Joe Paterno to resign at end of season
 

Unconfirmed, but got an AP text

AP pretty much confirms it.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories...11-09-09-58-54

He could be forced out sooner if the Penn State Board of Trustees decides to do so. Leaving a t the end of this season was his decision. They could decide that his leaving immediately would be better. Time will tell.

They won't.

They did.

OK, they've decided to fired everybody to cover their ass, including the president. Cowards.

XO, Why not give the Board a small break.

As I understand it, Paterno was obligated to report the offenses of the other coach.
If so, they fired those that did not do their job properly.

If Paterno were kept on til the end of the year, couldn't the Board have been criticized
for caring more about their football season than the improper conduct of their faculty.
.

As I understand it, he met the minimum requirement for reporting. He did what he was supposed to do. Sandusky was no longer a PSU coach in 1999. They're saying that Paterno should have done more. I don't know, yet, whether it was administrators, police, or prosecutors who dropped the ball. Until there is more information, and hopefully the truth comes out, I think Joe should have been allowed to finish the season.

Penn State students riot to protest Paterno's firing. This is going to make people respect them even more....:rolleyes:

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/natio...-unrest/44792/

If you sexaully abuse a child, gasoline should be pour on your head and you should be set on fire and burned to death. If you know about it and do nothing, you should be made to watch the burning and then go to prison for the rest of your life. If you protest the decision to fire those who did nothing, you should be made to explain to the children that were raped why you think football is more important than the child.

Joe didn't "do nothing".

He did half of nothing... he had a responsibility to go to the police and he did not.

Marx brothers-sounding names aside, Paterno did so report the incident. He is not being charged. Whether you think he should have taken it elsewhere or not is your opinion. How much he knew or didn't know is still your opinion.

I'm always amazed at the propensity of people to automatically get out the pitchforks, and shoot first and ask questions later, especially when it comes to certain subjects.

Many lives have been ruined by false speculation. While the incidents are indeed too horrible to imagine, we can't keep with the knee-jerk scapegoatism we cling to...in the name of thinking of the children, or in the name of FSM himself. Not until we know the truth.

I heard two guys speculating that he used knowledge of this incident to hang on to his job long after he should have been let go. 5 years ago there was talk of his retirement being forced upon him. Supposedly the higher ups visited him at home to talk about it, and he talked them out of it.

this is hearsay. i know nothing.

Fuck Joe Paterno.

He served at the pleasure of the university.

If he feels his discharge was unjust: he can sue.

The meat of the matter is NOT Paterno.

From Wikipedia: "Mike McQueary, then a graduate assistant, told Paterno in 2002 that he had seen Sandusky performing a sex act on a 10-year-old boy in Penn State football's shower facilities..."

McQueary, as I understand it, walked in on Sandusky and the boy and did squat to intervene.

Why isn't someone horsewhipping McQueary?


"Well, he followed procedure and reported what he saw to a superior."


Er, fuck procedure, fuck the law: If someone walks in on an adult using my five-year old nephew in such a way, I expect that someone to STOP the event, right then and there.

If *I walk in on an adult using a child in such a way, someone will be hurt.

Let the police sort out the details AFTER you horsewhip the pervert.

'Poor Joe Paterno', indeed... :angry:









*This, by the way, is not a 'moral' issue, but simply 'my' distaste for the predatory use of innocents...distaste in no small way fueled by my own love of my nephew...I don't give a shit what the law (civil or religious) has to say on the matter.

Who said Poor Joe? wtf?

Did you walk in on Sandusky?

Did you hear McQueery talk to Paterno? Did you hear Paterno talk to Curley and Mo?

Knee-jerk.

The entire Grand Jury's 23-page report is here as a PDF file

This is the part about Paterno:

Curley and Schults later testified before the Grand Jury,
and denied the graduate student specifically told them
of "anal sex" or any specific "sexual activity".

p8: Shultz testified to meeting with Paterno and Curley,
and denied a specific report of sexual activity -
he instead called it "inappropriate wrestling".
Shultz acknowledged similarities between the 1998 and 2002 incidents

Elsewhere the GJ report states:
As I read the Grand Jury Report, it appears to me that Paterno did notify his immediate superior,
but there's no mention of him doing anything more.

It really appears frustrating that Tim Curley, PSU's Athletic Director,
did what he was supposed to do, up to a point.
He reported to the PSU President, Graham Spanier, and he reported to
Second Mile Executive Director, Jack Raykovitz, and he banned Sandusky
from bringing any youth onto the PSU campus.
BUT: portions of his testimony before the Grand Jury were deemed "not credible"

With all that, neither the University Police nor Dept of Children and Youth Services
were notified, as required by law.

"Who said Poor Joe?"

I take the campus riot as a 'poor Joe'.

#

"Did you hear McQueery talk to Paterno?"

It's part of the public record...part of the reason Sandusky "*was arrested for 40 counts related to allegations of sexual abuse of young boys over a 15-year period"

#

"Knee-jerk."

No. Impassioned, yes...but, I'm not reacting...I'm responding to the information available (which is fairly unambiguous).










*Wikipedia

Bottom line, if a child is in danger or even if you just SUSPECT a child is in danger, YOU CALL THE COPS FIRST! Not your boss and then wait for further instructions.

<whs double :mad:

Right on. What I see consistently are schools who have a policy or procedure in place that says if you suspect child abuse or neglect you report to your superior or a designated person - like the school counselor and then they report or make the decision to report or not. The problem with handing your information off to someone else is that it becomes second or third hand information - you may feel better for reporting but it doesn't always get called in. Most mandated reporter laws are pretty clear. You suspect, you report. Period.

The crimes committed in PA don't surprise me one bit, it's happening right now all over the country. What I find surprising is the discussion in the media and in the streets of State College, PA pondering the firings, folks getting angry because someone or another lost their job - actual discussion/questioning about who is responsible or not. I find it pretty horrific that anyone would question holding responsible every single person who knew of the abuse and did not report to the authorities.

Interim Penn State coach takes helm with 'mixed emotions'

Congrats jim.

don't worry, you'll grow on him.

There are far too many loose ends in this story.

First, Sandusky mysteriously quit. To take on a head coach job that he could have easily obtained? Because he was too old? Because Paterno was retiring? None of the above. He quit in a manner similar to what would happen when fired discretely. As if allegations existed that were all but prosecutable. From the time that Sandusky retired, I had always wondered why that retirement suddenly happened for no apparent reason.

Second, a grand jury had investigated a previous Sandusky child molestation accusation. I don't know what the grand jury recommended. But the Center County DA suddenly decided there was insufficient reason to prosecute. Then some months later, his car was found in Lewisburg (Union County), with cigarette butts inside (he did not smoke), and his computer completely disassembled so that even data on the disk drive could not be recovered.

Third, the board of trustees would never fire so many people on the information publically reported. Either they made a decision based 100% emotionally (to protect themselves). Or there are a much larger story behind this entire story.

Fourth, why were so many fired. But the graduate assistant who witnessed the child rape, did nothing, and then waited a full day to report it to anyone. Why is he not among the Trustees victims? Either the Trustees made a decision based in their emotions. Or others (including the long time university president) are even guiltier.

Fifth, Paterno did what he was supposed to do. According to statements made separately by both the graduate assistant and Paterno, Joe had stopped him mid sentence. Told him all this should be reported directly to Joe's superiors. Did not get the full story. And (as best we can tell) made sure his superior knew of the allegations 'first person'. That should have been sufficient if that is all there is to this story. To not even let him finish the season implies this story is much larger.

Too many loose ends. Actions were taken too quickly and with woefully insufficient information if there is not many times more information long known by many. I find it very difficult that all these actions were taken so quickly on so few hard facts and so little guilt.

Apparently, many smoking guns have been hidden. Apparently many knew much more much longer ago. Even the DA's unresolved and sudden disappearance remains suspicious. The timeline does not make any sense.

tw, I'm thinking your Fourth item above, particularly about the graduate assistant, is a bit over the top.

According to the Grand Jury Report, it was this young man's report
to Parterno that started the investigation of Victim#2,
his report to Curley and Shultz that initiated the administration's actions,
and his testimony to the Grand Jury that was persuasive (i.e., "extremely creditable")

He did not "wait a full day to report it to anyone".
The incident was at 9:30 pm on a Friday
He immediately called his father from his office phone, asking his advise.
He met with and reported the incident to Paterno the next morning, Saturday.

Maybe other testimony shows/says something else, but this was the Grand Jury's report.

Some in the news media are vehement this young man, now 28,
should have physically intervened in the incident.
To my mind that is asking an awful lot from an emotionally stricken
18 year-old confronted with such a situation.

I'd suggest the Trustees accepted this Grand Jury's findings, and so had no reason to fire him.

I thought he was 28 at the time? I haven't heard of any 18 year old graduate assistants?

Either way I agree with you Lamplighter. I'm guessing the loyalty in football programs is extremely high and to see a highly respected individual do that would be almost world shattering. It's tough not to criticize since this is the raping of a child but he did report it and the thought of a graduate assistant taking on Joe Paterno and the rest of the Penn State football coaching team/administration is enough to make anyone shit their pants.

We are saying the same thing. He saw the child being raped. He did not intervene. He called his father for advise. And waited till then next day to report it to anyone - that being Paterno.

If the university president and others did something worse, well, we do not yet have the entire story. McQuaery's (spelling is probably wrong) actions should have gotten him fired if others were only fired for not acting more responsibly. For him to not be fired and for other to be fired implies far more serious charges that we don't know about.

As I understand it, the Grand Jury investigation and a following mysterious disappearance of the DA was about another child rape. But that was not entirely clear.

BTW, if this is all it takes to fire so many top executives, then why is the Pope not resigning for all but condoning far more pedophile attacks. Double standard, The Pope has a friend in high places. How curious. Many of the Pope's friends also wear red.

PH45, you are right... My mistake about his age. He was 28, not 18.

The law down here requires that. If you're any kind of teacher, child-supervisor, medical professoinal or have any other contact with a child, if you have grounds to SUSPECT child abuse you MUST report it to an appropriate authority - principal, boss, police. Failure to do so is a criminal act.

As it should be.

But was that the law and the public attitude in 1997 when this event happened?

Somewhere before or after this event is when Sandusky suddenly resigned. I am unsure of that timeline.

Sandusky was out in 1999. This happened in 2002. Paterno reported the accusation, he didn't witness, immediately to his boss, as he should.

McQueery, who witnessed the crime, went to Paterno, but not the police as he should, still works there.

Err, TW, "down here" referred to Australia, and my description was of Australian law.

Most Australian laws do not apply in America.

We have one which might, though - an Australian who goes abroad for child sex tourism has broken Australian law and gets prison when they get back. Even organising this gets prison.

There had been a problem with Australian pedophiles exploiting the very poor in South-East Asia, hence the laws.

Note that Penn State security comes under Senior VIce President for Finanace and Business, Gary Schultz's jurisdiction. In other words, his is campus police.

Sandusky is a monster. The only victims are the children. Paterno should have been allowed to finish the season.

From here
Timeline

Joe "got rid of" Sandusky in May, 1999. The inaction around the 2002 incident was much more about McQueary, Curley, and Schultz.

Paterno should have been allowed to finish the season.

Rather concerning is an investigation started by the Penn State Board of Trustees AFTER they took action.

This story is changing every day. It started with too many loose ends. Now law enforcement (State Police) might have been involved in a coverup or inaction. Police may have been notified, discussed Sandusky accusations with campus police, and did nothing.

Meanwhile we have a nearby high school called Pope John Paul II. Ironic that a pope that all but condoned pedophilia is now the name of a high school in his honor.

Had the Pope been under those Trustees, he also would have been fired.

You forgot about the possible murder to cover it all up.
Yeh this one is getting messier by the moment.
Still a lot more to come.

I did not even begin to discuss the so many loose ends.

Lynn Abraham was the Philadelphia DA who had enough balls to subpoena files from the Philadelphia Archdiocese. She discovers over 100 pedophiles knows to the church, protected by the church, and returned to duties that involved children.

Lyn Abraham is now the lawyer for Second Choice - the organization that Sandusky worked for when he (was accused of) sexually attacked kids.

Why did so many DAs would not subpoena files from all Catholic Church archdioceses? Philadelphia region has at least four archdioceses. But pedophilia by the hundreds only exists in one? Please. Thousands of pedophile priests and employees protected by the Catholic Church would be uncovered.

Symptoms exposed in this Penn State scandal should result in investigations throughout the American Catholic Church and other institutions. Because pedophilia apparently is that widespread and routinely ignored. Apparently law enforcement has a double standard when it comes to 'honored' institutions. The scandal should result in increasing investigations throughout America.

Maybe someone else would like to explain serious restrictions long ago imposed on Boy Scout leaders. Restrictions imposed long ago because pedophilia apparently is much more widespread than acknowledged. And because the Boy Scouts reacted pro-actively. That should be a lesson that expands well beyond Penn State. That is the lesson that suggests the Catholic Church still remains a protector of pedophiles.

This is not only about Penn State. Damning are how many DAs will not do what Lynn Abraham (and her predecessor) did. BTW, Philadelphia is trying to establish a foundation necessary to prosecute the Philadelphia Cardinal who knew about (that is not disputed) and apparently condoned pedophilia by his inaction.

Why would the same archdiocese name a high school after Pope John Paul II who all but protected pedophilia. Too many in law enforcement apparently refused to investigate or prosecute this even when the church was protecting pedophiles in nations all over the world. At what point does a trend become obvious?

You are drifting into your Catholic rant there big guy.
Lets keep this on topic and relevant to the PSU issue.
Ifyou want to go off and repost all the same shit from the past, feel free to do it here.

Pedophilia is the topic. Penn State is simply one example. It is not a rant to suggest the Catholic Church acts (acted) like a mafia for pedophiles. Extremely relevant is what the Boy Scouts did long ago to avert these problems. Penn State only suggests a larger problem that includes many 'powers that be' who ignored it. This is not about Penn State. This is about the real problem. Why pedophilia is ongoing, apparently more widespread that we knew, and happens without prosecution. Pedophilia in another 'lily white' institution? (For those overseas, the Penn State program was considered a cleanest and most honest in sports.) How can this be?

Ironically to this thread, Joe Paterno is only a sidebar. Something in Chapter one to get your attention. This story keeps getting bigger including another Chapter: the NBC interview.

I see no difference between what Lynn Abraham did in Philadelphia, what the Catholic Church routinely did in Ireland, and what has happened in Penn State.

How many pedophiles are hiding out in Notre Dame? Once we would have never considered that possibility. Today, it might be possible. Too many loose ends are being exposed. If accusations are true, even the PA State Police were complicit in a cover up. So why did that DA disappear or die?

Do these scandals have an enemies list? Can anyone get on it?

FWIW, this morning the (former ?) DA from New Jersey (?) was on TV.
OK, I don't know who he was,,,

But he gave some great advise to abused children, parents and organizations...

First, he gave a recommendation to "Darkness to Light"

This is an organization to end child sexual abuse.
For example they have specific plans and steps to follow:
Step 5: Make a Plan Learn Where to Go, Whom to Call, and How to React

Then he talked about a policy for parents and organizations to adopt:

Parents: Do not allow or else closely monitor all "one-to-one" adult-to-child situations.

Organizations: Policy Regarding One-Adult/One-Child

This probably does not warrant posting, but what the...

DAILY NEWS
Teri Thompson , Michael O'keeffe & Kevin Armstrong
November 15 2011, 1:59 PM

Jerry Sandusky’s lawyer, Joe Amendola,
got a 16-year-old client pregnant and later married her

Girl was seeking emancipation from her parents in 1996

Good info Lamp. Words to live by for those with young kids or grandkids they watch.

ETA - referring to post #39.

Because of all this, yesterday our Tae Kwon Do instructor felt that it was important to let all the parents of Kindergarteners know that he does go in the bathroom with them all to supervise when they are changing into their uniforms. Just in case they ever said anything, he wanted us to know that's what they were referring to.

So what is going on here ?
Is this a matter of party politics, or CYOA, or what ?
Has the organization been accused of anything...
...Sanduskey has been gone from it for quite a while.

On the surface, I can't see how withholding $ from an organization that
is supposedly providing a needed service to kids is going to help them.

CBS News
November 17, 2011 8:55 AM

Pa. gov puts $3M Sandusky charity grant on hold
.

I heard that. I also heard that Governor Corbett was the Attorney General during some part of this, when charges were not filed. I'll look for documentation when I have more time, unless someone else gets to it first.

I read that as well spexx.
I think the name MUST change Anything associated with him has to have him purged.

I find it interesting that republicans want to do away with welfare, cut government spending, etc., and here is a rep gov and rep legislature handing out money to an organization founded and run be a pedophilic sexual predator. This also shows that a government program that performed the duties of second mile is preferable to a private organization.

Pa. governor’s office halts $3M grant for charity founded by ex-Penn State coach in abuse case
By Associated Press, November 16

I'm not really sure what you are getting at Spexx. The money was approve, then put on hold. Correct decision at this point, IMO.

I don't see the connection to your public/private argument. The real issue, to me, is in the last part of my quote. What did Corbett know back in 2008 and why did it take years for this to come out?

A little reported news event was:
UNIVERSITY PARK, PA - In the wake of the sex abuse scandal that rocked Penn State earlier this month, a coalition of 10-year-old boys from across the nation held a press conference Saturday outside Beaver Stadium,

you're goddamn motherfuckin skippy.

"you just can't go wrong notifying the police"

Fuck. Yeah.

I couldn't make this up.

Attachment 35955

:facepalm:

Sandusky applied to be an assistant coach to nearby Juniata College's football team. Juniata College did a background check. So many knew Sandusky was a problem that Juniata ordered the coach to reject Sandusky. Juniata's football coach brought Sandusky onboard anyway.

When does Juniata's coach also get fired? And who are these so many people who knew Sandusky was a problem - causing him to fail a background check? More loose ends that suggest so many people knew - and said nothing.

If not yet reported in other venues, Sandusky's wife could also be charged as an accomplice to an attack on a kid locked in the basement and calling for help. She did nothing. If proven, that would also make her a felon.

Meanwhile, up north in Syracuse, that University's basketball coach and his wife are also accused (but apparently not yet charged) of doing same crimes.

Syracuse basketball coach Jim Boeheim was sued for defamation.
The investigation of Bernie Fine is still ongoing.
Charges will be forthcoming as yet another victim has surfaced.

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat???????????

Link

My bullshit detector just exploded.

this is another trap.

Cause it's dirty up in there, reaaaalll dirty.

Jesus.

:eyebrow:

They never miss an oppurtunity for a road trip: God also hates anyone who raises, handles, plays with, and consumes pork.

Wait wait wait wait wait.

The pedophile raping coach is part of the punishment? Not part of the sins for which the US is being puninshed?

Ok now my total-nutjob detector has also exlpoded. It's sitting beside my burned out bullshit detector, smoking gently. The fire warden is very unhappy.

Zen, you have to understand WBC's business plan. They are all lawyers. They don't give a fuck about religion. They say the most offensive things they can think of, to piss off the most people possible, in hopes of being personally attacked so they can sue. End of story.

The Freeh Report was released yesterday, and the news seemed to focus
exclusively on damning Paterno more than the 3 administrators of the university.
News articles referred to emails as the damning evidence, but did not print/post them.
I tried various sources to download the PDF file of the Freeh Report, but was unsuccessful.

Today, the NY Times has put the Freeh Report on line here.