Stand up or GTFO.
 

Kapernick can suck it. So can the pc media that is afraid to offend anyone by treating an asshole like an asshole.

You wanna take a political stance? Fine. Do it in a political arena. Retire from the game and join Black Lives Matter with your woman. Refuse to honor the country that makes your rich man life style possible and you look like a hypocritical asshole.

Why not burn a flag, Colin, ya cunt?

The niners might have cut him for being bad at his job, but now they'll have to consider the reaction of the public if they do. He has regressed steadily since losing the super bowl, and lost his job to Gabbert. I hope they have the bawls to make their football decisions without feeling pressure from the pussified public opinion.

I stand when its played so I don't offend anyone who has served. It is however just a flag and just a song and the values they supposedly and apparently less and less over time actually represent include free speech. I was that dick who sat through the flag worship in high school. All this nationalistic bullshit makes it easier for politicians to get young people killed. When this country does great things the flag and the song stir me. When this country does terrible things and tries to wrap it in a flag it does not. I don't know Colin from Adam and I think Black Lives Matters should have added "too" to their name but we do have things to talk about in this country and he maybe just isn't feeling that Hitler Youthy right now. Does it not strike anyone else as strange that we do the SSB with full military regalia before private for profit events? If they sang it in German we'd all reflect.

just me being a dick

I don't think you're being a dick, Griff.
I don't think LJ is either to be fair.

We don't have the same issues with flag & anthem over here, so for me it was a really peculiar thing to read about. A piece of cloth and a song?
But then also - a country that still feels so divided?
And then again a young man paid more than I will EVER earn in my life making such a pathetic gesture? If you care that much little boi, go out and DO something. Give some of your lovely loot to the families who are affected, and stand up with everyone else and keep your mouth shut.

But what do I know? I'm sat in a public funded library. I can afford to eat thanks to the Government benefits and a generous friend. I've just had 16 days in hospital I didn't pay a penny for.
And I was born white and English, and if I believed in God I'd thank him for that. Except maybe I might ask to be Welsh. And to have had an intolerance to alcohol.

this

The NFL is entertainment. If he's pissing off the viewers so they stop watching, then that hurts the NFL and if he hurts the NFL more than he helps them, he's gonna get kicked to the curb.

Our country is fairly divided. If we can be reminded now and then that we are all Americans and in this together, I think that's a good thing. I've got no problem with the flag stuff at games. I think it's nice.

I don't like the military stuff at games. The military is only a small fraction of what this country is about. It's a recruiting gig for them. Business. Plain and simple, just like the NFL is business, plain and simple.

He's a fool. We are all talking about him and not his cause.

Guess what oh you'll never guess I'll just tellya.

Honoring the troops? Jet fly-over? Flag ceremony? The military pays the NFL for all that stuff.

I prefer someone who wraps themself up in the flag. And then burns the flag. It make a better show.

I clearly remember what happened with Mahmoud Abdul-Rauf 20 years ago.

I love our country, and am happy to stand up during the National Anthem. But I also understand why someone like Colin Kaepernick takes issue with that. This is one of the best articles I've seen that talks about it: http://theundefeated.com/features/ta...tional-anthem/

Ultimately, Kaepernick has the right to protest (and it is protected by his employers), and you have the right to be pissed about the situation. But I ask you to think about this: we are blessed with so many freedoms in this country, and yet, we are so outraged that someone is exercising such a freedom.

"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."--Evelyn Beatrice Hall

I'd like to see the fans exercise their right to stand up and turn their backs to him when he takes the field.

Respect the people who made it possible for you to have free speech.

Or GTFO.

Forced speech is an odd way to respect free speech.

Fine. I just don't like the guy.

It would seem that do. ;)

If someone wants to protest the country by not standing while the national anthem is being played, that's fine. If that person has a serious accident and someone else wants to protest the telephone company by not calling 911 for them, that's fine too. What goes around comes around.

Or if someone was to miss a block on a blitzing linebacker...

Wishing death or injury on someone for not performing a particular ritual is not "fine".

If a citizen chooses not to support this country, that's fine with me. If fellow compatriots consequently choose not to support that person, that's fine with me too.

That's their right. Exercising their rights is fine ... except among un-Americans.

It's not the non performance of a ritual that irks me. It's the disruption. He is paid very well to be a pro football player. He's not paid to be a political activist. If he wants to burn flags and preach his rhetoric on his own time, great. While he's in uniform and representing his team and the league, he needs to shelve his personal agenda.

In the 24+ years that I spent on active duty in the Army, including the first Gulf War and especially after 2003, I can't think of a thing that the military has done to guarantee any of the great freedoms we enjoy here in the United States. I've been to Iraq twice, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Jordan, Egypt, Kuwait and Qutar. Nothing that we have done has had any impact one way or the other on your ability to exercise free speech here in the United States. The last time that I can think of that the military was called upon to guarantee rights secured by the 13th, 14th, and 15th amendments to our constitution was during the enforcement of desegregation of schools in the south. I am a fan though of the sentiment put forth in the book "Stormship Troopers". When one is willing to lay their life on the line for the body politic, that deserves our respect.

I will make this distinction though: the safety and security of the United States and her interests is vastly different than securing your freedoms here within our borders. Vastly different because there is no existential threat to the United States. None. Getting hit and being put down are two vastly different things as well. But, that is probably another conversation for another thread.

I do have some sympathy with that.

I like that distinction. You are the real deal Joe, thank you.

What a marvelous challenge. I guess the first thought exercise I have for us is, what do you think would happen if there was NO US Military? It's the things that DIDN'T happen that are most interesting. We can argue all day about the efficacy of what they have actually done with it. But you get as much done displaying a shotgun on the wall than you do swinging it around. And it helps if you demonstrate you have the nerve to take it off the wall when you want. Here are some of my talking points.

1) There is still an Israel.
2) There is still an Eastern Europe.
3) There is, for the most part, worldwide peace.

I'm saying these things are not true if the US Mil doesn't exist. And I'm also saying that the loss of these things would deeply threaten the US.

It's great we feel there is no existential threat. What a great thing to feel. Best thing ever actually. But tell me: is it because there's nobody who wants to threaten our existence??

We did not feel there was no existential threat in 2002. Why do we feel that way now? Are we wrong now, or were we wrong then? Is it that the enormity of our response demonstrated that we are not a paper tiger? Did we actually address the threats we felt? Or is it just chance, just luck, just our response to events?

From what I've heard, his intention was to start a discussion about how African Americans are treated as second class citizens. He has succeeded somewhat.

Since when is not standing for the national anthem a direct insult to the entire military? Talk about pc and getting offended.

And since when was the anthem a proxy for the military at all? Its a proxy for the government, which is completely fair game for criticism.

I applaud his audacity. I applaud that he used his status in a very public way to keep the voice of Black Lives Matter going strong for those who might feel that there's no point in striving for something better.

I applaud his courage. He knew the blowback this was going to cause him.

Poo Poo to all those who are crying. Get real already.

Because the lyrics are about winning a battle against a foreign entity. Which is one reason our anthem should be "America the Beautiful" instead, as there is a growing movement for.

I agree with her

And where is that band who so vauntingly swore,
That the havoc of war and the battle’s confusion
A home and a Country should leave us no more?
Their blood has wash’d out their foul footstep’s pollution.
No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave,
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

The whole "military" thing is nuts. Gun Lobby gone mad. ;)

He's being a bit of a drama queen wanker imo -the cynic in me questions his true motives. And I agree with Jim to a certain extent -he's being paid to represent his team and if they want to dump him they'd be well within their rights. But it's not a very free country if you are not free to protest in whatever (legal) way you can. It's not a crime. Yet. I also have issues with the pledge of allegiance. But that's another story.

I don't have any issue with him having his girlfriend's opinion. Been there, done that... It won't end well... Nessa Diab is his Yoko.

I have an issue with him trying to turn the spotlight away from something I enjoy and trying to force 'these conversations' onto people that don't give a fuck about his pet issue.

I love football. It's church to me. I look forward to Sunday. The last thing I want is for it to become the venue for random cork soakers to stand in front of reporters and talk shit about what other people 'should' do or How this county 'should' be.


I was disgusted by his broad brush allegations about cops murdering minorities and being rewarded with paid leave. It's a juvenile, reactionary and inflammatory thing to say. He has no idea what those people face on a daily. He hasn't even read UT's pawn shop thread.

To condemn the entire country because of some overblown news stories about the oppression of rioters and cop haters is indicative of an emotional childish mind. Tw would not approve.

I guess this is why I avoid the news. Every time it seeps into my awareness, I get disgusted with the shitty people that are involved.

I know there are mostly(? Eh?) good people in the world. People that would tell you if you left your coffee cup on your car roof, or that your fly was down....
...And I might not want to punch this dickhead if I talked to him about this face to face for 10 minutes...

But it sure seems like he is reciting some shit his girl has been brain washing him with.

Maybe he thinks Nessa is smarter than he is, and most other people he knows, and he's on board with her outrage. I've seen that before.

I guess my main point is this:

Football is about football. Nothing else. Don't bring your personal agenda to the game. That's not what the people that paid the money they earned came to see. Stand up with your teammates and give the contest 100% effort. One hunnet.

I've not heard that anyone is trying to put him behind bars and others have the right to not only counter-protest; but, to protest his manner of protest and to protest him. If it affects his job, that's his tough luck as he selected the venue.

Those in professional sports are in an entertainment industry. It's all about popularity and no one has a right to be popular. If he loses his job, it would be the same as someone like Linda Ronstadt getting banned from performing in Las Vegas for interjecting her politics into her performances. When paying customers don't get what they're paying for the entertainers fall by the wayside. Even in a free country there's no free lunch.

He's just not a stand-up guy.

Why is this is a thing we are paying attention to. Are all other problems solved?

If the next two seasons are a Chip Kelly tire fire, I will be entertained by it and it sounds like this event may help fan the flames.

I don't follow football. Not at all. I just thought it would be funny if we could build this story up enough to get Donald Trump to label the guy a terrorist. Watching the news for it.

I don't envy Chip. He got the hell out of dodge (Philly) just as the racist label was starting to stick. Cutting DeSean and LaShawn.... Keeping Riley Cooper.... Clearly a white supremacist.... Now this lands in his lap. Just change your name to Adolf, Chip. You're doooomed.

I don't think you know this any more than "He has no idea what those people face on a daily".

So are you against other players with their pet issues like curing cancer and supporting our troops, or are you just against his issue because it doesn't affect you?

But church is exactly where that shit is talked about.;)

If you can't acknowledge that there's a problem, you aren't paying attention
That there's a wide brush. You really have no concept of the blcak experience

Assumption

I would be consistent, then, if you are as outraged when a player genuflects, or points to the sky, or attributes his success to god. Are you?

posting line by line retorts like that is akin to interrupting someone repeatedly.

and.... your fly is down

Caught you looking, ya perv

How is that "broad brush"? Was he saying that the vast majority of cops are on paid leave after killing minorities? That would be broad brush. Or was he saying that the vast majority of cops who kill minorities get no more punishment than paid leave? That's not broad brush.

Standing for a flag and national anthem is about respect. It says nothing about support or attacking a nation. Plenty of non-Americans should also stand for the national anthem? If not, they should be condemned? Nonsense. It is only a flag. Far more relevant is the issue.

One can criticize a venue he has chosen. But that in no way and in no manner affects football. Football and some cops who are racist with their guns are two completely different issues.

We need only go back to Vietnam when so many burned flags. What do we know now? Those flag burners were right. Go figure. They were wrong among those who were only emotional and deceived back then. Now they were right after we learned facts. They used the flag only for what it is - a symbol.

Only a fool would worship a flag. At best, we give it respect. Whether he sat or stood in no way affects football - if one is dealing with this controversy logically. The flag has no relationship to football.

However, the NFL combines both to promoted the NFL for increased profits. The NFL has no business wrapping themselves in the flag. But it works when promoting to the emotional - who somehow assume a flag and football are all about patriotism.

The thing I find most ironic about the argument that standing shows respect for those who died for our freedoms, is that one of those freedoms they died for was freedom of speech, or expression. (actions are considered expression and therefore fall under "speech")

The first amendment serves to protect speech, in particular unpopular speech. Popular speech, such as standing during the SSB, clearly doesn't need protecting unlike dissenting speech.

The other issues such as class, taste, appropriateness, hypocrisy, relevance, mendacity, are all up for discussion, but his patriotism, I feel, is not.

Maybe Trump will build a wall around the guy.

Trump was surprised how many Mexicans were in favor of the wall. They were throwing bricks at him for the wall.

Due to evil terrorists, we now build big walls even around NFL games. You cannot even bring your favorite flask containing a preferred spirits. Terrorist won again. Got us to build more walls. And to drink only what their religion wants us to drink.

Well yeah...they want to keep him out. :D

[spinmeister] The Donald just wants to provide racquetball* courts for underprivileged children in Mexican border towns. [/spinmeister]

*They may have to settle for handball as racquets are expensive.

*In lieu of handballs they may have to use armadillos.

They will crush it in the next Olympics. Thanks Donald!

I bet an armadillo wouldn't bounce for shit.

I just had a visual of a Harlem Globetrotter, footing his way across the border, dribbling an armadillo.:lol2:

ETA: It was Curly from the cartoon Globetrotters, btw.

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Football is dumb.

YOU'RE DUMB.

Also, hey there Flint.

He knelt on the sideline last night apparently.

He's a douchebag. He's got the "right" to do this. He's a douchebag. He's got the "right" to do this. He's a douchebag. He's got the "right" to do this. He's a douchebag. He's got the "right" to do this. He's a douchebag. He's got the "right" to do this. He's a douchebag. He's got the "right" to do this. He's a douchebag. He's got the "right" to do this. He's a douchebag. He's got the "right" to do this.

That's the conversation he started. FTR - He's a douche in my book. He did this because he sucks and was probably going to get cut. Because of that he can now claim he too is oppressed by the white devil - Chip Kelly.

Your FACE is dumb. Hi.

Your MOM knelt on the sideline last night apparently.

There's no comeback for a remark like that. None that don't make you sound douchy.

So I wrote a haiku instead

Flint is like a bird
Flies over, shits on our heads
Then he flies away

very zen, Jim

A face that is dumb is also called a poker face.

All I wanna know: why does anyone give a flip if this guys stands, sits, or lies (or is it lays?) down?

He's 'entitled to his opinion', he's not breakin' the law, so what's the big deal?

I'll worry about what he thnks, says, or does when he can take money out of my pocket, food off my table, or shingles off the roof over my head.

So, again, why give a flip?

Because everything about football is blown way out of proportion. A bunch of billionaires hiring millionaires to bleed the taxpayers for more money.

Color me stupid: not seein' the connection between the real problem of bloated ticks and the faux problem of a mouthy, self-important schnook.

henry quirk

Attachment 57782

(Just kidding henry, adding some color to an old phrase.)

I always thought stupid was green...I done learnt me sumthin'.

Schnook! It's been at least 40 years since I've heard or read that word. I love it! Reminds me of my childhood. I grew up in a relatively Jewish neighborhood.