your job, make a good one liner. Cut part of your finger off and bleed everywhere, let 'em think it's a joke then surprise them with the actual damage, made me laugh anyway.
     The upside is combating the pain as well as getting you through it. In my case, at least, there's not a lot of nasty leftovers to deal with later. You ride it out with the help of a few chuckles then move on. Yeah, it hurts, often a great deal, but it'll get you by.
     The downside is that unless it's your own pain or the you are speaking to someone you are very close to who is in pain you can't do it while it's happening. At least not out loud. Let me clarify that. If someone is in pain and you crack a joke it can make things worse for them, and if you care about them it'll be worse for you too. If they cope the same way and are close to you or it's your pain you can get away with it. Feh, I hope that made sense...
     Also, it has a limit. I've been in enough emotional pain that laughter was a curiosity to me. It was like I couldn't quite remember what it meant. I was mostly shut down at that time, didn't feel anything for a while. Nasty business that. I did make a few very dark humor type comments after it was finished though

     My least favorite is not something I do, but rather something I've had to deal with a lot in my life. The habit some people have of just choking it down so they can go on. The plus is they can get through the day. The downside is that often times people will do this when something awful is done to them at a young age. They'll carry it around, somewhere under the surface then BAM! As soon as they are otherwise happy it'll reemerge as the most important thing in their life. Leaving some poor bastard (far to often me) to try to clean up the mess it makes of the person. I really hate that.

     So, I went first, who's next?

warch 09-02-2003 01:57 AM

Well, humor,too. But I've run into the situation, similar to what you describe, where "making light" is actually a kinda denial response that stuffs the real hurt away to fester and 'splode another day. So, sometimes you just gotta own the pain to make it better. And with other people, you got to honor their pain, too. (which is what I think youre saying) Raw emotion can be very uncomfortable, but that's the ride.

One thing that helps me cope if I am in a funk, feeling overwhelmed, thinking too much, etc., is lone physical activity. If its big craziness- real sweaty, stupid, repetitive hard work you can beat up on with no talking. For more minor crap, a swim is always good for zoning out. It must be tied with some sense of battling for control. Sleep better too.
Another is music.

Least favorite way- drink. It sounds good at the time, but it really doesnt help. Of course, when the shit goes down, its always there.

xoxoxoBruce 09-02-2003 03:46 AM

Everyone you meet in your travels to the grave, comes with baggage. Expect it. Accept it.
Favorite~ Isolation and chocolate.
Least favorite~ Isolation and chocolate.
Vicious circle.
:(

Griff 09-02-2003 06:16 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by warch
is lone physical activity. If its big craziness- real sweaty, stupid, repetitive hard work you can beat up on with no talking.

Yep. Splitting firewood does the job and it ends up being useful. Unfortunately, I've had a good year so my wood pile isn't what it should be. Cycling does the job for little things and minor chemical imbalances, endorphins are our friends. No matter how many times I try the bottle, it does little but loosen the tongue, usually inappropriately.

juju 09-02-2003 07:20 AM

My favorite coping mechanism is to just abandon the situation. This works especially well in arguments. I leave -- and there's no more argument! I don't just do it with arguments, though. I tend to avoid bad situations in general. The downside of course is that it's sort of a short-term solution (abeit a perfect one). But of course nothing really gets resolved in this way, so it's really more of a delaying mechanism.

My wife doesn't let me do this anymore, so I think I'm being slowly weaned off the behavior.

One of Kathy's coping mechanisms is to constantly worry. She'll imagine some horrible potetial scenario and then start fretting and stressing out about it. And it doesn't go away, she just keeps letting the worry get to her. It's really annoying, because it doesn't really solve anything, and it has no upside as far as I can see.

Undertoad 09-02-2003 07:30 AM

Constant worry is generalized anxiety disorder. It has no upside whatsoever. This can lead to my favorite way to cope:

http://cellar.org/2003/paxil.gif

russotto 09-02-2003 09:20 AM

A real graphics wiz would do this, but since I suck at graphics you'll have to imagine it yourself.

"Marijuana" <-- large stylized font
(inhaled delta-9-tetrahydrocannibinol) <-- small font

But actually that's my so-called sense of humor. I really just curse and fume and sulk and very occasionally break things.

warch 09-02-2003 10:52 AM

Reading about generalized anxiety disorder, the power of self talking is interesting. I certainly understand some of the tendency towards worry, social discomfort, fear of failure, and the way to chip away at it, to not control, but redirect your thinking in a more positive way. Catch it before it gets away. Hard stuff that sounds too simple.

Whit 09-02-2003 11:02 AM

Quote:

From Warch:
But I've run into the situation, similar to what you describe, where "making light" is actually a kinda denial response that stuffs the real hurt away to fester and 'splode another day. So, sometimes you just gotta own the pain to make it better.(which is what I think youre saying)
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Yeah, with me at least humor really is my method to 'own the pain'. (I like that phrase, it really clics with me. I think I'll run with it) It lightens the load a bit but it also lays claim to it. Of course in the case of the pain being someone elses it's an attempt to help them make it theirs. I admit I have often seen people use it to distance from the pain like the denial you describe but that's just silly in MHO. Feel it, deal with it, get it done.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Actually, I like the physical exertion method. Working a heavy bag is pretty ideal too, though it's not as useful as chopping wood. Running works too, with no equipment.
Quote:

Also from Warch:
Raw emotion can be very uncomfortable, but that's the ride.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Just so you know Warch, I'm stealing this line. You may not see me use it but I promise I will in verbal conversations. I can think of a couple of people that need to hear that...
Quote:

From Griff:
Unfortunately, I've had a good year so my wood pile isn't what it should be.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Careful what you wish for dude...

xoxoxoBruce 09-02-2003 04:10 PM

Quote:

Raw emotion can be very uncomfortable, but that's the ride.
Sounds like a Harley Davidson commercial.:D

Elspode 09-03-2003 12:06 AM

I used to use drugs and alcohol. Now I use medications and computer time.

The secret to coping is suviving through it all long enough to look back and realize that it could have been worse.

Whit 09-03-2003 12:32 AM

Quote:

From Ep:
I used to use drugs and alcohol.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;"I'd rather have this bottle in front of me than have a frontal lobotomy"?

xoxoxoBruce 09-03-2003 04:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Elspode
The secret to coping is suviving through it all long enough to look back and realize that it could have been worse.
That depends on your meds. Looking back and realizing it could have been better, often much better, is not fun. :(

elSicomoro 09-03-2003 05:33 PM

Least favorite way to cope: Killing people...always hate it when I wind up killing someone due to my temper...

Favorite ways to cope: Humor...I was cracking 9/11 jokes the day after. Reflecting on what happened, learning what I can from it, and moving forward in tandem with humor works best. Writing used to do the trick, though I haven't felt inspired enough to do that lately.

SteveDallas 09-03-2003 06:38 PM

Humor here too, but I also just try to escape temporarily. If I have a shit storm at work, fine, I can't do anything about it at home, I just try to watch a movie or read or surf and put it out of my mind until I am able to address the situation.

Whit 09-03-2003 11:45 PM

Quote:

From Syc:
Least favorite way to cope: Killing people...always hate it when I wind up killing someone due to my temper...
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Ya big fibber, the only reason you might hate it is body disposal is such a pain. Otherwise, ya love it and ya know it.

warch 09-04-2003 10:22 AM

The Rant.
I admire someone who can vent by pulling together an articulate, layered, and seething rant.
If done with humor, well, it's pure gold.

OnyxCougar 09-04-2003 10:49 AM

I shut down. Stop talking to everyone, go into serious reclusion. I'm one of those brooding types. I overanalyse, find some way to feel guilty, and awhile later (depending on the severity of the situation) I emerge with a smile on my face, cracking jokes and making light of it.

juju 09-04-2003 11:16 AM

When you say you "shut down", what do you mean, exactly? Do you lay on the bed and stare at the ceiling, thinking about your problem all day? Or does that mean that you just prefer to be alone for a while? Are you extremely unhappy and depressed while it's going on, or are you content but just figuring things out?

OnyxCougar 09-04-2003 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by juju
When you say you "shut down", what do you mean, exactly? Do you lay on the bed and stare at the ceiling, thinking about your problem all day? Or does that mean that you just prefer to be alone for a while? Are you extremely unhappy and depressed while it's going on, or are you content but just figuring things out?
I shut down as in isolate myself, lay on my bed and cry for long periods of time. This is the point where I begin to overanalyse. "How did this happen? How were my actions a part of what transpired? How could I have changed it? What can I do to avoid this in the future?"

If I have to work, I work and don't talk to anyone. I have my "everything is ok" face on and nod, but stay locked in my own little world, working on the problem.

juju 09-04-2003 12:30 PM

That really doesn't sound very effective. I'm guessing that maybe you take things a little bit harder than is neccessary? Life does go on, you know.

I personally try to employ a strategy where I emphasis the good things and don't pay much attention to the bad things. It's hard to get used to doing that, but I think it really is psychologically healthy.

I mean, usually, when something bad happens, there's only a very limited number of things you can actually do about it. There comes a point where any further dwelling on said bad thing only makes you feel worse.

elSicomoro 09-04-2003 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Whit
Ya big fibber, the only reason you might hate it is body disposal is such a pain. Otherwise, ya love it and ya know it.
Well, shit...you got me.

zippyt 09-04-2003 06:53 PM

I try not to explode over little things that iratate me , and lord knows there are a lot of them . I tend to hold it all in side untill i can use all that energy for a good purpose . Forntunly i work on scales and have to shift around a lot of 50lb weights all the time , or swing a sledge hammer .
I have made a 1"thick x 3'x2' steel bace plate jump a foot or more in the air like this . My co-workers have learned to just step out of the way . I figured this out when i was young and my Mom and big sister would fight . I couldn't take eather side or else i would just get cought in the middle , so i would just go split logs . We always had PLENTY of fire wood !!!

Whit 09-04-2003 11:02 PM

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Onyx, if I may ask, does the shutting down method actually get you over it, or is it just a system to bury it? By bury it I mean submerge it somewhere where it might reemerge later.

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Damn Zip, that's one hell of a plate for you to be banging on. Nice heigth on that jump by the way. Keep your toes clear.

darclauz 09-24-2003 10:40 PM

1 Attachment(s)
i cope 3 ways -- emotional outburst, yelling or tears.... temper tantrum.

go somewhere cold and dark, and sit till i'm feeling better...fall is the best season for that...

or sneak into my daughter's room when she's asleep, stroke her hair and listen to her breathe.

dave 09-25-2003 06:21 AM

She looks like she was dancing. But kids always look like that.

Elspode 09-25-2003 05:24 PM

Cute young'un!

Whit 09-25-2003 11:32 PM

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Cute kid, indeed. Though judging from her expression, one that's up to something...
Quote:

From Darclauz:
...sneak into my daughter's room when she's asleep, stroke her hair and listen to her breathe.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; My own daughter can brighten my darkest day with a hug. It's a pity that they'll grow up and we lose this. Oh well, we'll likely get grandkids out of it... wait... that doesn't look as good on screen as it did in my head...

Nathan Barnes 09-26-2003 12:42 PM

I alternate between burying myself in work, slacking off from work, punching the heavy bag in the garage and going somewhere "everybody knows my name".

Of course, Conway is in a dry county so that place is the corner coffee shop. I guess I jitter in my sorrows instead of wallowing in them.

My least favorite would be booze. I may feel better if I go drinking with sympathetic friends, but it's really the sympathetic friends that help, the booze just makes us whiny.

daniwong 09-26-2003 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by OnyxCougar


I shut down as in isolate myself, lay on my bed and cry for long periods of time. This is the point where I begin to overanalyse. "How did this happen? How were my actions a part of what transpired? How could I have changed it? What can I do to avoid this in the future?"

If I have to work, I work and don't talk to anyone. I have my "everything is ok" face on and nod, but stay locked in my own little world, working on the problem.

Onyx - I cope in the exact same way. If its little shit - I make a joke. If its big - like recently my Grandfather died - I pushed on and organized everything, helped out my grandma and then completely shut myself down for a couple of days. Don't even necessarily think about anything - just shut down. Worried my BF sick - but after I had to explain to him how I cope with stuff. I go into my hole, sort everything out, and won't come out until I have a handle on it.

Whit 09-26-2003 10:15 PM

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Hey, a chance to reask an old question. Since you use the same method, Dani, maybe you can tell me. Onyx didn't answer...
Quote:

From me:
Onyx, if I may ask, does the shutting down method actually get you over it, or is it just a system to bury it? By bury it I mean submerge it somewhere where it might reemerge later.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; For the record, my curiosity stems from thinking this sounds a lot like my least favorite method listed above. I may be way off though. Just want to know if I am or not.

OnyxCougar 09-27-2003 01:58 PM

Sorry, Whit, didn't see it.

It depends on whether or not the shutting down process was interrupted. If it's allowed to go on until it's done, then I'm actually over it. If it's interrupted, like it was when Steven (the fiancee, not the current husband) was killed, then it just reemerges. I'm only now, 12 years later, getting over that, mostly because I was told by my husband at the time to "deal with it and move on", and I wasn't allowed to grieve. So the time from then to now has been resolving things little teeny bit by bit.


daniwong 09-29-2003 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Whit
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Hey, a chance to reask an old question. Since you use the same method, Dani, maybe you can tell me. Onyx didn't answer... &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; For the record, my curiosity stems from thinking this sounds a lot like my least favorite method listed above. I may be way off though. Just want to know if I am or not.
Well - its kinda the same as Onyx. Except when I go into my deep dark hole - it is to gain an understanding of what happened in order to be able to move forward by figuring out how to deal with it. And if that made no sense - I sorry.

Whit 09-29-2003 09:54 PM

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Thanks Onyx and Dani. The suggestion then, is that my experience has been with people that didn't get to cope like that completely then. they got cut off and are having to deal slowly. That makes sense.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; If I can ask another, if you can't use this method Onyx said she was " resolving things little teeny bit by bit" any suggestions as to how someone might do this? I mean if they seem to be locked up, how do you get the ball rolling?
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I really appreciate any help. I've never understood what the hell was going on with these people. Any help you can give me will hopefully help them. Thanks again.

daniwong 09-30-2003 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Whit
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Thanks Onyx and Dani. The suggestion then, is that my experience has been with people that didn't get to cope like that completely then. they got cut off and are having to deal slowly. That makes sense.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; If I can ask another, if you can't use this method Onyx said she was " resolving things little teeny bit by bit" any suggestions as to how someone might do this? I mean if they seem to be locked up, how do you get the ball rolling?
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I really appreciate any help. I've never understood what the hell was going on with these people. Any help you can give me will hopefully help them. Thanks again.

Personally - no one can get my shit together but me. All I have ever wanted when I have come out of the hole with my own understanding of a situation is for a person to listen. The important thing is that your spouse/significant other know that this is how you cope and deal with things. trust me - explaining this to the other one really helps with relationships as I have found out the hard way. (Because they think your pissed at them and your not. Blah blah.)

OnyxCougar 09-30-2003 07:23 PM

I agree with Dani. If my husband at the time had been more supportive and helped me through it, I'm sure it would have been much easier for me to deal with the whole thing. Instead, I was told curtly to "move on" and "I don't understand why this is such a big deal to you."

Well, it wasn't his job to understand why it's a big deal to me, just that it WAS a big deal, and it was his job, as my (loving) husband to care about me enough to just listen. I had no friends at the time, and he didn't want to hear it.

So I would say, if you have a close friend/spose/S.O. that is having some sort of meltdown, the BEST thing is to understand that it's ok not to know why they are melting down, just that they ARE, and be there for them, just to listen (not to SOLVE the problem, just listen to it and be supportive). Extra hugs or cuddles is good (if we're talking about a female and she appreciates that sort of thing), or maybe just going out for a beer or something.

xoxoxoBruce 09-30-2003 07:57 PM

It sure as hell doesn't help when we say what's wrong and you say "nothing" while you're melting down. Give us a damn clue, will ya.:p

OnyxCougar 09-30-2003 08:05 PM

Well, I've never been one of those types of people. I've never been the kind of person that thinks you should be able to read my mind. I'll tell you what my problem is.

daniwong 10-01-2003 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by OnyxCougar
Well, I've never been one of those types of people. I've never been the kind of person that thinks you should be able to read my mind. I'll tell you what my problem is.
Ditto - again school of hard knocks - learned this the hard way. I know my BF is not a mind reader. But - if I'm pissed - I tend to try and cool down and think my way through it and then have a normal conversation as opposed to a screaming match. Kinda drives him buggy. I don't yell and I don't like having angry discussions - nothing is solved. He made the comment once that I was an "Ice princess" and that nothing fazed me. While it is true that I tend not to let little shit bother me, I also don't like having anger taken out on me - so I don't do it to others. Drives him buggy because I won't fight with him. LOL.

Whit 10-02-2003 12:40 AM

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Ack... Just listen? But ... but ... if there's a problem ... it ... must be ... fixed...

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I hear ya though. I just know a particular person that really needs to go deal with some bad stuff in her past. I just don't know how to get her to start dealing. I don't mean in a "get over it" way. I mean it in a, "You've really been hurt, but you're sabotaging your happiness now, it's time to deal with it" way. Also, I can't be there to listen, actually, even if I could I don't want to be there to listen. But it's affecting others close to me. Kind of a quandry.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; It was a long shot but I had to try. Thanks anyway.

daniwong 10-02-2003 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Whit
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Ack... Just listen? But ... but ... if there's a problem ... it ... must be ... fixed...

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I hear ya though. I just know a particular person that really needs to go deal with some bad stuff in her past. I just don't know how to get her to start dealing. I don't mean in a "get over it" way. I mean it in a, "You've really been hurt, but you're sabotaging your happiness now, it's time to deal with it" way. Also, I can't be there to listen, actually, even if I could I don't want to be there to listen. But it's affecting others close to me. Kind of a quandry.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; It was a long shot but I had to try. Thanks anyway.

Wowsers- I never thought of a problem like that. Hmmm. If it was me - and its not but hell you are getting my opinion anyway - if you had just said that the "you've really been hurt, but you're sabotaging...etc" to me - and if I am not aware that this is what I am doing - then that could be the light bulb. Have you tried this? And again - if it was me being you- I would make sure that I came at it from a "I really care about you and this is worrying me because...." type of a standpoint.

Whit 10-03-2003 12:13 AM

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Yeah, I tried that a while back and it worked for a while. She entered therapy and everything. She's since dropped it and returned to the emotional downward spiral. Even gotten engaged to a guy that treats her like shit and her son hates.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I guess more info is in order. "She" is my daughters mom and I've been raising her son since he was four, he's ten now. I'm the one he turns to for help, I'm the one he chose to help guide him through his young life.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I'd be happier if I never had to see her agian, but with the kids that's not how it works. I bear her no ill will, I really wish her the best, just don't want to be there for it. The kids though, I have a responsibility to them and I love them too dearly to let my feelings get in the way of the job of being 'Dad.'
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; The bright side is that the worse she gets, the more I get the kids. Sadly, I'm not a big enough bastard to push my advantage. I'd much rather they have a healthy, loving relationship with their mom. The problem is trying to help her from a distance.

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; For the record, if I post it then you are free to respond to it. It would be stupid to post and not want a response, so fire away.

daniwong 10-03-2003 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Whit
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Yeah, I tried that a while back and it worked for a while. She entered therapy and everything. She's since dropped it and returned to the emotional downward spiral. Even gotten engaged to a guy that treats her like shit and her son hates.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I guess more info is in order. "She" is my daughters mom and I've been raising her son since he was four, he's ten now. I'm the one he turns to for help, I'm the one he chose to help guide him through his young life.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I'd be happier if I never had to see her agian, but with the kids that's not how it works. I bear her no ill will, I really wish her the best, just don't want to be there for it. The kids though, I have a responsibility to them and I love them too dearly to let my feelings get in the way of the job of being 'Dad.'
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; The bright side is that the worse she gets, the more I get the kids. Sadly, I'm not a big enough bastard to push my advantage. I'd much rather they have a healthy, loving relationship with their mom. The problem is trying to help her from a distance.

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; For the record, if I post it then you are free to respond to it. It would be stupid to post and not want a response, so fire away.

Again - wowsers. Its good that you are not a bastard and it is good that you want to help your kids have a normal stable family life. However, since it has been mentioned to her before, it seems like the downward spiral is going to continue until she decides she wants out of it. All I can suggest is keep being the fine upstanding father that you are and offer her support from a distance and when she does try and get out of her funk, send her even more support. Thats my opinion.

Whit 10-03-2003 07:21 PM

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Heh, actually I think I'm not a complete bastard because I want to help my kids have a normal stable family life. I openly admit that I'm a half-bastard, it even used to be part of my user-title. Hey, what is a normal family anyway...?
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I'll try to help. The way I figure it the worse she gets the more I'll have the kids. It's a win-win situation for me. What is important here is that I shield the kids from the worst of it one way or another.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Anyway, thanks for your input. I do appreciate it.

xoxoxoBruce 10-03-2003 07:30 PM

Whit, you're a damn fool. I have tremendous admiration for your ability to do what you're doing. Hope it works out, especially for the kids sake.:beer:

OnyxCougar 10-03-2003 07:35 PM

As a person who got emotionally and physically abused for around 2 years, and not aware of the specifics of your situation, let me give you this kernel of Onyx Wisdom:

No one will allow themselves to be helped if they don't really want it.

No matter what you do, how much you beg, plead or threaten, it won't happen until she wants to get of where she is.

I call it "I have had enough."

I stayed with that freak until "I" had had "enough" of his bullshit. At that point, I was ready for help. Up until that point, nothing you could have said or done would have convinced me to even consider leaving. Even tho I was getting cut on, even tho I was getting verbally beat down, even tho he was dislocating joints as a teaching tool. Didn't matter. Until I had enough.

So in the meantime, be there for the kids like it sounds like you're doing, and hope she gets enough soon enough to enjoy her kids, too.

Whit 10-03-2003 11:43 PM

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Being there for the kids is natural to me. Kids and I are just drawn to each other. Random children see me as a really cool jungle jim, and truthfully I really like throwing a kid around a bit. I've been accused of being a really big kid on many occasions.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; With my own kids I'm worse than a mind reader. The boy once said something about not understanding why people use so much foul language, I laughed and said, "Like you, on the playground, with your friends when the teachers not around?" His whole body went rigid, and I could see the panic in his eyes. The not knowing how I knew. Like I was never a ten year old boy...

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; As for his mom, I'll help if she ever wishes me to, as I have in the past. It's one of those horribly complex adult things. The better she feels about herself, the more she tends to want to spend time around me. The lower her self-esteem, the more spiteful she is and she tends to talk badly of me when I'm not around. The really nasty catch is, if she spends to much time around me she tends to start feeling bad about herself again, and I don't know why. I have a few theories but that's all they are. Of course, if I refuse to spend time around her then it's a serious blow to her self-esteem. Pitfalls all around.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I'm quite glad that she's engaged as it gives me a reason to not be around without context. I don't know how it'll work out in the long run though. Also, the boy is going to go to war with this guy when he starts coming around more, or eventually moves in.
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; So it's all screwed up, from the adult side it's good for me. Gives me a break from a really weird relationship. From the kid side it really sucks. Unhappy kids isn't something I'm willing to accept. Just to put the bow on this Gordian knot, I believe that as a result of the fight the boy will eventually put up he'll wind up living with me, unofficially of course. Which I want, but will probably leave him with a slew of abandonment issues.

&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Gah, I wish I was young enough to not be expected to understand any of this...
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Thanks for the chance to vent.

daniwong 10-09-2003 01:49 PM

Whit - I wish the same thing. Being an adult is hard work. Being a "stepmother" type is really really hard work. (Had to answer the 12 year old when she asked what a "blow job" was.) I just wanna be 10 again and have a very sqewed view of reality. I'm tired of being a grown up.

Ok - done whining.

juju 10-09-2003 02:05 PM

Did you explain it or dance around the issue?

OnyxCougar 10-09-2003 02:07 PM

And if you did explain it, HOW did you explain it?

dave 10-09-2003 03:47 PM

And also, would you please demonstrate it to me?

daniwong 10-09-2003 06:45 PM

Well - I asked her - do you want the honest true explanation or the explanation my mom would have given me? Her comment (she is such my child) "well - lets go for the truth and if I don't like that I will go for the other one." So I told her (almost in clinical terms - didn't want to have to explain any more slang) and her comment was

EEEEWWWWWWWW!!! YYYYYUUUUUKKKKKK! Thats disgusting!!!!! GROOOOOSSSSSS! (I laughed)

And then I asked her - now my mom's version would have been "when a man and a woman love each other, and they are married yadda yadda". She agreed that the truth was better. And then she asked "don't these women know that they pee out of that??!!" I just about peed my pants I was laughing so hard.

I always find with kids - honesty is the best policy. Otherwise they get a screwed up version from some kid out on the playground.

Also, because I told my BF and his ex that she had asked - the BF freaked out (she's his little girl) The ex asked if she could send the kids to me from now on with sex & "female" questions cause she gets all flustered.

daniwong 10-09-2003 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by OnyxCougar
And if you did explain it, HOW did you explain it?
Well - first I asked if she knew what sex was. (she has been through health class) And she did. And I asked her if she knew what the male orgasm/female orgasm was. She knew the male orgasm - but typical public school - didn't know what the female one was. So - I put the female orgasm aside for a bit - and explained that there are many ways a male can experience an orgasm. I explained that sex was one way, a "hand job" was another, and a "blow job" was still another.

Then I got into the female orgasm and explained that it is something that normally women have to figure out themselves first how to have - and then maybe if they are lucky - will have during sex.

I'm an honest blunt person. But - being that the 12 year old is so much like me its easy. If the 8 year old had asked - I would have put a softer spin on it.

Undertoad 10-09-2003 07:11 PM

A great approach! It is so much better to hear a sincere adult answer. She'll know that you're the honest one, the one who respects her, and that she can talk frankly about these kinds of things with you. And she won't get some weird nonsense in her head from getting the story from other kids.

And when she grows up she won't think of sex as something half-mystery, half-evil, so she'll be more realistic about it and she'll have the right tools to make good decisions.

dave 10-09-2003 07:18 PM

When I was young, I heard the word "whore". I asked my mom what it meant, and she said "a girl that's not nice". Hilarity ensues, of course, when I tell my friends I know what the word means and am way off base. Talk about being embarrassed.

OnyxCougar 10-09-2003 07:39 PM

I grew up with my dad during the "sex talk" years, and while he could discuss everything else with me, he approached me like this one day when I was 16:

"I made an appointment for you today at the Doctor."
"Why? Am I sick?"
"No, but you're getting ripe now and you need to see the Doctor."
"Ripe? What am I, a fruit now?"
"No, you know.... ripe ...."
I blinked at him for a moment, "Ripe? Like I stink and I'm ripe?"
"No!! You know, becoming a woman?"
"OH! RIPE. Geez, Dad. Is this the bees portion of the birds and the bees? What is the fruit analogy? You could have said blossoming flower or something."
"Look, just be at this doctor," he handed me the gyno's card, "and let me know if they need signatures or anything."
"OK Dad. They'll probably need one for birth control."
"Why would they need that?"
"Never mind, Daddy. I'm going to my room now. The one with no boys in it."
"Good Deal. I'll test you on your code tonight after the 'net, and if you talk to KD7RDR, tell her I said 88's."
"OK, Daddy."

I was pregnant about 3 months later.

juju 10-10-2003 01:30 AM

This may be a really dumb, naive question.

Are there any sort of laws about telling your kids about sex? I mean, don't people freak out about that sort of thing? I could just see some parent being hauled off to jail for telling their kid what a penis, vagina, and orgasm is. The kids goes to school and mentions it, the teacher calls social services, and your kids are whisked away, right?

Dagney 10-10-2003 06:56 AM

I think that would happen if you actually use the "Show" part of the whole "show and tell" concept.

dags

Griff 10-10-2003 07:18 AM

Juju anywhere outside Arkansas you can feel free to have the sex talks with your kids. Pete and I combined our backgrounds on this one. Her folks were the flood the kid with info and books young types, whereas mine were more see what that bull is doing there? Anyway we're doing our best to make it natural human/mammal stuff and the girls will understand that any little males who show up around here are subject to all manner of police state tactics.

darclauz 10-10-2003 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by juju
This may be a really dumb, naive question.

Are there any sort of laws about telling your kids about sex? I mean, don't people freak out about that sort of thing? I could just see some parent being hauled off to jail for telling their kid what a penis, vagina, and orgasm is. The kids goes to school and mentions it, the teacher calls social services, and your kids are whisked away, right?

ummm...ya don't tell them about the orgasm part.

just the other stuff.

that's NEVER covered in sex ed... =)


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