My kid is getting shafted
 

This is a long story and we still don't have it all straight, so this may take several posts and maybe even a few days to tell the story, but I'm so pissed I need to shout about it, somewhere, preferably where intelligent, realistic, non knee-jerk people are, and here is the only such place I know where I won't encounter people who may end up being involved IRL, because this is far from over, much as I wish it was.

I originally started posting under my regular dwellar name because I'm not ashamed about this, but I decided anon was probably a better route just in case... I don't care if you know who I am, I expect it won't be hard to figure out, but please don't use any personal references should you have a comment to make.

Story will start in next post

Our kid -let's call it A- is in elementary school, several years in. Way back when.... in KG.... another kid (B) who gets off on trouble -specifically other people being in it was identified. B is smart -can find anyone's buttons -kid or adult. B soon realised that A was (a) short tempered and (b) naive in the interpersonal relationship field. Spent the year alternating between (a) picking on A until A exploded in anger and tears and running away (b) befriending A and persuading A to do things that would get A into trouble and then telling on A.....

We asked for them to be separated in the next grade and they were. Still played on the same soccer team, still had the same issues going on, but only a few hours a week is more maneagable.

But later, back together in class, A was told to stay away from B, but B can't leave A alone and it's like a moth to a flame.

So on Friday, B started beating the shit out of a kif for no apparent reason, "allegedly" somehow persuaded A to hold him and A admits to also hitting kid (let call them C) at some point, says not sure how or why that happened. This is lunch recess. lunch supervisor comes over, sees B kicking and hitting C, A (our kid) is not in the picture. writes a report to that effect

So everyone around is hauled into the office one by one.

B is known for violence and lying and general craftiness and two-facedness, A is not (although A lies like nobody's business, but is not known for it, yet....).

B says "A just started beating on this kid and i was trying to pull A off" lunch supervisor's Incident Report said B was seen kicking the crap out of C. And does not mention A at all

A says, I wasn't involved. And then, well I was but i didn't mean to be. and then it gets fuzzy, and apparently A eventually admits to hitting C. C ended up with a bloody nose.

but B never changes his story, even though the principal says "I don't believe you" and the incident report only mentions B kicking and hitting C and doesn't mention A at all (how can B hurting C ever be interpreted as B pulling A off C?)

Anyway, apparently, eventually, it is decided that the closest to the truth that can be ascertained is that A hit C in an unprovoked attack.

WTF?

But I was cornered by the principal on Friday afternoon and told that this had happened, A had admitted guilt and because it was out of character the punishment would just be an in-school suspension on Monday.

A little blindsided to say the least, principal offers to discuss firther on Mon if we want

We do. We go in, expecting to find at least both A and B on the in-school suspension ...but no, just A. -we find that out as we walk into school and are nearly bowled over by B running away from a kid b just pushed.

basically, Principal admits no idea what really happened, but this is the closest to the truth most kid witnesses are willing to agree on.

We say "out of character for A" and totally in character for B. principal agrees. But A has admitted guilt. So guilty. Here's the punishment. B did not admit guilt, no proof, no punishment. Of course principal couldn't actually discuss B with us directly, but I'm an involved parent whose "contribution to the school" the principal values, so I am sometimes privy to hints and snippets and know the "i can't officially discuss this with you but here's what happened" codes. A's other parent was horrified when we got outside and realized that what the principal had said meant that B was not getting punished because he didn't admit guilt.

Does C have anything to say about the incident?
WTF is wrong with B's parents?
WTF is wrong with the school?
That kind of shit really sucks for everyone involved. Sorry, man you don't deserve that. But your kid has more integrity than the other kid and the administration. He deserves an award for being a stand up kid for copping to his involvement.

Oh and the other kid deserves a kick in the nuts from me.

OR, see sig line below:

Perhaps this will be a lesson to your child that messing with 'B" ends up being really bad for him and he will finally decide to stay away from that kid.

I think B is kind of stalking A. Maybe you should get a restraining order against B and then when he violates it, you can have him deported to another school district.

We asked for a copy of the incident report (I already knew what it said, but unofficially).

I went into school today and was spotted by the lunch supervisor who filed the report. She came over and said she was shocked that A had been punished for the incident (in-school suspension is a "permanent record" thing) and horrified that B had not. She said she's been in to see both A&B's class teacher and the principal to say as much.

I talked to other teachers at the school (it's a small school, everyone knows everyone)

Everyone thinks A has been shafted.

principal refused to give a copy of the report because it names other children. but sent a copy of the report about A which is considered the truth and said (and i copy verbatim)

At this point the lightbulb went on and I can hear b saying "let's all tell Principal that A did it..." and A -bless it's little heart- was just to horrified and confused about what happened to deny it -and the principal did agree that A was horrified and confused and very upset about it all.......

And yet still shafted A.

Don't you think?

C -as far as I know- is a pretty nice kid, but spacey. I've had C in one of my classes. But from the sound of what was going on, I'd doubt C knew who was doing what. althoug i did learn today that b and C maybe have a little history.

B is totally a little craptard, i'd be happy if b fell off the planet and i don't say that lightly about kids. B'sparents... who ever sees them? totally uninvolved. maybe divorced recently, hard to tell, they don't socailize at all.

That's what I dream about......

we can only hope.... but moth to a flame...... A is smarter than your average high-schooler, but youngest in class and emotionally/socially immature for the age.

B is average academically, but 90yo in interpersonal/empathetic wisdom. But B chooses the dark side on which to use the force.....

Doesn't it suck, though?

And meanwhile A learns: be honest, own up, take responsibility and get publicly humiliated. Lie through your teeth and run free.....

Way to go, school.

This is NOT over, we just don't exactly know what to do next. Especially as most of the info we have about what really happened is "unofficial" and some of our "inside sources" are teachers whose jobs will be at risk if we reveal them. We love the school and the teachers, it's the principal who sucks. But it's sort of a case of better the devil you know. at least until now.....

speechless..... because that's probably the safest way to be.....

Hire D and E, to find B after school, and fuck him up.
Hire Guido and Vinnie, to find the Principal after school, and fuck him up.

I gotz the pipe we used last time !!!

Seriously though , this is a Lesson for the Kid in question ,
dont hang with B he gets you in trouble .
take yer lumps for telling the truth ,
There are consequences for yer actions ,
Act right and this shit wont happen

Isn't anyone concerned about C?

if there's no way to tell exactly what was correct, and the principal had his suspicions, all the kids should have been punished the same.

should have been; now it will never be.

Lesson to A that about the general inequity of life; and to say away from B. Permanently.

yes, there is concern for C. C is fine. ...btw A wrote a long apology to C and included a cartoon of C being an awesome superhero (without any prompting). The principal passed it on.

I so fucking wish A would learn the "stay away from B" lesson, but the more your parents tell you not to do something... Romeo and Juliet anyone?

I get that, but he's still pretty young. He needs to learn now that some "friends" are not worth keeping.

are "lumps" good or bad in this context?

Part of life ,
You Play You PAY !

You won't get any disagreement from me on that, but it isn't an easy lesson to teach......

So stay in the classroom at recess?

By railing against the system shafting him, rather than saying, 'you let B fuck you again and you're paying for it', your not helping him learn that lesson.

what Bruce said. school administration and systems will NEVER be fair, and it's useless to fight them (imo). It's more important to learn the lessons about people, and learn how to protect oneself from the assholes of life. It's the peer pressure thing--one of the most insidious battles all kids must fight.

So stay in the classroom at recess?

No , face yer fears head on
Win or Loose ,

Are we men or Mice ???

Another lesson that your kid mayhave learned (and which you can help him learn) is that by telling the truth and admitting his part in the incident he was only given a very mild punishment. His honesty bought a good deal more leniency than had he lied and still been found out.

As unfair as it is (and it's the kind of unfairness that gets under your skin and itches terribly) that kidB wasn't punished, it almost doesn't matter: your kid (kidA) allowed himself, for whatever reason, to be drawn into a situation where he did hit kid C. That was wrong; he clearly recognises that it was wrong; he has gone out of his way to make amends.

In rationalising it to him, it might be worth pointing out that whilst he (an honest and mostly well-behaved kid) has ended up being punished and Kid B hasn't: in fact the kid who has been treated most unfairly is KidB. By not punishing him, and allowing him to get away with that behaviour; the school and headteacher have taught him a dangerous lesson. By the time he comes a cropper properly, it will most likely be for something serious, and the consequences will hit him like a freight train.

Given that part of the school's job is to socialise kids and allow them to move comfortably through society, the response of the school to misbehaviour is just one more set of lessons. Your kid was given that lesson. Kid B was not. Better to learn those lessons now whilst the potential consequences are small, than continue through school without learning those lessons and then have to learn them in a much bigger and potentially damaging way later on.

As a final aside: it also could feed into the lesson that actually, what other people do is way less important than what you yourself do. Why would you care about the other kid, after all? What matters to you is what your kid is doing; what lessons he is learning. In much the same way as parents don't care that kids E, F, G and H all have brand new i-phones to take to school, or that kids E, F and H told kid A to do something: if kids E,F and H told ya to jump off a cliff would ya?

The only thing your kid can control is his own behaviour and responses. Ultimately responsibility for our own actions cannot rest with the crowd, it has rest with ourselves.

Well, I think we probably all know what my opinion will be, but...

In a calm voice with no witnesses A should let B know the new rules. You've screwed me for the last time. If you come near me or abuse another one of our classmates while I'm around I will leave you dripping blood in a pool of your own vomit, and if you are dumb enough to think about touching me or even saying my name I'll eat your fucking heart. Then A must be smart enough to go about his daily life completely ignoring B unless he breaks the rules.

Sometimes violence or the threat of violence is the answer.

I'm really surprised that the lunch supervisor's report isn't given more weight. Could you have the principal's supervisor look into the matter?

Principal's supervisor? School superintendent?

Yeah, call the mayor while you're at it.

I know it's no consolation, but chances are B gets abuse at home. This shit doesn't appear out of nowhere.

UT''s on to something there. Drop a dime on B's folks with Social Services about some form of abuse suspected. That'll keep the family busy. Unless of course his folks are crack whores in which case DSS will just pass on by.

Your son had some involvement in the fight, and whether he only held kid C, or actually hit him, doesn't matter. He's just as guilty as B.

Don't for a moment THINK that justice is fair. That rarely happens. Justice is blind, remember?

Credit your son for being honest. Advise him to never admit guilt again, until after considering advice given to him, by you or his lawyer, and to keep his hands, etc., off of others. He can't go through school or life, getting into fights. Not directly, and not indirectly, by manipulating others.

Do NOT concern yourself with the punishment of B. That is NOT your concern AT ALL. Try to assist your son to overcome the damage your son helped to inflict on C, if it's possible.

A handwritten note from your son, apologizing and wishing C all the best, perhaps on a card, would be appropriate.

No matter WHAT you do to try and get some fairness in this matter of B, is simply wrong - you are out of line, mister - stop, immediately.

don't call Social Services on him for a schoolyard fistfight

Some parents would already have a lawyer involved.

Update (reminded by Spexxvet linking to the discussion)

Kid B was moved to a different class after Christmas, no explanation, life became much better. Kid A has learned to avoid Kid B

Principal also assured us kids A and B would not be in the same class next year. :thumb: Principal resigned last week :rolleyes: There have apparently been many complaints about similar poor handling of situations, principal (who was on a year's leave to get a masters degree) has decided to pursue a different career.

Update

Kid B did not return to school this year. The principal also left (as per previous update). Rumor has it principal was pushed and this incident was part of the reason (among several others). New principal was one of the teachers who (unofficially) agreed Kid A was getting shafted. Kid A is doing so much better and is now best friends with and in class with Kid C.

good to hear, thanks for the update. :)

Excellent.
Is "A" feeling better about going to school now?
Any progress on the "stay away from B" plan?

Presumably Kid B not returning to school would help with the "staying away" thing?

Sometimes things don't go after all from bad to worse :)

Kid A behaved well after the incident, and the fact he is now friends with Kid C shows how badly he was influenced. Who knows, one of them might end up telling this story at the other's wedding.

Glad the real troublemaker is out of the picture.
At that age, sometimes that is the very best to hope for.
Children cannot make the same logical decisions as adults - I see it over and over at school. Although to a much lesser extent.

If you really think adults make logical decisions ... :lol:

Seriously. Kid B will be a wife beater or a serial killer or something.

Unless Kid B has some kind of epiphany or someone shows Kid B there are better ways to go about things.

Sad...

Regardless of who started it, if kid A was involved and admitted it, I don't see why him being punished is being shafted. He still did something wrong, even if he was just following another kids lead.

The fact that kid B didn't get punished really isn't anything to do with it IMO. Yeah it sucks, but as a parent, i think the lesson you have to try and teach is that if you do something wrong you get punished. There's consequences. Just because B got away with it shouldn't have any bearing. As the parent it's up to you to teach your kid a better way of doing things no matter what other kids are up to, or what they get pinned with.

Yeah I know I'm late to the party, but after reading the thread, I just wanted to say a couple of things. One other thing I wanted to talk about was the fact that I'm sure as a parent you agree that your child should have been punished for his actions, but you're not happy that he's taken the whole blame. I just think it's really important that you don't talk about the sour grapes you feel in front of the child. He needs to learn to man up and be responsible for his actions regardless of what happens to the other kids. You as a parent are responsible for making sure he gets that message, and if he hears you talking about how unfair it all is, what lesson do you think he'll take from that?

for the most part i am with ali on this one, and even though its hard to teach him about actions having consequances when he see's his friend not having them, there's a much more important lesson there: life isn't fair, and other then our own wishful thinking there's nothing in the world the says its supposed to be. we don't all get what "we deserve", bad or good. there is absolutely no point in perparing a kid for an idealized world that doesn't exist - you prepare him for this world and no other.

I do not have children.

I hope I never do.

I do not like children.

I did not like myself when I was a children.

I do not have children.

The odds on me having children now are slim to none.

I love children, but do not seem to have the correct programming when it comes to adoring babies. I always wanted kittens.

I didn't like myself as a child, but then I was given very little chance to.

i had a stepson until receantly.

children in the future? biological maybe, probably... but i'm never having a relationship that serious with a single mother ever again.

when i view a kid as mine - my lifelong project to make him into the best person he can be - i'm all there. in which case tolerating other people kids on playdates and birthdays is a necessry evil to help your kid develop social skills.

i loved myself as a child, but that's a very common characteristic of the babyboomer's children.

Ah! You were raised properly--in the traditional fashion. Kidding.

Didn't like myself as a child either, and people were surprised when I got pregnant. In a rude way. Doen't anyone get that I just don't like other people's children? My own are kind of cool. Hebe was the first baby I ever held.

You're right though!

You're missing out on how wonderful they are...



Bar-B-Qued.