Death/Funeral Etiquette Advice, please
 

from US peeps, sorry all else.....

The dad of one of Thor's closest friends died on Weds (prolonged battle with lung cancer) and his funeral is tomorrow. I met the guy once, Thor is 8. Would it be expected we attend? Would it help Thor's friend if he were there? Or will he be too tied up with his family and ritual obligations to even notice us? What is the norm? Funerals here seem so much bigger than the ones in the UK -is it everybody who ever came into contact shoud attend, or only those who felt close to the deceased?

We will send a condolence card of course, but I'm not big on funerals -I've been to one -my nan's- and I really didn't know the guy -he and the mom are not together and he's been sick all the time Thor has known this kid (one year) In the UK, kids generally do not attend funerals, but I'm hearing that some of their classmates will be attending. Should we go? I'm not big on them, but I'm not a wuss either -I can do a funeral if a funeral must be done. Even in church. I've asked Thor and he really is not into giving me an answer either way. Which is unusual, so i'm thinking maybe he feels the same way I do -don't want to go but maybe should.

And... if we do go, what to expect? there was a viewing tonight and there's another one at the church immediately before the service. Is the casket likely to be open at the service? Do we wear black?

And I'm worried Thor's worried we're going to die too. We went to Hector's class poetry book launch where some of them read their poems about their fears of growing up. On the way home, Thor asked beest if it was normal to be afraid of growing up. Maybe he's wondering if it's normal for parents to die. And if he is, will the funeral make that possibility seem more real?

I sort of think we should go, but I don't want to.

I'd lean towards going mainly because of Thor's relationship with the son. As a formality. I'd skip the viewing which is more a time for everyone to reminisce about the old codger and remember when, etc etc.

Funerals in my mind are about the survivors emotionally supporting one another. Sometimes that is expressed as paying respects or sharing memories.

I imagine after a bout with cancer you aren't looking your best and doubt an open coffin.

You can certainly stay in the back, tell anyone who seems to care that you are sorry, etc. I don't think the entire clan needs to go, one parent could stay home with the other kids.

On the other hand, you could skip the whole thing and send a card unless you feel you absence would be conspicuous. Sounds like the only real connection is Thor and the kid, who as you point out will probably be busy with his family.

After thinking about it, I'm giving you a pass. You can stay home and grill some burgers in the back yard and hoist a few lagers.

Here are my opinions: It would not be considered unusual for you and your son to go to the church memorial service. You can skip the actual internment if you like. If you're not close, you don't have to go, but it would probably be nice. Sending condolence cards, flowers, or a monetary gift to cancer fund or something similar is good etiquette.

Most likely it will be closed casket. You do not have to wear black--anything reasonably conservative and respectful will do.

Your son's friend may not even notice your appearance at all--he'll likely be too busy with his grief and with his family. Being "there for him" afterwards would probably go further to help him.

And Thor might very well be scared of you dying, or of dying, period. I know I am. Discussion and love are merited here.

Well, as for what to expect if you go... yes, you should wear black, and if there's a viewing beforehand then yes, it's officially open-casket and it has a good chance of staying open for the service. However, it will be up at the front on a slightly raised platform, and it's likely you will be unable to see the body from out in the audience (which is why they have the viewings beforehand.)

As for who should generally attend, it's usually less about who knew the dead guy and more about who knew the dead guy's relatives. Lots of people showed up at my grandmother's funeral who never knew her, but were good friends of my aunts and uncles and were there to support them. But when the friends are kids, that's a little more unusual. If I were a kid, I don't know if I'd want my classmates to see me crying at my dad's funeral. But it's hard to say. If this kid is like one of Thor's best friends, there's a possibility he should go. But if he's just an acquaintance, I think it's probably better to just send the card to the family and coach Thor on some small friendly/supportive thing to say the next time he sees his friend after the funeral.

And the friend's feelings aside, I think if Thor's feeling uncomfortable about it, he shouldn't go.

A few more thoughts: You (even just you and your son) could go to the church service, skip the internment, then go have lunch or something, which would give you a chance to discuss the cycle of life, blah blah.

There also could be some benefit to going through the whole routine--church service, internment, and the party afterwards. Yes, there's usually a party afterwards, where all the friends and relatives eat and drink and reminisce. We don't usually call it a wake or anything that formal here, in my experience.

But I remember my mom's funeral and party--I was a bit upset. Why were all these people eating and drinking and having a good time? It was explained to me, that these parties are for the living, to help with their grief.

In that respect, going through all of it for someone he's not close to, could help your son understand and be prepared down the road, when it really matters. Both emotional lessons, and etiquette lessons. There's something to be said for learning and practicing how to act and make small talk in such settings.

I note Clod and I DISAGREE on some of the details--there may be cultural or regional differences at play.

(edited: duh)

Thanks all.

Yeah, Thor and "Fred" are pretty close. I'm not a huge fan of the relationship, but Fred has had a helluva lot to deal with in his short life, so no suprise he's a little disruptive (dad was given 4 weeks two years ago then went on an experimental drug, apparently -we didn't know them then , but I knew of them because I know everything)

And yes, I know funerals are for the survivors. that's the only reason I feel like sorta we oughta. As for intruding on Fred's grief, he was in school today, happy as Larry, don't think it's hit home yet. Maybe it will tomorrow. Maybe it'll take month or years. But will he feel better for Thor being there? Maybe. What bad can happen if we go? Thor could get more scared, I guess. I talked to him a little more since I posted. He says he's nervoud, but is not sure what of and I don't think it's of us dying. I think maybe he feels like me -not sure what to expect.

I'm thinking we should go

...so what should we do? Dress appropriately and then what? We still mail the condolence card, right? Do we need to take anything? Remember to doanything?

nobody wants to go a funeral. But it can be an important way to foster relationships, if that's important to you or your son.

If you go--tell us if everyone wore black and if there was an open casket!

My nieces have attended funerals or visitations since pretty young. My brother and sis-in-law are always ready to talk about it with them. The girls handle it pretty well. I think it's good for kids to go. Your kids, like my nieces, are pretty sharp, and you have a good relationship so if Thor wants to talk to you I think he will.

It is also something that will mean something to Fred, if not yet, then later.

As an aside, my youngest niece was probably 3 when she went to a visitation with the family. Later she was asked what she thought about it, and she shrugged and said "we got there and the guy was already dead." Some visit! :)

wearing black is not a problem for me -I never wear anything else ;)

Thor could wear a nice pair of khakis and a dress shirt--no one is going to think anything of it if he's not in a black suit.

lol @ shawnee. Death is not a taboo subject for us, it's just the whole funeral thing that's new. Cloud, thanks for the "nobody wants to go to a funeral", I needed to hear that it wasn't psychopathically antisocial to not want to go.

At Thor's birthday party, Beest and I dubbed Fred "Kid most likely to go on to become a serial killer" We didn't knoe then that Fred was THE Fred whose dad had bad cancer -like most of the rest of the school, we assumed he'd died quietly after his 4 weeks, so the fact that Fred had a dad meant it wasn't that Fred. Wrong.

Um. He doesn't even have those items. But we'll do our best. i sort of thought dress code would be more relaxed for kids -darker stuff, no logos....

Yes, I amend my earlier statement about black--the kids can get away with not wearing black pants, because they're kids. Heck, in some families you can show up in Hawaiian shirts. But if you don't know the family, black will never offend anyone.

This is the email we got from the Principal:

Arrangements for Fred's Dad are as follows:

There will be visitation at thefuneral home from 4pm to 9pm on Friday June 18th. More visitation at 11:00 am on Saturday at the church before the service. The funeral will be at noon on Saturday June19 at the Church. Burial at Forest Hill Cemetery and then a luncheon at Trinity will follow the service.

It is, of course, a family decision whether to bring your children to the visitation or funeral. Many kids have never been to this sort of event and won't know what to expect. If you are bringing them, you should talk them through what they may see and what may happen ahead of time. You should also discuss expected behavior and what to say. You should plan to go with your child and stay with him or her the entire time they are there, and ask them afterwards if they have any questions or want to talk.

Thanks for your sensitivity and support.


I sort of feel I'm failing on the discussing with him what to expect field because I have no idea what to expect. I'm thinking to take a book for him to read. Maybe not entirely tactful, but guaranteed to stop him being antsy

I understand, but I think a book would be extremely poor etiquette, even for kids. A very small child/toddler might be given a toy to play with, but -- no. If I saw that, I would think it would be very disrespectful.

If you think he would need a book or other distraction in order to behave appropriately, then I don't think you should go.

hmm. I didn't mean during the actual service, but maybe you're right. I'm worried he'll mess about during "waiting" times, but perhaps it would look too "unconcerned" to the truly bereaved.

I'd have taken him to the Friday night viewing. You're not required to stay the whole time, just long enough to offer condolences to the bereaved. Some stay because it's a reunion with people they only see at weddings and funerals, but by no means required.

wan't possible. Plus viewing sunds too, er, gross

I would take him to the lunch. The actual funeral is tramatic for most of us, kids even more so. All that crying and such might make it even harder for Thor to get over the fear of growing up. The lunch is to remember the person, and to socialize. This would be the best time for Thor and Fred to spend a few mins together. You have taken the time to go, and offer condolances, but if you did not know him that well... you are not intruding in what looks to be a very full and crowded funeral.

Hard call. Everyone else has good ideas though. I do not envy this decision. Best of luck.

I'd take Thor to the visitation, and the funeral. Yeah, it's kinda spooky, at first, but kids are pretty resilient, generally, and based on "knowing" you, I'd guess that yours are more so. Thor's friend will appreciate seeing some people he knows, rather than being stuck in a sea of sad adults that he doesn't know, but keeps being told are second cousins so many times removed. That was my experience with family funerals, anyway. I lost a friend to cancer who had youngish children, and they appreciated having time with their friends. You can also let him know that he doesn't have to do the walk past the coffin thing ... some Visitations are closed casket, it's really more about seeing the family. I'm unused to the coffin remaining open through the service, although I've primarily gone to Catholic funerals. Best one was a Jewish one, which was far more about celebrating the life of the departed, rather than focusing on the departing.

I've been to a couple where the person was cremated, and you wander about looking at some photo displays, and maybe an endless loop DVD memorial thing. I'm used to the interment being private. I've been to both family and public (i.e., police and fire) funerals.

Completely agree. My Mum took us to a couple of funerals when we were younger to teach us exactly that. They were people my parents knew from church, so there was a connection, but not an emotional one.
Funerals are solemn occasions. Thor will definitely pick up on this and I'm sure will behave accordingly.
I disagree. Firstly, the people with the closest connection will be at the front of the church. Any crying will be out of sight of Thor & Mons. And when someone dies after a long fight with cancer the grief is likely to be of the leaking-at-the-eyes variety, surely? Mons just needs to explain that Fred's Dad was ill and in a lot of pain; people are sad because he's gone, but glad he's not in pain any more. IMO

I can't discuss the etiquette etc as obviously I've no experience of the American way of handling things. But from Thor's POV I think to attend would be a useful milestone.

I don't know about etiquette for funerals in the US.

But I remember that when I lost my father to a heart attack (I was 14), my friends came to the funeral. I knew they were there even if I only have a very vague memory of that day. Yet, in a way, it was comforting. And later, we became better friends...

I'm not sure about funeral etiquette in the US either and prior to reading this thread, I hadn't thought about the associated issues, but certainly whenever either I've had a family member pass away or a friend has, the presence of friends (no matter how close or otherwise they were before the funeral) at whatever part of the proceedings has always been really appreciated. I think it makes the person who has lost someone feel that it's ok to be upfront about the death, rather than pretending that they have to be stoic and everything is ok.

I don't think I'd take my boys to a friend's parent's funeral. The main reason being that I think as kids they just don't need to be exposed to that level of grief.

I think if it were a close friend of either of my boys, I'd maybe suggest picking him up after the funeral and bringing him home to hang out or something. One, because maybe it would help the child, and two because it might help the remaining parent in a way. Not saying to offer would be accepted, but it's probably something I'd do.

It's a hard thing, but I personally just don't think kids need to go to funerals.

Unless he has a "FUCK CANCER" t-shirt, then yes, no logos.

I agree that if it's the dad of a close friend, you should go to support Thor's friend. Sometimes friends can be closer than family.

Dark or black colors are preferred. 'Business casual' is usually ok for guests. I have not had to wear suits to many funerals.

I've gone to a lot of funerals with open caskets, and generally if you sit in back, you don't have to see it. In some cases, the casket is only open for a short time. This is a combination of faith and family preference. In our case the funeral director had us view the body and make the decision.

Depending on faith or preference, there may be a lunch for family and close friends afterwards, or they may go back to someones house for a wake/shiva/gathering.

Funerals are hardest on young mourning children. Adult guests who come up to offer condolences have a hard enough time saying anything meaningful to adult mourners. If Thor is a close friend, his being there could be a big help depending on how many relatives or siblings are there who are close to the kid's age.

Agree with the agree.



Let us know how it goes, monster.

Kids are fine at funerals. You just have to let them know in general what to expect.

I posted about my kids in a thread here. I was a little worried about it, but it turns out the kids were a hell of a lot more normal with death than the adults.

Thanks we're going. Borrowed hector's dark concert pants and found a black t-shirt. I gave him the option of trying to find some navy cargo shorts, but he likes the pants.

Now, on arrival, what to we expect? is there a reception line or something? I don't know that we'll make the visitation. Or will we just slip into a back row and meet the relatives after? I'm off to get dressed, I'll be back for your answers in a few minutes, thanks :)


Have decided to take his DS to play on the way there and back, knowing that he can get to his DS after something often helps him concentrate.

thanks glatt, I think he'll be fine, I just needed help with the decision of the right thing to do becasue of course we'd rather be at the pool.

Yeah, I think you'll both feel better having gone.
My kids have both been to several, and they have always handled them just fine. I mean, no one goes for the fun, but it's the right thing to do.

If you're going straight to the funeral, you will probably be greeted and seated. Afterwards, people go to their cars to head to the cemetary. Not everyone goes to the cemetary. After that there is typically a church or a home where everyone meets and eats and talks. After all the agony leading up to the death, and the stress of the funeral...I find it is usually an uplifting thing. People will talk about good things they remember, have a laugh or two.

Play it by ear...just being there is all you really need to do.

There will be a reception line at some point. I've mostly seen them at the lunch after the service and at the viewings before the service.

So we should go to the lunch? Seems intrusive but that may be more where Thor gets a chance to be with Fred.

If it were me, I'd go to the lunch if it was in some sort of church hall or something, and wouldn't go if it was in a private residence. They are actually kind of fun after the serious business of the service. You'll know other parents there, right?

I agree, go to the lunch and give Thor and Fred a chance to hang out.

You might take a few flowers - if no one's looking.

We're back. We did the whole thing but didn't stay too long at the lunch. No I didn't really know anyone except Fred's mom and his dad's partner who I met once and who was weeping a lot and surrounded by her relatives. But Thor made the decision to go to all the parts to be there for his friend. Who could've cared less, to be honest. I think it's really too early for it to have sunk in for him yet, and it's been coming for more than two years, plus he's an only kid and loves to be the center of attention. but maybe, later, when he needs a friend to tal k to, it will help that Thor was there. A couple of other kids were at the service, but not the burial or lunch. Kids just wore regular clothes -Fred was in a comic strip t-shirt and shorts. Not all adults wore black but most did.

Yes, it was open casket at the visitation beforehand, but not during the funeral. Which was 90 minutes long and included a full communion. Then we joined the processin to the cemetary, during which I got a nosebleed -and I was driving the stick-shift car -plus being a funeral procession, we blew through all the red lights, so no stopping opportunity to grab more kleenex... :lol: Cemetary was brief, Fred's dad's partner was pretty emotional, Fred's mom was somewhat inappropriately dressed in a mini cocktail dress with ladders in the tights. I guess it was hard for there being there on the row behind Fred who was being cuddled by his dad's partner and her family.

And it was hot. Hoping to go to the pool in a mo, but apparently the power is out and likely to stay that way until Monday. I hear we may have found a generator.

Ooh, that is awkward. On the other hand, I suspect the dad's girlfriend will basically never see him again after this point.

I think he was the custodial parent, but they both lived in the same cohousing project as far as I can tell. the girlfriend was certainly as in charge as the mom at the last birthday party.

Um, so now we went, do we still send a card?

If you attended the funeral, probably no need to send a card.

You're in Aus, though, right? No offence, but Americans do some of these things differently, hence the question.

Sure send a card... Thanks for the party, had a wonderful time, let's do it again real soon.

you suck :lol:

assuming you signed the guestbook, then probably no need to send a card. But Thor could write a personal condolence letter to his friend. I bet it would get points for novelty, at the least. ;)

Ah, scantily clad people at funerals, they're the best.

I know its over, and I'm sorry I didn't chime in earlier. Sounds like y'all did fine.
Here things are a bit different I think, but I know a lot of it has to do with individuals and there family. Non-close relatives or acquaintances generally wear less formal clothing, just somber colors, and that sorta thing. (So that's the same.) Cowboy hats are fine (yes even with a suit), but to be taken off in the building or at least during service. Graveside(internment?) is usually just close relatives/family due to lack of room mostly I think. When you get there, there should be directors tellin the people in the cars where to park, cuz you want all the people going to graveside lined up nicely to drive off, and those not goin to graveside out of the way. Ushers should seat you, if not, then the family rows should be marked off, if that's not done either, just stay outta the first 3 rows. Open casket, closed, or urn are all up to the family. I've been to 2 funerals of cremated loved ones, and they were graveside only, I honestly don't know if that is normal. Everyone is invited to the wake (that's what I've always heard the lunch afterwards called), potluck is the most common type but I've been to a few catered. No need to take anything, but sending a card after would not be seen as odd. If Thor wants, him writing a personal message would likely be well appreciated.
Anyway, I know its all late, I just like to get my 2cents in there too.

Thanks.

we did sign the book.

We were told where to park -it was a bit of a surprise when we arrived to be asked about cemetary/no cemetary -I'd planned to make that decision later- so we went cemetary and had a magnetic flag plonked on the roof and were given a place in line to park.

The main thing I came away with is: do not attend a funeral in a shift-stick wind-down-windows car, and do not have noesbleeds.

On the plus side....

I was pleasantly suprised to find that I can still sing ...it just needs to be church music! :lol:

One of my fave movies is Moonstruck, and one of my fave lines from it is:

Johnny: "In time, you will see that this is the best thing."

Lorena: "In time you'll drop dead and I'll come to your funeral in a red dress!"

so . . . now you know what to wear! ;)

I only do black, I wore a skirt, though, which is unusual. And real shoes. The ones i wore at my graduation and wedding. Fuck, they hurt after the hike over the graves - I don't think i've worn them since my post-grad degree ceremony.

At Mr. Clod's grandmother's funeral, we had to go graveside in the snow. And it wasn't until after arriving at the airport that I even remembered that it snows in other states, and realized that my strappy black sandal heels were not going to fly. Fortunately, this podunk town in Illinois still had a Wal-Mart, and I managed to pick up a pair of acceptably tasteful calf-high black boots before the funeral.

True. No offence taken at all.

Just heard about 2 hours ago that an old family friend who we haven't seen since the last funeral (3 years ago) passed away on Sunday (cancer). I called another friend who I've seen more recently to let him know and we had a semi-lengthy discussion about the justification for going/not going. In this case, I'll be going because I had a lot of time for the person who passed away and still have for his whole family and they were a really significant part of my teenage years. I'm interested to hear people's viewpoints (even though I'm not wavering about the decision that I've made).

I don't know of anyone who would be offended at someone turning up at a funeral (discounting family feuds/ conflict/ lawsuits etc). If anything it works more the other way, "I can't believe they didn't even come to the funeral..."

In the end, if you can justify attending, you should go. Similarly if you feel you have a good reason not to, then stay at home.
You can't second guess the reaction of anyone suffering from grief, it has to come from the heart.

I'd agree 100%.

nailed.

By the way, thanks all for your input. Whilst I am mostly all acclimatized, occasionally life throws a spanner in the works (;)) and I need a little social guidance.