The Cellar

The Cellar (http://cellar.org/index.php)
-   The Internet (http://cellar.org/forumdisplay.php?f=8)
-   -   BuyMusic.com (http://cellar.org/showthread.php?t=3709)

Tobiasly 07-22-2003 09:02 AM

BuyMusic.com
 
So, this new music download service was launched today. Songs as cheap as 79 cents each, and albums as cheap as $7.95.

So, the first thing that happens when I try to check it out (I'm using Mozilla Firebird) is that it tells me I have to be using IE on Windows. I also need Windows Media Player 9, apparently.

Different tracks/albums have different restrictions. For example, one album I searched for said I could download it to three other computers, transfer it to unlimited portable music players (as long as they're "SDMI" compliant, which I'm assuming is Microsoft's DRM system), and burn up to 3 copies to CD.

Of course, I'm wondering why you can't just burn a CD, rip the CD, and do whatever you want with it. Or does it somehow burn copy-protected CD's?

dave 07-22-2003 09:15 AM

The only thing I see really wrong with this is the funny licensing on various songs. Some you can't burn to CD; some you can't take on a portable player. The most popular player, the iPod, is left out.

Otherwise, it seems as if they're pretty well doing it right. Just get that licensing thing worked out (easier said than done) and I'd probably find it useful.

Undertoad 07-22-2003 09:26 AM

From buy.com, the people who pioneered shitty service at low prices on the Internet.

russotto 07-22-2003 10:05 AM

Forget it. Buying music in any form is just feeding the RIAA in their quest to strike terror into the hearts of geeks everywhere (not to mention put some not-insignificant number in prison).

Tobiasly 07-22-2003 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by dave
The only thing I see really wrong with this is the funny licensing on various songs. Some you can't burn to CD; some you can't take on a portable player. The most popular player, the iPod, is left out.

Otherwise, it seems as if they're pretty well doing it right. Just get that licensing thing worked out (easier said than done) and I'd probably find it useful.

You're right about the easier-said-than-done part.

As far as the iPod, they have said that they specifically have no intention of supporting Apple. Yes, they're missing out on a lot of users, but I guess they figure they're not going to beat iTunes on their own turf. On the flip side though, I would say that I'd be very interested in iTunes if only they would support Windows users!

The article also explains the funny licensing. I guess they couldn't get all the labels to agree on consistent terms.

Tobiasly 07-22-2003 10:32 AM

I looked into them a bit further... their minimum system requirements states that they require a "Pentium Class PC computer. Our music downloads are not compatible with any Mac OS. Pentium class is required for individualization settings to enable music licenses."

I take it from this last sentence that they are using the hard-coded Pentium ID tag built into those chips. I wonder if this means Athlon users are out of luck? If so, this means they aren't going to be reaching anywhere near the "97 percent of people with PCs" as they claim!

Does anyone know if Windows Media Player 9's CD burning feature employs any sort of DRM? If not, does there exist any sort of software that can emulate a CD-R on a hard drive? I've seen "virtual CD" programs before that can mount a directory to make it look like a CD-ROM, but didn't know if they existed for burning also. That would make it rather trivial to "burn" to one's hard drive, then copy it to any format desired.

Tobiasly 07-22-2003 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by russotto
Forget it. Buying music in any form is just feeding the RIAA in their quest to strike terror into the hearts of geeks everywhere (not to mention put some not-insignificant number in prison).
Unfortunately, the RIAA still controls the music industry. Hopefully someday that will no longer be the case, but until it is, the artists still have to get paid. What sort of alternative do you propose? Only listening to music that you can buy directly from the artist?

Griff 07-22-2003 10:45 AM

related topic
 
Looks like Boston College and MIT are willing to throw lawyers at the situation.

dave 07-22-2003 10:51 AM

iTunes for Windows will be available before the end of the year, so you should be good to go after that. :)

Undertoad 07-22-2003 10:58 AM

I haven't listened to it yet but iTunes' AAC encoding is getting better reviews than WMA and MP3. This is important because when you "burn" from services like these, you are not getting the original, but a song that has been through a codec and back to get to a CD.

Tobiasly 07-22-2003 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by dave
iTunes for Windows will be available before the end of the year, so you should be good to go after that.
I thought they had mentioned that before but wasn't sure and was too lazy to look it up. Do you know if it will support other players than iPod? If so, what type of DRM will it use?

Tobiasly 07-22-2003 11:23 AM

Re: related topic
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Griff
Looks like Boston College and MIT are willing to throw lawyers at the situation.
Griff, did you mean to post this in vsp's thread?

Griff 07-22-2003 11:27 AM

DULP!!!

dave 07-22-2003 11:30 AM

I think it'll support any players that support AAC. Right now, that's just the iPod, but I'm sure they'd let others license it.

You can burn unlimited CDs, but if the playlist includes a purchased song, you can only burn it 10 times before mixing it up - i.e., switching tracks 1 and 2 around. You can get around this, obviously, by just copying the CD instead of burning from within iTunes.

You can only copy the music to three computers. After that, you have to disable the music on one computer to copy it to a fourth.

That's about it, really.

arz 07-22-2003 12:12 PM

AAC is MPEG-4 Audio, so it's a standard that can be ported to current MP3 players that have updatable codecs if the manufacturer wants to.

The DRM present on iTunes Music Store m4a files (the AAC file extension) is relatively easy to circumvent, too. There are a few Apple iPod sites "out there" that discuss it.

vsp 07-23-2003 02:55 PM

Checked it out today. I threw a few fairly-random artists from my music collection at it, just to see what would turn up.

YES:

Mighty Mighty Bosstones (nearly the full library, including some benefit-CD tracks)
Quarterflash (had the Greatest Hits comp, which had the single I was looking for)
Jimmy Buffett (pretty good selection, though it'd be much cheaper to buy my long-lost boxed set from FYE, since it's per-track only here)

SORTA:

Kansas (the album I looked up had about half of its tracks available)
Replacements (two decent albums listed, tracks missing from Tim, all early albums are missing)
Fishbone (some tracks missing, critical early albums and newest stuff not listed)
Tubes (had the Greatest Hits comp, which fills many gaps, but little else)
the assorted P-Funk (had some Parliament, very little George Clinton, no Funkadelic, very little Bootsy)
Buzzcocks (about four or five songs, that's all)
Bela Fleck & the Flecktones (one album, not the one I wanted)

NO:

Frank Zappa (ouch. That's only, what, eighty albums missing?)
XTC (ouch again.)
Southern Culture on the Skids (two albums listed, but not available for download)
NOFX (probably not that surprising)
George Carlin (not exactly music, but since I buy his CDs in music stores...)
Specials (not found)

Survey says... I hope they can do better than that in the long run.

SteveDallas 07-23-2003 05:46 PM

I checked it out too.

The classical selection bites. They don't even list Classical as a choice on their menu bar, but it's there if you search for individual discs. There's no opera, and a seemingly random smattering of warhorses. For example, only one Hindemith disc (I already have it). OK, well, Hindemith is icky and modern , how about Tchaikovsky? Not much better. No opera at all.

And the pricing is screwy. Take a disc of Mozart concertos that I found when I tried to look up on of my favorite clarinetists, Sabine Meyer. Now, folks, if any of you have even HEARD the name Sabine Meyer before and you're not a clarinet player, I'll give you a gold star. But the tracks on this disc are $1.99 a piece. By comparison, the Beach Boys albums are going for $0.99 a track. For another example, take a disc of two Ives symphonies. The tracks (9 of them) are $0.99 each... or you can download the whole album for $9.49. Unless my math is deficient, (9 x $0.99) < $9.49.

For the time being at least I still consider emusic.com to be a good value. They have a better selection of classical than anybody else online, plus other stuff I'm interested in here and there. (Check it out, vsp, they have 20 or so Carlin albums!!) Their selection tends to be quirkier since they don't have all the major labels, but that's fine with me because since I bought my first CD back in 1988 (I didn't even have a player at the time) I've pretty much bought a copy of all the common things that I'm interested in. So anything that's likely to pique my interest is probably somehting a little offbeat.

Happy Monkey 07-23-2003 06:48 PM

Can I have a gold star?
 
Oh, wait. That's OSCAR Meyer. But it's still good music.

Undertoad 07-30-2003 08:56 AM

From buy.com, the people who pioneered shitty service at low prices on the Internet.

A week later, bad customer service report from buymusic.com

elSicomoro 09-13-2003 02:46 PM

I've been using buymusic.com for a few weeks now. So far, the experience has been good. The only problem I've had is with a Leonard Cohen song I downloaded last week--some encoding issue. It took them 3 days to respond to my e-mail, but the issue was resolved. Right now, they're running a "Buy 4 songs, get a 5th free" promo.

I've had no problems running an Athlon, Tob. What is this one, UT? A 1700?

The use provisions are a bit quirky--for example, the Universal songs I've downloaded can only be downloaded to one computer, but have unlimited transfers and burns. The Sony songs allows 3 computers, but only 5 burns and 5 transfers. I've only run across a few quirky situations thus far, e.g. you can only get some songs if you buy the entire album.

Too bad they don't offer a Paypal setup though--I'd rather go with that than a credit card.

Tobiasly 09-14-2003 07:22 AM

Thanks for the update syc. My <a href="http://www.neurosaudio.com/">MP3 player</a> doesn't yet support WMA DRM, but I'll surely keep an eye on it!

SteveDallas 09-15-2003 09:26 AM

An interesting article on buymusic.com's privacy policy.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:19 AM.

Powered by: vBulletin Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.