Tonights Debate 15 Oct 2008
 

How did they do?

It hasn't happened yet has it?

6 min left.

Obama looks smug and McCain called him "Joe" I lol'd. Its pretty bad when you try to insult your opponent and refer to him with the wrong name.

It's being televised here in about that amount of time. Midday. I'm tossing up between that and Dr Phil. I'm not sure who's going to speak more crap though.

Sorry, it goes for another 1 hour or so. There is much left to be said. Let me state that in the first hour.....


Obama kicked McCains ass in most aspects. He is a master orator. Cudos to him. Now let's see if he can pull it off.

And Damm, This fucking "Joe the Plumber" dude is going to be rich, that mofo needs to write a book. Plumber, pfffttttt..... :D

Obama's still in The Wrong Party. He's spent the debate outlining the Dem intent to tax us into prosperity.

Yeah, riiiiiight. That's never worked before and who thinks it would work now? The Democrats have found the Stupid voting bloc a reliable steppingstone to office. Worked for Bill. Personally, I successfully avoid voting with the Stupids -- Ole Possum Head never got my vote, and I've never understood why anybody thought a second term for him was a good idea.

McCain really talks down to Obama. He's like a grandfather talking to a grandchild.

I wonder if that's how he views the rest of the population of the US.

mydebate.org

Joe is the king...

http://www.joeclipart.com/blog/image...70628crack.jpg

Ali, just the Stupids. I talk down to 'em myself.

Apparently you missed the first debate, in which Obama called McCain "Jim."

But I guess Jim/John is closer than Joe/Barack...

Hey Joe!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtYMcMYvW9Q

NBC had commentary by Mitt Romney. He was quite personable. Why did this guy not make it to the republican nomination? He might have given Barack a run for his money.

Kudos to Obama for trying to engage this guy. If someone had tried a similar tactic with Palin she would have shouted him down with "Sir bless you for exercising your right that my son is risking his life for and you need to think of your country first".

Well UG my friend, as you can probably guess, I'd be voting for Obama if I were a US citizen. Does that mean you think I'm a stupid too?

Wait a minute. You said 'my friend'. Are you senile?

No, just stupid. ;)

Truer words were never spoken. :haha:

Joe the Plumber is an idiot. He was a plant from the McCain campaign sent there to ambush Obama. Obama handled it with class, dignity, and character as he always does.

In fact, I wish he would get down a dirty. Tonight McCain mentioned ACORN and Ayres. Two things that have no connection to the Obama campaign and are nothing but sleazy attempts to smear Obama. I was begging Obama from my screen to mention McCain's association with G. Gordon Liddy, or his close personal friendship with Charles Keating in which his entire family (including the babysitter) were flown to the Bahamas on Keating who was stealing money from Lincoln savings and loan. McCain was the most corrupt member of the Keating Five. Obama should have mentioned McCain's close association with a white supremacist named Richard Quinn, who found himself hired as a political advisor by McCain in 2000.


Obama is an honorable man, and I commend him for taking the high road, but I desperately want to see him take off his jacket and tie, roll up his sleeves and sling the same kind of mud that McCain is doing.

John McCain's campaign is straight out of Karl Rove's playbook. McCain has launched the largest and dirtiest smear campaign in the history of global politics. His supporters spread racist messages, outright lies, idiotic accusations about being Muslim, or not being patriotic, or things that don't matter like what his pastor or wife said. These sleezeballs doctor photos, lie about his hand over his heart during the pledge when the photo was taken during the song "America the Beautiful"...not the national anthem.

In every McCain campaign commercial they spread lies. They question his integrity and character. Obama sticks to the issues and tells the truth. That is refreshing for an American Presidential candidate.

The filthy lies and smears to attack Obama have obviously not worked for McCain because he's behind in the polls by double-digits. It would have been nice to see Obama get a few gut shots and finish the debates with a knockout instead of a unanimous decision.

I think McCain only said "My Friends" twice last night. Somebody must have talked to him about it.

He can win without it. Why take the risk?
It's exactly this sort of calculus that makes me support his presidency. I want someone who can weigh the pros and cons without emotion and chose the correct solution. If Spock were running, I would vote for him.

I think it would be a big mistake for Obama to get down and dirty. Right now he is doing things differently and people seem to appreciate it.

I certainly do. The man has class, whereas McCain comes across as a thug.

I thought I was watching Sesame Street. Joe the Plumber. "These are the people in your neighborhood, in your neighborhood..."

I was squirming FOR McCain, every time he got pissy, rolled his eyes, snorted, and started breathing heavily and sighing. I thought he was melting before my very eyes. I was thinking "hold on there, John...wait, is your finger near the proverbial button?"

I like the fact that the person who will be representing our country can hold a conversation with class and dignity, and not be flustered when engaged in debate. Are these not important traits for a president?

Yehbut...would you want to have a beer with him? I wouldn't. I'd much pefer a bottle of wine.

I'd smoke cigars and drink scotch with him.

Radar,

You need to check you facts. I've noticed many of your posts are filled with incorrect information.

The Senate Ethics Committee determined that Alan Cranston, Dennis DeConcini, and Donald Riegle had substantially and improperly interfered with the FHLBB in its investigation of Lincoln Savings, with Cranston receiving a formal reprimand. Senators John Glenn and John McCain were cleared of having acted improperly.

There aren't many politicians I'd want to have a drink with.
Unless they were paying of course, and then - have at it!

Except Sinn Fein of course.
There isn't a brewery big enough to provide enough beer to get me to sit down with them.
I never really forgave Clinton for shaking Gerry Adam's hand.

Oh come on Sarge - Why would you interrupt his little tirade with facts ... thats no fun.

Radar - you say this is the largest and dirtiest smear campaign? You must not be a student of history. Let's check out some earlier campaigns.

1876: Rutherford Hayes vs. Samuel Tilden -- This is the granddaddy of them all: a truly stolen election in which Republicans turned defeat into victory for Rutherford Hayes by counting Democratic votes as their own in three Southern states. Both parties used violence to intimidate former black slaves for their votes. And not to mention that Republicans extorted 2% of the salaries of Federal employees to aid in their campaign efforts, or that Democrats accused Hayes of shooting his mother and robbing the dead, or that Republicans claimed that Samuel Tilden suffered from venereal disease.

1964: Lyndon Johnson vs. Barry Goldwater -- Not as well know as Nixon's 1972 dirty tricks election, Johnson's 1964 win over Goldwater featured the cynical manufacturing of anti-Goldwater stories planted with gullible reporters; children's coloring books portraying Goldwater as a Klansman; CIA invasion of Goldwater's campaign; and FBI bugging of Goldwater's campaign plane.

1800: Thomas Jefferson vs. John Adams -- Wayback in only the third election ever held in this country, Thomas Jefferson of the Republicans and John Adams of the Federalists went at it tooth and nail, with Republicans hiring hack writers to attack the incumbent Adams as a "hideous hermaphroditical character." whatever that means, and Federalsts claiming that Jefferson slept with slaves. Thomas Jefferson claimed incumbent John Adams wanted to marry off his son to the daughter of King George III, creating an American dynasty under British rule. Jefferson haters called the challenger a fraud, a coward, a thief, and "a mean-spirited, low-lived fellow, the son of a half-breed Indian squaw, sired by a Virginia mulatto father." The close election was thrown into the House of Representatives, where Jefferson almost certainly made a secret deal to win it all.

Those campaigns were certainly dirty, but not on the scale we have today. McCain's supporters are accusing Obama of being a terrorists, or hanging out with them. They are making up bogus stories about his birth certificate not being authentic in an effort to take attention away from the fact that McCain isn't a natural-born American citizen. They doctor photos, they make racist comments, they lie and lie and lie and lie. And unlike the elections you mentioned, now we've got the internet and hundreds of television stations constantly barraging us with these negative smear campaigns plus biased radio shows by morons like Savage, Hannity, O'Reilly, Limbaugh, Coulter, etc.

In two of the elections you mentioned, we had fewer states than we do now, and in all of them we had a lot less people.

McCain and Glenn were cleared because of their political clout and for no other reason. McCain was the closest to Keating of all of the Keating Five. He got the most in bribes, and special favors. His family were all close to Charles Keating, and McCain himself tried to get regulators to stop investigating Lincoln Savings & Loan and Keating.

Religion.

Thank God. That drove me crazy with the last debate.

:lol2:

The blind leading the blind.

That's all you got? :headshake

Sing with me, "which one of these is not like the other?"

Most interesting in last nights debate was not a single mention of Iraq or surge or troops or victory.

Or did I nod off?

Actually Merc, I think they are all about the same - worthless.

I contend that Obama whipped McCain's ass in the debate. Not that much of what Obama said I agreed with, because he said essentially the same bs that he has been saying for the last 2 years, but hey, the dudes a master orator.

He's also a smart, effective, and perceptive communicator. I think its time for someone like that in the White House.

He's also consistent. That he's been saying the same thing for two years suggests he actually has a plan. You might not like his plan, but at least he has one.

Well actually no that is not true. He has been saying the same things but he really only produced more specific plans since his nomination. And most of them are so broadly worded that there is no evidence any of them will work. Same for McCain, but his plans have been around a bit longer, Obama is a late comer to that game.

http://www.toontowncentral.com/galle...orly-42891.jpg

Orator:
2. one distinguished for skill and power as a public speaker

The news commentators? I've seen them all. I could never put O'Reilly in that group. Compared to the others he would be considered a demoncrat. :D

ya rly
http://politicalhumor.about.com/libr...in_shining.jpg

lol pie that's wicked!

OMFG, there's dirt everywhere.

The state of Ohio has placed a lien on Joe the Plumber's property for failure to pay taxes. The guy doesn't pay his taxes. He owes Ohio $1,182.98. Does the McCain team vet anyone?

Oh, and he doesn't have a license to be a plumber.

Joe didn't bother with the license either.
Thanks to John McCain for rooting out corruption!

bwahahahahahaha

I noticed that when it came to Roe v Wade and Supreme Court Justice appointments, John McCain would not impose a "litmus test". He "is a Federalist", he believes it is a state's rights issue.

Interestingly, when it comes to laws regarding health insurance, he believes that the current system of individual states administering their own laws is inferior to the job that could be done by the Federal Government and seeks to abolish those state laws.

He has demonstrated the same ideological flexibility when it comes to the bailout of wall street too.

So, Senator, are you a Federalist only when it comes to "extreme" issues like women's health? Or are you for big government, dictating what laws the states can make about the sale of health insurance?

Hypocrite, much?

So, basically you think his point of a person who is a small business owner making over 250k is moot, and there are plenty of guys doing that, should they just give up a bigger chunk of their hard earned income and give it to those who pay nothing. I mean on top of what they already give. I mean the bottom portion basically pay nothing now, so how do you give an income tax break to those who already pay nothing? Anyone????

"The bottom portion"?

Where you drawing that line merc? Are you seriously telling me that a guy earning $75k per annum isn't currently struggling under a tax burden?

Considering how many Americans earn less than $250k, I'd be careful about labelling them a mere 'portion'.

What I've been reading is that he would only own $900 more in taxes. How is that supposed to stop him from opening the business?

Isn't Tuvok close enough?

"I find Senator McCain's views to be highly illogical".:D

So Obama's plan will cost nothing, by your logic.

It won't cost a non-paying income tax earner a dime. But those who already pay the majority of the tax will get an increase. So please tell me again, how those income earners who pay nothing already will get a tax break under Obama's plan?

New data released by the IRS today offers interesting insights into the distributional spread of the federal income tax burden, new analysis by the Tax Foundation shows. The new data shows that the top-earning 25% of taxpayers (AGI over $62,068) earned 67.5% of the nation's income, but they paid more than four out of every five dollars collected by the federal income tax (86%). The top 1% of taxpayers (AGI over $364,657) earned approximately 21.2% of the nation's income (as defined by AGI), yet paid 39.4% of all federal income taxes. That means the top 1% of tax returns paid about the same amount of federal individual income taxes as the bottom 95% of tax returns.

http://taxprof.typepad.com/taxprof_b...pay-more-.html




http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/1410.html

I was just reading Obama's tax plan again and the site makes it seem like everyone is getting a break except for the uber rich. who only pay 2% more - The numbers just don't seem to add up. If he implements this plan along with all the other "things" he proposes, I don't see how we, as a nation, cannot go further into debt.

Well I don't know about you, but I hear bitching and moaning about the cost of the wars followed by a grand scheme to spend more money that we don't have to bail out the financial crisis, followed by Pelosi asking for another 150 billion, which was just revised to another 300 billion. And this is following the mantra of "fiscal responsibility" that the Demoncrats got elected on? Ummmmmm ok, how? I am no math wiz but I did complete some advanced degress, but that math does not add up in the face of our all ready over burdened debt. I mean if you ran up your credit cards to the max would then get a second and then a third mortage on your house to make the next months payments? Cause that is what is seems like we are doing.

Aw hell. We could just do like Rhodesia and print more money..... :D It worked out well for them so far.