"A Fat Rant"
 

I guess this isn't entirely new, but since it's made circulation on Dateline and a few other spots I think it's fair game for some rekindled discussion. First off, watch the video on YouTube, just search for "A Fat Rant" or wait until someone eventually embeds it here in a later post. It's not too bad, definitely one of the more articulated entries on the subject that I've encountered. However, I'd like to hear what people have to say about her bit on dieting. Even though she never says "so don't bother!", she digs into it pretty strongly without differentiating between fad diets, crash diets, or other alternatives to just relegating certain foods to the 'once in a blue moon' bin.
My personal take? Weight is sometimes a reflection of how well you treat yourself, other times it is not. There is no universal truth to be gained about someone by noticing that they are 30lbs heavier then average.
It should also be said that I find those who try to mark slim people as unhealthy (slim, not emaciated), as insulting as those who say that all overweight people are disgusting. I used to know someone who would insinuate that all skinny people have eating disorders. The last time I saw her was with a group of friends having dinner at Fridays, when she made an extremely insulting comment about how my choosing greek salad was an indication of low self esteem and other problems I 'had yet to come to grips with'. Just raising an example of the flip side to the problem.
That being said I agree with what I think is the main crux of her 'rant', that being overweight is not in and of itself as evil as certain people seem to think it is. I'll hand her the fact that she's pretty clear in who she attacks on this. The fashion industry and people who seem to have nothing better to do then to comment about other people's weight and their own anxiety. I feel this way myself, weight is not, was never, nor will ever be an interesting or engaging conversational topic unless it is being used only as part of a larger topic. For example, if you weighed 135lbs 6 months ago and are now breaking 200lb, then people are going to be interested in whatever it was that caused it. People with IQ's larger then 70 will not be interested in 5lbs gained over the holidays. </own rant>

What a bitch. I hope you punched her right in her stupid face.

OK, my IQ is over 70 and if I gain 5lbs over the holidays I think there's a lot to be interested in. lol

Usually I get over it though. ;)

I would assume you don't expect to make it the only topic of interest though.

Think I found a new rule of thumb for 'way too skinny', at least for women. If you can see ribs between the boobs, that's just gross.

Keira Knightley's been in the news for this so I'll use her as an example:
Not gross -> http://images.eonline.com/eol_images...ira.091906.jpg

Gross -> http://www.americansuperstarmag.com/...knightley1.jpg

Actually, ribs showing when your arms aren't above your head is still within the 'eat a sandwich' range.
Before she decided that her body was capable of running entirely on oxygen without the need for all that messy food she was, in my book, far and away the most attractive woman in Hollywood. Now she's a case study. :thepain:

Really, if someone's happy then who gives a shit what size they are? What's it to anyone else?

If anyone has a problem with someone else's size, they should be looking inwardly not outwardly unless they have a vested interest and concerns about the persons health.

I've got friends at both ends of the scale. One in particular has been at both ends. Sometimes we talk about it, but I know it only makes things worse for her when other people try to suggest what she should do with her body.

The point is, by confronting people about their weight, you make yourself look like an arsehole, and you make them feel like one (in most cases).

You just don't do it. About anyone. Even celebrities. Who cares?

I consider anything to do with "celebrities" to be one of the least interesting subjects (professional sports are a close contender), but there is an even less interesting subset of this very uninteresting subject: how much celebrities weigh.

The only reason I know it is a "subject" is I see it on magazine covers at the grocery store, etc. ...highlighting how out of touch I must be with what other people are fretting over. Either that or it's a conspiracy to turn us off to the media as a provider of actual information.

Obesity is a huge problem in today's society, more so as we have become more affluent and the priorities among people have shifted towards the "me" generation as well as the belief that immediate gratification is a "Right" of all people. Childhood obesity is a very big problem and sets the stage for problems later in life. Morbid obesity is another extreme altogether. Morbid obesity is an extreme example of the larger problem (no pun intended). There are well documented studies which look at the severe physiological toll that obesity will extract from your health status. These effects are often glossed over by "heavyweights" in an effort to support self-esteem issues and ego protection. The problem is that even with as much confidence they extrude, deep down inside they are bothered by and prejudiced by society for their overweight status. My 2 cents.

I saw a show on PBS where this guy, a medical doctor, who was a triathlete and biked 10 miles every day as a part of his training regimen, was officially "overweight" ...he was shortish and weighed like 250 pounds, and it wasn't muscle mass either, it was chub.

He reasoned that his ancestors must have selected for extreme calorie retention as a result of surviving through famine.

Genes play a big part. As does extercise. Most "fat" tables do not accurately reflect either your level of obesity or your health status. I know some awsome athletes that smoke. I have known people throughout my career who were rock solid muscle that were off the scales on the Military Weight Charts. I was off the scale during most of my career and few would call me overweight. But there I was getting tapped with the rest of the folks who had serious weight problems. The difference is that I ran my 2 miles in 15 minutes at 40+years old, while they couldn't finish the test.

Genes play a big part. And eating/exercising habits do too. But don't forget the strains of germs in your gut as discussed in this thread.

They apparently play a part too.

I was slender all my life up until three years ago when I had some major life changes that contributed to my gaining 70 pounds - going from 130 pounds to almost 200 (ugh!). I am now cutting back on the alcohol, starting an exercise plan and trying to become more aware of calories.

I feel that there is an unfortunate tendency among some to make an over-weight person well aware of their extra pounds. When I weighed 130, no one ever commented on my weight. Now, people seem to feel quite free to comment on my 200. ( I'm 5'6" and female, BTW.)

I guess there always will be some folks who try to make themselves feel better at someone else's expense. I consider the source and let the comments go. I KNOW I'm gonna lose the weight, and its my own concern, thank you very much! :eyebrow:

Welcome SamIam. Very nice post! :)

The problem is that even with as much confidence they extrude, deep down inside they are bothered by and prejudiced by society for their overweight status. My 2 cents.

And they feel this way because society puts so much emphasis on how much people weigh. It's a self fulfilling prophesy. ie 'I want to look good and be fit because then I'll look better and feel better (but that's because I've been brought up in a society that tells me what those standards are)'

The point is, health issues are a concern, but there are plenty of people who are very far from either over or under weight and yet they feel bad about themselves because they don't fit the mold. It's a terrible situation for our kids to be growing into. (no pun intended)

Well if they live long enough to pay into Social Security, but not long enough to collect, then it's a good thing, right?

I rarely care about other people's weight, but I've been the target of attention in situations like in my first post because of my own motivation for losing weight. I'm at a reasonable weight right now, 167 for a 6'1'' guy. No abs, but I can tuck in a shirt without sucking in my gut. However, as I move forward in my education and career I can see that I'd definitely reap benefits from losing the extra 10lbs or so. It would allow me to move to a leaner cut of suit and slim my facial profile (I have a slightly wider head then normal). Apparently this is not acceptable for some people who take it upon themselves to let me know that I am helping to perpetuate a stereotype, and that I should be ashamed of the harm I am supposedly causing.
The studies have been done, an increase in physical attractiveness has professional repercussions, and I'm not pretending that getting a leaner torso would make me a better person, just more competitive in the workplace. Why do some people find this offensive still? I have no clue.
That's really the only reason why I tend to keep an antenna out for people saying that weight loss is bad.

Because you're submitting to the stereotype you're perpetuating the cycle.

What about being recognized in your particular profession for your skill?

Isn't that what it's all about?

Edit: I just don't buy the line about getting further ahead because you look better. In the real world, that's not how it is.

For goodness sake - if you feel losing a little weight and buffing up are minor adjustments for you and fall within your comfort zone then of course you shouldn't feel you are compromising your integrity doing so. Next time a woman (and I assume it is women who do so) brings this up, suggest she attends her next interview without make-up or hair products. And then have a conversation about level playing fields and appearance-pressure.

It's trickier once you get into the realms of how people damage their own health. I know - I am morbidly obese and can't see any way out of my current cycle of self destruct apart from killing myself. No-one could engender any more disgust in my physical self than I already have. But then I'm depressed, so I'm not a fair comparison...

Believe me, I'm not worried about not being noticed for my skill. I'm entering my third year of college and I'm working in a functional neuroanatomy lab under a newly transfered Stanford prof who's one of the top in his field. I beat out 300 other students for this job and I'm damn proud of it.
I don't hold grandiose notions of what I'm trying to accomplish, just one part of continually refining myself. I'm also trying to get through a reading list that includes books that are simply good to have as part of an education. A Day in the Life of Ivan Denisovich is my current project. Just part of improving myself. It's the idea that I'm a bigot for considering healthy weight loss an improvement that gets me riled.

Fuck them... if they, and everyone else, minded their own business, there wouldn't be a stereotype problem.

My boss is very over- weight. She is very attractive still. (well I think so) When we go out to lunch together people get a disgusted look on their face when they see her. No one hides the looks or the staring. There's nothing worse than watching an ugly, old, bald, witless man give her crusty looks. Makes me want to to go kick some a_ _. What? Is society going to shame on her until she loses weight? People like that suck. And they're ugly.....

I've actually talked about that before in context. I once took the counter-stance in a debate that men would be lucky to have a men's cosmetics industry, because right now we still have to walk past Polo and Ralph Lauren ads but would need to almost be born perfect to attain anything close.

Like Bruce said, fuck those people who are overly concerned about physical stereotypes. You need to look out for yourself, so you can feel the best that you can while you're pursuing your career. Just remember to keep it rill.*

*Don't put everything on the looks and skills.

Actually no, because they amount the extract from Medicare/Medcaid in no way compensates for what they contributed.

Its cliché but I bet a lot of the negative views on being overweight is caused with problems within theirself. I have found that the people that are the most critical of others are either obsessed with their body or very insecure about them. If you are content and relaxed with yourself then you are usually very less critical of others.

It also comes from trying to purposely fit in or break stereotypes. If you try to fit in with a stereotype then you are making a statement that you care too much about your given stereotype you want in on and if you are purposely (stress purposely again) trying to break a stereotype you are making a statement that you care too much about the stereotype given to you. Neither is good in my opinion.

When you start caring about how you look, then you will naturally start to care about how others look.

So 9th, because you care how you look, then you naturally care how others look?

I don't know if I completely agree. I have many overweight and morbidly obese people who are perfectly content, on the outside. Inside? well no really knows if they are truely happy. Some people just have the ability to extrude a happiness about them that you know is the real deal, other merely put on a good front.

I know quite a few people who do analyze other people's weight as an extension of their own obsession with themselves. But it's almost always the case that these types of people don't have much to focus on other then their's and other people's physical appearance. They obsess on their attractive physique to divert attention from their flaws, and they bully others about it to keep others looking at themselves and at them. If I don't feel the urge to make people pay undue attention to me, then I don't think I'm pressuring others to pay undue attention to themselves.
I won't deny that I pay attention to how people look, but I don't think it's in the way Ali is insinuating. I've been heavy myself, and I don't make snap judgments about others in terms of weight.

Anyway....

What do you think about her comments about boycotting stores that don't carry styles above sizes 12 or 13?

I'm not insinuating anything. I'm just asking a simple question.

If it's a simple question, then yes Ali I do care how people around me present themselves. I expect people to look the part in whatever situation their in, but being heavy doesn't stop anyone doing that.

but why do you care? Why does it matter?

Why do I care how I look or why do I care how others look?

others

Part of being a professional is presenting yourself in a manner that reflects your position. There are certain cut-off lines for acceptable appearance depending on the situation. And I feel like we're missing each other on some critical thing here, because I'm sure you're not saying that I should think nothing of someone from my department showing up to a progress meeting in a sweat suit. Or for that matter if they just decided they weren't going to wash their hair or clothes anymore.

Well I guess on some levels that's true 9th. I just don't subscribe to those standards that's all. I know people who are in very 'professional' positions who don't either. I commend them for being able to get past all that power dressing bullshit and just do their job.

Well...depending on the job, once you have it, you can probably dress anyway you like, if that particular environment allows it. But when you're trying to break in, you gotta put forth your best appearance.

I think we misunderstood each other. I was saying that people who care too much about their appearance will criticize others. If someone is comfortable with their appearance, they will become more accepting and happier with themselves..

There is a limit, when people expect to get two airline chairs or theatre chairs for the price of one, we now have an issue.

I feel she is not only saying "don't bother" I feel she is, at the very least, being highly disingenuous when she implies that being skinny requires "two thin parents and four thin grandparents" or that one's quality of life does not suffer from being overweight. Both of these ideas are absolutely false and are hardly good ideas to convey to people in today's culture of inactivity and fast food. While she is correct that the overweight should maintain high self esteem and not let the opinions of others prevent them from being happy, it is absolutely wrong to extend that to suggest that people should automatically consider their condition genetic and that there is nothing they can do or should do.

She also rants that being overweight does not mean one is ugly, selfish, or lazy, but I'll only agree with the first two ideas -- being overweight almost certainly, barring any exotic medical conditions, stems from inactivity coupled with poor diet.

I'm sure Joy would hate to hear that being morbidly obese reflects just as much on one's character as smoking two packs a day or being an alcoholic. All are chemical addictions, all are preventable, and all can be treated. We come in all sizes and no one should be discriminated against, but generating false excuses for an unhealthy lifestyle runs contrary to common sense.

No. It stems from a lack of the right kind of activity, coupled with poor diet. To suggest that someone who is overweight is necessarily lazy or physically inactive is an oversimplification of an often quite complex situation. You can spend most of your day on the go, but if it isn't the kind of exercise that increases your heart rate it's unlikely to burn off many calories. A lot of people who are overweight are very, very busy people. And a lot of skinny people are idle bastards, who do all the wrong things, eat all the wrong foods, drink too much and smoke too many cigarettes.

This kind of nonsense really puts me in a bad mood. What the fuck gives us all the right to moralise, come to conclusions about the lifestyle choices and make judgement calls on the characters of people we meet based on their fucking weight?

If all the other human frailties and habits produced visible results so quickly, we would all be so harshly judged.

Greek salad is good and if I eat a whole one I am full... I'm a really big guy. That is a stupid statement on it's face. I would have said so, in those words, and laughed if I felt like it. "What a stupid thing to say, hahaha! Greek salad fills me up and it tastes good."
I am also uninterested in worrying about embarrassing people or not, I would have called them on it, very politely, continued to labor the point logically, unemotionally, until they conceded.
I am overweight because"
First, I eat the wrong things
Second, My genetics (perhaps interchangeable with the first, but this is a very LARGE part of it)

I, and this is the truth, eat very little... but when I do I tend to eat the wrong things. If I ate more often and the correct things I would lose weight. But, due to being in so much pain, I have very little appetite. Also due to that, I tend to eat what is convenient, the wrong things.
If I did not, I would be thinner. Not thin, due to my genetics, I will never be that.
I do think that people who are VERY thin are obsessive and freaky, because those I have met who are VERY thin are obsessive and freaky.
But, not people who are built to be that way, genetics again, you can tell, they don't look unhealthy and they EAT.

in the words of Foamy the Squirrel...well.. just watch it.. yeah I know all the 'hot topic' trendy kids are on the bandwagon now... but.. it's still funny

http://scarysquirrel.home.comcast.net/fatkins1.html

People's weight varies for many reasons.

Some people eat the wrong things and therefore weigh more or less than the average.
Some people have metabolisms that work differently and therefore weigh more or less than the average.
Some people are unable to find the time to look after themselves properly and therefore weigh more or less than the average.
Some people conform to different cultural expectations and therefore weigh more or less than the average.
Some people reject the norms of society in preference to their own personal happiness and therefore weigh more or less than the average.

People who eat a healthy diet and get enough exercise may still be overweight because they have inherited an efficient, thrifty metabolism. For such people it is as wrong to vilify them as it is to vilify someone on the basis of race or gender: people cannot change the genes they inherit.

Other people may be overweight because their lifestyle may make it difficult for them to find the time to be more healthy. They may lack the time to eat healthy food or to take exercise. For such people, society as a whole has failed them. A society that finds it acceptable for people to work more than 12 hours a day andor work six or seven days a week should not be surprised if this causes some people to lack the time to look after themselves properly.

Some people may come from a different culture with different views on body weight. It is difficult to undo the effects of upbringing in the same way it is difficult for someone raised in a lipophobic culture to adjust to the norms of another culture with a more accepting view of overweight people.

Some people are overweight because they choose to be. Such people have a different view of the world or themselves to the norms dictated by society. They have made their own decision and are well aware of the risks. Many smokers smoke for the same reason.

We should remember that the current "thin is healthy" view of modern society is overly simplistic. Medical evidence shows that under some circumstances being moderately overweight is healthier than being too thin. Thin women are more prone to osteoporosis in later life. Chubby people have a better prognosis after some medical treatments than thin people. So being a bit overweight is not particularly harmful as long as the overall diet is healthy and some exercise is taken. However, regardless of one's weight, it is always wise to keep an eye on one's health by having the appropriate medical checks done regularly.

Some people eat to much.

Not all such people get fat. Many teenagers have hollow legs.

And there are people who eat like birds and still gain weight.

It is not just food intake that determines weight. It is food intake and metabolism.

A lot of it is also what you eat....unless that is what you meant by food intake.

Insurance companies might soon have a different view. Regardless, I'm fairly certain that most of the nearly one quarter of Americans who suffer from obesity and the full 50% of the population who are categorized as overweight didn't get to where they are due to a "genetics issue".

I'm not certain that society has failed anyone that consciously chooses to drink so much soda or eat every last bite of the huge portions that are offered on most menus. At the least I'd say that people are ill informed about what they eat, but I'd say most of the blame isn't on anyone else other than the person making their diet selections. I weighed 180 at my heaviest, but I've been at 160 for years thanks to the basic understanding that sitting in an office chair for ten hours a day means I probably shouldn't be eating that huge "recommended breakfast" that ends every cereal commercial and it isn't really a good idea to follow my co-workers when they have lunch at Olive Garden twice a week. Anyone that lives a sedentary life thanks to their job should have the brain to know their diet should be low calorie until they can get out and do something.

I do note that the poor are more likely to be overweight/obese and that while most will joke that obesity is a disease of the wealthy it really is the cheap food that contains so many calories and causes so much weight gain. Eating healthy, these days, is actually very costly. I think that the majority of the people can afford it, however.

That is overall... lifetime. Now, my meds/hormone issues and inabilty to exercise have a LOT to do with my weight.

hey kingswood.. off topic a bit but... since you seem to be comfy with latin.. what's a rough translation of ' don't let the bastards get you down'? looked it up online, and all my books are back in kansas.. so help a brother out :)

Your butt is wide, well mine is too
Just watch your mouth or I'll sit on you
The word is out, better treat me right
'Cause I'm the king of cellulite
Ham on, ham on, ham on whole wheat, all right

My zippers bust, my buckles break
I'm too much man for you to take
The pavement cracks when I fall down
I've got more chins than chinatown

Well, I've never used a phone booth
And I've never seen my toes
When I'm goin' to the movies
I take up seven rows

Because I'm fat, I'm fat, come on <-- this is supposed to be "sha mone"
(fat, fat, really really fat)
You know I'm fat, I'm fat, you know it
(fat, fat, really really fat)
You know I'm fat, I'm fat, come on you know
(fat, fat, really really fat)
Don'tcha call me pudgy, portly or stout
Just now tell me once again who’s fat ahhhhhh!ahhhh!

When I walk out to get my mail
It measures on the Richter scale
Down at the beach I'm a lucky man
I'm the only one who gets a tan
If I have one more pie ala mode
I'm gonna need my own ZIP code

When you're only having seconds
I'm having twenty-thirds
When I go to get my shoes shined
I gotta take their word

Because I'm fat, I'm fat, sha mone
(fat, fat, really really fat)
You know I'm fat, I'm fat, you know it
(fat, fat, really really fat)
You know I'm fat, I'm fat, you know it you know
(fat, fat, really really fat)
And my shadow weighs forty-two pounds
Lemme tell you once again who's fat

If you see me comin' your way
Better give me plenty space
If I tell you that I'm hungry
Then won't you feed my face

Because I'm fat, I'm fat, come on
(fat, fat, really really fat)
You know I'm fat, I'm fat, you know it
(fat, fat, really really fat)
You know I'm fat, I'm fat, you know it, you know
(fat, fat, really really fat)
Woo woo woo
(when I sit around the house
I really sit around the house)

You know I'm fat, I'm fat, come on
(fat, fat, really really fat)
You know I'm fat, I'm fat, you know it, you know it
(fat, fat, really really fat)
You know, you know, you know, come on
(fat, fat, really really fat)
And you know all by myself I’m a crowd
Lemme tell you once again

You know I'm huge, I'm fat, you know it
(fat, fat, really really fat)
You know I'm fat, you know, hoo
(fat, fat, really really fat)
You know I'm fat, I'm fat, you know it, you know
(fat, fat, really really fat)
And the whole world knows I'm fat and I'm proud
Just tell me once again who’s fat

I heard a humorous pseudo-Latin phrase that is something like: Illegitimi non carborundum.

(I'm not so good with Latin yet but I have a Latin dictionary with useful phrases and some good bookmarks in my web browser.)

Imagine the outcry if insurance companies refused to cover light-skinned people for skin cancer.

You were also quoting me out of context. You deleted the first sentence of the paragraph:
If everyone ate a healthy diet in moderation and got enough exercise, there would still be fat people. Some people have very efficient metabolisms, and others have inherited appetites that make it difficult to avoid gaining weight.

However, it seems you have completely missed the point that I was making. The difference between dark skin and light skin is about seven genes. A similar number of genes may be the difference between someone with a moderate appetite who can maintain a healthy weight easily, and someone who eats like a sparrow and still gains weight or someone whose appetite becomes ferocious if they lose five kilograms. Such people are only the unlucky recipients of a bad deal from the genetic deck, yet such people are often discriminated against to a degree that is not dissimilar to Apartheid-era South Africa or the Southern USA during the slavery era.

I didn't buy this at first, but I browsed around and found some interesting articles that detail how complex the issues is, including this one about stress.

That is some odd stuff. Point taken.

Yes, but the difference is you would basically only be left with the reasonably healthy overweight people, who would not have the same risk for heart disease and other problems. It's the diseases the insurance companies don't want to cover, not the larger sizes of their clothing.

Interesting. This was front page news today in the Washington Post because of the results of a new study.


The Abstract from Nature Medicine.

We look at those people who have very efficient metabolisms - 40 years ago. What is now considered normal was, back then, considered clearly obese. By today’s standards, there were literally no fat people back then. My grandfather was considered fat. Today about one in three adults are that fat.

Did genetics suddenly change in 40 years? What Kingswood posts can only be credible if people were also that obese 45 years ago. Back then we also were hauled to school in cars, trains, and buses. Nobody walked great distances. Why was fat so rare back then? Or has mankind's genetics changes in only 45 years?

I routinely look in other's shopping carts. I could not eat anything in the carts of the obese. We did not drink soda when I was a kid. It was a rare treat. Today, it replaces milk.

Like Kitsume, my waist is one inch larger than what it was in college. Two inches larger than in high school. I still eat in many ways the same as I did in wrestling. In part because I can measure a drop in intelligence when my diet slips. Yes, even daily intelligence changes with diet. And again, I am appalled at what I see in so many shopping carts. I would be dumb - probably have migraines - if I ate that junk.

Do you have migraines? What do you eat?

When it comes to a thrifty metabolism, that is me. Often I may only eat one major meal every other day. But then one does not get hungry when one avoids diet foods and that junk so common in obese people shopping carts. One gets hungry because the body did not get nutrition. Once you eat a cookie, you must eat half the bag - the body keeps demanding some nutrition in the form of hunger.

For youngsters who would become wrestlers - that is how one loses weight, is not always hungry, and wins matches. By eating right, a wrestler with only two years training had to win by outputting more energy. That meant nutrition – and no dieting. Learn that what you eat today affects even your intelligence tomorrow.

Kitsume has accurately defined the only thing that changed. Look at the crap in so many shopping carts - and that includes diet soda that will also contribute to weight gain.

An example: eat one carrot. Is it nutritious? Yes. It provides today's necessary vitamin A. Eat a second carrot. Is it nutritious? Of course not. More vitamin A is not required. Carrot also is higher in sugar. We already have too much sugar. That second carrot is junk food.

People brainwashed by nutrition taught in TV commercials would never learn that. I learned it from wrestling. My wrestling was only as good as my diet. That meant eliminating junk foods so as to lose 20% of my body weight - and eating nutritious foods so as to not be hungry.

What was necessary to lose weight and maintain my wrestling ability? Breakfast.

When the season ended, I put back 20% in two weeks. How? I continued to eat mostly as I did in wrestling. But, for example, I ate two hot meals for lunch. No junk food. No pizza, etc. We never had potato chips or candy machines in school. That 20% came back mostly as muscle. Again, it is not genetics as TV myth promoters would claim. It is not miracle diet foods. Exercising the abs does not flatten the stomach. All that is myth. People are obese mostly because of what they eat today. Then they jump for myths such as genetics - as if genetics has changed. If an obese person drinks a soda - diet or regular - then he is only fooling himself when blaming genetics. Obesity is directly traceable to the person himself - his destructive attitude.

Apple juice 45 years ago contained juice from apples. Today it is total corn syrup - complete sugar with no nutritional value. Genetics had nothing to do with that either.

Why put corn syrup in apple juice? US government subsidizes sugars. About one half the cost of sugar is paid for my government 'corporate welfare'. Nobody could sell apple juice make with nutrition. It costs more.

Fundamental difference between products from Kellogg’s and General Mills. The former has a long history of pushing low nutrition foods and hyping them as healthy. Nutribars? Total junk food. If you did not know that, then how are you staying at a healthy weight?

Insightful post, tw.

At what point did our community become oversaturated with junk food made of HFCS and fat? I have been thinking about this, lately and trying to determine where, when and how that shift took place. Does anyone have some insight on this?

I sure as hell wasn't skinny in college thanks to my diet. I'm still trying to get back in shape -- my food intake and weight may be somewhat normal, but I have a long way to go to make my bmi a healthy one.

Speaking of clothing sizes, I found it funny that the "fat rant" woman complained that she can never find her size at the major chain stores. It must be different for women, because I've experienced much the opposite: it is damn near impossible to find blue jeans with a waist smaller than 36 inches. 34? Good luck. 32? Ha! I have to go from store to store to find anything in my size because no one keeps the slimmer stuff in stock, anymore. You'll find piles of 38, 40, and higher rotating in stock on a daily basis, but there isn't as much demand for reasonable sizes, anymore, so they rarely get them in. And what is measured as a "32in waistline" isn't really 32 inches, either, since everything is "baggy", "comfort fit", and "loose fit". I've found I have to step down anywhere from 2" to 3" on the listed tag size to get it right.

My wife and I were just talking about that. I was complaining that I had to return a bunch of "large" polo shirts to Eddie Bauer because they were way too big. I've always worn a large. The medium fits me now. I haven't shrunk. I'm the same.

She says it's the fashions that are to blame. I used to wear my clothes baggier, and now the style is a tighter fit. So I always wore a large to get that baggier effect. Now I want a shirt that fits so I should get a medium. I don't know if she's right. Maybe I should dig through some old clothes in the attic and see if clothes have grown or if my perception has changed.

It's there, you just have to look for it.