Not Ugly Cars
 

Now that we know what we don't like in cars, what do we like? I like the new Thunderbird its not the old Bird but it'll do.

Of course I've got kids so I'd be better off driving this lil' beauty.

Looking at those sticker prices, I think I'll keep driving my Nissan

mmmm...

~james

Thats a pretty sexy ride. I'm not sure theres room for your ball bat though.

I looked around on the Ford site a little, apparently the beautiful people who drive thunderchickens often get caught bathing in fountains. Something to do with homelessness caused by car payments?

god i love that car. it will be mine one day.

~james

Re: Not Ugly Cars
 

The original Tbird was a beautiful car. Innovative in thought. Designed by car people. Then a bean counter who did not even have a driver's license turned it into a bloated piece of crap. Car guys who later wrote books (both from Ford and GM) rountinely note how a good thing was perverted. It drove like your living room couch. It was too big. It rode like a water ballon. Its engine was such low performance that it required bigger and bigger engines. It polluted excessively. Gas mileage was embarrassing. Then it had trouble idling without overheating. The Tbird demonstrated exactly what was wrong with Ford Motor and now demonstrates that someone is slowly getting their act together. Yes, it takes 20+ years to undo the destruction of bean counter mentalities.

What makes something pretty is what is under the skin. For example, what makes a pretty women? Big breasts? Curvy figure? Good complextion? Desireable face? Good personality?

All those are indicators of something superior under the skin. Big firm breast (not overly enlarged) means she is fertile and can better nurse children. Curvy figure with well proportioned hips means she is ready to raise healthy kids. Good complextion with a symmetrical face means she is genetically superior and healthy. And so it goes. Those things that we call pretty are really based upon fundamentally essential features under the skin.

That new Tbird is pretty because of what is inside. There are still many improvements necessary, but it is a good first step.

Then there are perverts who want a 50+" chest on a woman and call something pretty only because of its size or price. You know you've made it when you can buy a $2000 per night hooker. After all, at that price, the sex must be better.

What is pretty is really based upon fundamental facts. If a Porshe had a Pinto engine, then what would it be? If a tree did not provide heat, homes, fruit, shade, oxygen, and soil conservation, then what would it be? Any ugly, ungainly, disjointed, unsymmetrical weed.

a beetle.

~james

in Davids head.


One of my college buds had a Merc Cougar a Thunderbird by any other name still sucks gas It was that 50" woman. 351 Cleveland and you couldn't see anything in front of the vehicle, not a great combination.

http://cellar.org/2002/350z.jpg

350Z. 0-60 in 5.4 seconds. $26,500. It will be mine.

Maybe in a few years when the dealer markups come down.

my father-in-law almost bout a 350z, but then his wife talked some "sense" into him. but he did get the dealership to give him a little push-pedal toy 350z. :)

~james

Maybach

a great site, if you've got the time ...

a great car, if you've got the dough ...

Hey now... I drive a Cat and I like it.

Except for the lack of engine performance even in the V8 which I remedied somewhat myself.

I still get 400 miles hwy on a tankful...not bad for a 4.6 L V8

And it's comfortable for my large frame and still can haul the groceries and trailer when I need it to.

I wish I had a pic digitized to attach but I don't.

Brian

Cars that don't suck
 

70 Dodge Challenger
<img src="http://www.musclecarrestorations.com/lill/lill47.jpg">
69 Plymouth Roadrunner
<img src="http://www.mopar.homestead.com/files/69roadrunner.jpg">

Maybe I was too short for it? That long hood just didn't do it for me.

http://fab.cali.free.fr/indexwallpap.../audi%20tt.jpg
mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.........

Quite classy, the TT! That would be my second choice, after the new Z, but it would have to be the 225 HP Quattro version. Of course.

VW beetles had engines superior to Pintos. Even the deisgn of the Pinto engine as sold in Europe was a superior engine of its time. A Porche with a Pinto engine would be ugly because the Pinto version of that 2.3 liter engine was crap. What makes the Porche pretty? Certainly not its shape. Same applies to the TT. It is what is underneath that creates beauty.

More cars that dont suck
 

2003 Viper
<img src="http://mywebpages.comcast.net/jdaniels150688/Images/03viper3.jpg">
<img src="http://mywebpages.comcast.net/jdaniels150688/Images/03viper4.jpg">

i was joking. sorry it wasnt funny.

~james

Design News has just published its annual survey of engineers on cars.

Under $15K: best - Honda; worst - Kia

$15K to $25K: best - Toyota; worst - Hyundai

$25K to $35K: best - Honda Volvo Toyota BMW; worst- Ford

$35K to $45K: best - BMW; worst - Cadillac

$45K and up: best - Mercedes; worst - Cadillac

Car most owned by engineeers - Ford.

Most noteable change - engineers now prefer comfort over handling. This is attributed by the article to an aging engineering population. Consistent with another American trend that colleges graduate less engineers both in percentage and numbers. Last time this was a trend, America ended up in the recession many years later in late 70s and 80s.

In the 70s, 80s and 90s, there really are no classic American vehicles of mention. Nothing to compete with a mid-60s Chevelle, a 65 Mustang or its Shelby version, the 57 Chevy, the first T-bird and early Corvettes (when Corvettes were classy machines). Nothing in the early 1970s tops the German built Ford Capri or the Datsun Z series - especially the 260Z with its electronic fuel injection. The Mazda RX-7 is a most worthy example. Honda's NSX - the all aluminum car was special as is their S-2000 or BMW's Z coupe. Honorable mention to the DeLorean. Lotus Europa was indeed special. Mazda's Miata is a superb example of making an excellent sports car at a respectable price - and even earning a profit its first year out.

GMs long list of classics is a disaster list from the 4-6-8 Cadillac to the Oldmobile Diesel, the notch back Caddy, a Buick two seater (Regal?) whose body was built in Italy and shipped to the US on jumbo jets, Chevy Vega, Chevy Corvair, GM pickups with side mounted exploding gas tanks, the first GM V-6s that were nothing more than V-8s with two cylinders cut off (made obvious by how the engine vibrated), every 1970 and early 1980s GM 4 cylinder driven vehicle, and the so many GM cars (including Oldsmobiles with Chevy engines) that used a grossly undersized (and self destructing) Chevette transmission even in truck towing packages. Add to that list the Ford Edsel and Pinto, and the AMC Pacer. Classic list of shame mostly when bean counters designed all cars.

It occurs to me that, if that is the case, Toyota's US division needs to be lined up and shot. Toyota's marketing is just horrible, and Kia's, almost perfect.

Remember the Toyota "TV Guy"? A corporate shill so utterly annoying that it could only ruin the reputation of anything marketed with it. An idea worthy of selling... oh, I don't know, maybe candy or toys or something.

Subaru?
 

I thought I'd reprise this thread since we're not done shopping. We're starting to think that AWD is a necessity here rather than a nice option. I'm really tired of the Subaru Outback, visually. We've been looking at the new Impreza no two-tone paint, Subarus long term knowlege of AWD, etc... The gas mileage cannot touch the VW diesels. Toyotas little AWD wagon looks like it'd be hard to see out of... Anybody have Subaru knowlege?

Yup. I don't care how bad their cars are -- I want a Sale Monkey, dammit.

I love my 1993 Subaru Impreza. No AWD, but I'm in the South so I didn't need it. It's got 109,000 miles on it now and it has been 100% dependable. All I've ever had to do is get regular maintenance.

Of course now that I've said that "out loud," I am ready for the wheels to fall off ...

My Grandma got an outback she really likes it, I got to drive it around and thought it was impressive. Really good handling. I didn't drive it in winter so don't know how it handles ice and snow pack but I bet it would do pretty well.

Speaking of Subarus

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze...imprezawrc.jpg

My precious....:D

Damn, I love pro-rally.

Cool! Maybe impreza is the answer.

You could get one of the WRX models - pretty zippy, I hear. And not bad looking, either.

I can only assume that engineers would get major wood over this little gem, then...

http://www.fordvehicles.com/fordgt/index.asp?bhcp=1

And for those who cannot abide Flash Animation download times, here's a drooler pic.

I had a Matchbox that looked just like that. In 1971.

I am neither male, nor engineer, and I have major wood over that GT pic.

Speaking of cars
 

I will be at the auto show at the convention center Saturday. Is anyone else up to drooling over sports cars and antiques with me?

If so, just set up a time and place (preferably closer to the am) for us to meet and I'll be there.

Dagney, you are most welcome to come but you are responsible for travel to either there or here.

Brian