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Pangloss62 06-27-2006 07:55 AM

Videophilia
 
As an employee of the National Park Service, I have noticed this trend. Perhaps it includes cellar-dwellers as well.


Americans prefer video to national parks: study
Tue Jun 20, 2006 11:38pm ET
By Jon Hurdle


PHILADELPHIA (Reuters) - Americans are less interested in spending time in natural surroundings like national parks because they are spending more time watching television, playing video games and surfing the Internet, according to a study released on Tuesday.

The study, for The Nature Conservancy, found per-capita visits to national parks have been declining for years.

National park visitation data starting in 1930 peaked in 1987 at 1.2 visits per person per year. But by 2003 it had declined by about 25 percent to 0.9 visits per person per year, said Oliver Pergams, an ecologist at the University of Illinois who analyzed the data for the study.

The data, based on government statistics and other sources, were taken as a proxy for interest in nature in general.

Researchers tested more than two dozen possible explanations for the trend and found that 98 percent of the drop in national park visits was explained by video games, movie rentals, going out to movies, Internet use and rising fuel prices.

Other possible explanations such as family income or the aging population were ruled out.

There was a sufficiently high correlation between declining national park visits and the burgeoning use of electronic media that led Pergams and his associate, Patricia Zaradic, believe the two are linked. "It made us feel fairly certain that there is an association," Pergams told Reuters.

The study, to be published in the Journal of Environmental Management, concludes that the trend has negative implications for environmental stewardship.

"We may be seeing evidence of a fundamental shift away from people's appreciation of nature to 'videophilia' which we here define as the new human tendency to focus on sedentary activities involving electronic media," the researchers said.

"Such a shift would not bode well for the future of biodiversity conservation."

Nature Conservancy President Steve McCormick said the study suggests Americans and their children in particular are losing their connection to the natural world.

"When children choose TVs over trees, they lose touch with the physical world outside and the fundamental connection of those places to our daily lives," McCormick said.

Griff 06-27-2006 08:04 AM

It makes sense, but does the Park Service really want more visitors?

Trilby 06-27-2006 08:10 AM

Rollo May said: "As human beings we have our roots in nature, not simply because of the fact that the chemistry of our bodies is of essentially the same elements as the air or dirt or grass...but in the rhythm of the change of seasons or of night and day...It takes a strong self-that is, a strong sense of personal identity-to relate fully to nature without being swallowed up."

Maybe it's fear.

Pangloss62 06-27-2006 08:12 AM

That's a good point, Griff. I thought the same thing. Less people, better experience for those that visit, and it's likely that those people actually want to be there. Though anti-park politicos use statistics like those mentioned in that article to slash funding or to argue for privitazation.

glatt 06-27-2006 08:45 AM

We limit the amount of TV the kids can watch. They watch much much less than others their age. We take them to local parks and nature centers.

They haven't been to any actual National Parks in their lives, but that's just because we live in the East, and there aren't too many National Parks around here. Plenty of state parks, county parks, national recreation areas and monuments, etc. But getting to the National Parks is a real task.

When I was a kid, my dad was a professor, with summers off. We travelled the US and went to most of the national parks. I loved it, and would love it if my kids could see all of them too, but I don't know when I could ever take a summer off to do that. I'd have to quit my job or something.

Kitsune 06-27-2006 09:11 AM

That's very sad -- I've been more inclined to go outdoors more often than sit inside and lose myself in video games/movies/internet.

Even worse than the decline in visitors is that the people that do venture out into the National Parks these days don't prefer to do it on foot, but rather under the power of a noisy two-stroke and wheels that destroy the land.

rkzenrage 06-27-2006 10:14 AM

When Death Valley became a National Park it ruined it.

bbro 06-27-2006 10:20 AM

ok, I am going to ask an elementary question here - what is the difference between a national park and regular park?

When I was growing up, we went to the local park a lot. Besides the fact that we weren't allowed to be inside all day long. My mother would always tell us to go outside and play. We would come in for lunch (maybe) and when the streetlights were on. I remeber being so excited to go outside that I was disappointed I wasn't allowed to go to my neighbor's house at 9 in the morning. (Incidently, they weren't out of bed and showered until about noon)

Pangloss62 06-27-2006 10:22 AM

Some Virginia National Parks
 
Appomattox Court House National Historical Park
Blue Ridge Parkway
Blue Ridge Parkway
Booker T. Washington National Monument
Colonial National Historical Park
Cumberland Gap National Historical Park
Fredericksburg and Spotsylvania National Military Park
George Washington Memorial Parkway
Harpers Ferry National Historical Park
Manassas National Battlefield Park
Maggie L. Walker National Historic Site
Petersburg National Battlefield
Prince William Forest Park
Richmond National Battlefield Park
Shenandoah National Park

Undertoad 06-27-2006 10:27 AM

If I want to walk in the park, I have a choice of Valley Forge N.P... or my local trail system, which is really cool and has expanded across the entire county.

Valley Forge was there all along, the local thing is only a few years old.

So if I'm any example, mandates to preserve open space have brought on this downturn in national park visitation.

Pangloss62 06-27-2006 10:29 AM

People always conflate local, county, state, national, Forest Service, parks.

http://www.cr.nps.gov/history/hisnps...y/npshisto.htm

Hey rage; why you think NPS ruined Death Valley?

bbro 06-27-2006 10:35 AM

Was that link for me? I got an error when I opened it.

glatt 06-27-2006 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pangloss62
Appomattox Court House National Historical Park
Blue Ridge Parkway
Blue Ridge Parkway
Booker T. Washington National Monument
Colonial National Historical Park
Cumberland Gap National Historical Park
Fredericksburg and Spotsylvania National Military Park
George Washington Memorial Parkway
Harpers Ferry National Historical Park
Manassas National Battlefield Park
Maggie L. Walker National Historic Site
Petersburg National Battlefield
Prince William Forest Park
Richmond National Battlefield Park
Shenandoah National Park

I've been to many of those places. So have my kids. And I don't mean to be a nitpicker, but only one of them is a National Park, and that one is rather unimpressive compared to the dozens of western national parks I've visited.

I'm not trying to pick a fight with you. I like and support the national parks. But the East doesn't have anything even close to resembling what the West has in terms of size and wilderness and remarkable landscape.

In the East, many of my favorite places to hike are national forests or are owned by lumber companies, etc.

Pangloss62 06-27-2006 10:38 AM

Sorry bro. Try this one.


[url]http://www.cr.nps.gov/history

rkzenrage 06-27-2006 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pangloss62
People always conflate local, county, state, national, Forest Service, parks.

http://www.cr.nps.gov/history/hisnps...y/npshisto.htm

Hey rage; why you think NPS ruined Death Valley?

When visiting it before, the trash was picked-up, the rangers were friendly, there was a steady but manageable flow of people through the park, few people broke the rules (going off-trail, etc) and the people were those who were out-door regulars who respected the park, wildlife and surroundings.

After the park went National, every single thing I mentioned above changed 100%.

Pangloss62 06-27-2006 10:45 AM

Nitpick away. But ALL of those are National Parks. People have a tendency to think of National Parks as ONLY ones like Yellowstone or Grand Canyon. They don't consider "cultural resource" parks like National Battlefieds or cemeteries as National Parks, but they are. The Appalachian Trail is managed by the NPS, and Everglades, Great Smoky, Cape Cod National Seashore, Cape Hatteras National Seashore, Big Cypress, Barataria Preserve...there are lots of nice Eastern National Park. But I know what you mean; there really is no comparison on With the great Western parks. Nonetheless, I could take you to a place in Big South Fork in on the TN/KY border that would blow your mind in terms of natural beauty.

rkzenrage 06-27-2006 10:48 AM

Saying that the West's type of beauty is "better" always prejudices me against the speaker. Can't help it, always thought of it as an ignorant statement.
Preferring it is one thing, but that absolute statement comes out of more mouths than I can count... it is constant.

Pangloss62 06-27-2006 10:55 AM

Going National
 
I don't know how old you are, but Death Valley "went National" in 1933. I suppose you've noted cultural/behavioral change over time. I would hope the rangers are still nice. Our new Secretery of The Interior is more to our liking than Gale Norton.

glatt 06-27-2006 10:57 AM

Have you been out West to the various parks out there?

Pangloss62 06-27-2006 11:27 AM

Best of the West
 
I would agree, rage. That's why I said "there's no comparison," meaning it's like apples and oranges, not that the parks of the west are "better." I'm more of an old-rock kinda guy, that's why I personally like the folds and smooth hills of the Appalachians. Mt. Katadin, in ME, is probably my favorite, and the glacial lakes of Quebec make for a sublime landscape.

I've only been to Muir Woods and Point Reyes as far as "Western" parks are concerned.

xoxoxoBruce 06-27-2006 06:24 PM

Quote:

National park visitation data starting in 1930 peaked in 1987 at 1.2 visits per person per year. But by 2003 it had declined by about 25 percent to 0.9 visits per person per year, said Oliver Pergams, an ecologist at the University of Illinois who analyzed the data for the study.
The per person visits are down but what about attendance? It seems anytime I get near a national Park, in the last few years, it's thronged with people.

Personally, a park like a Civil or Revolutionary War battlefield isn't somewhere I'd go to commune with nature. They're for learning and putting into perspective the history that happened there. They usually don't require repeat visits to do that.

I've been to all the major and a majority of the minor National Parks, except Hawaii. Favorite is probably Glacier, with Yellowstone, Grand Canyon and Yosemite tied for second. Climbing Mt. Katadin, air boating through the everglades, watching the bears in Denali, and feeling the ghosts at Alcatraz were fun but the isn't the boggle the mind experience of the top 4 on my list.
This is all a strictly personal thing, different strokes for different folks.:D

glatt 06-28-2006 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce
TI've been to all the major and a majority of the minor National Parks, except Hawaii.

On our honeymoon to Hawaii, my wife and I knew we were going to visit Volcano National Park (or whatever it's called) so we packed our Golden Eagle Pass for the trip. As we approached the park gate, we were one of a long line of white rental cars. Pulling up to the booth, I handed the attendant my Golden Eagle Pass. He still asked me for the entrance fee. I had to tell him that it was a Golden Eagle Pass and that it covered my admittance. He looked really confused. I think he had never seen one in all his time there and was used to simply requesting $5 (or whatever the fee was) from each rental car.

Pangloss62 06-28-2006 09:07 AM

Quote:

Personally, a park like a Civil or Revolutionary War battlefield isn't somewhere I'd go to commune with nature.
I can understand that, but after about 10 years working for the NPS, I've come to really appreciate those military parks. Those were originally managed by the War Department, but were absorbed into the NPS in 1933. Today they are located in the midst of American sprawl, and exist as little utopias within the more disorganized urban landscape. Orderly and well-layed-out, they are nice places to walk, think (not just about history), and enjoy the outdoors. They are quiet, peaceful places, designed landscapes that please the eye. And many of the monuments and sculpture represent a unique period of public art in American history.

http://www.wildfreshness.com/brian/archives/Penn2.jpg

Any land that is not given over to unplanned commercialism is OK with me.

wolf 06-28-2006 10:29 AM

Most commercialism is actually very carefully planned.

rkzenrage 06-28-2006 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pangloss62
I would agree, rage. That's why I said "there's no comparison," meaning it's like apples and oranges, not that the parks of the west are "better." I'm more of an old-rock kinda guy, that's why I personally like the folds and smooth hills of the Appalachians. Mt. Katadin, in ME, is probably my favorite, and the glacial lakes of Quebec make for a sublime landscape.

I've only been to Muir Woods and Point Reyes as far as "Western" parks are concerned.

I love all the parks I have been to... just don't see how one can compare Death Valley or Sequoia to the Everglades or Ocala, just silly to even consider it.

Kitsune 06-28-2006 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rkzenrage
I love all the parks I have been to... just don't see how one can compare Death Valley or Sequoia to the Everglades or Ocala, just silly to even consider it.

What, exactly, does one do in the everglades? I've been really tempted to haul the kayak down there and do some exploring, but I want to know what camping in the winter months is like or if it is even recommended.

Ocala, from my short trips into the depths of the park, is wonderful. Juniper Wilderness is nothing but pure quiet.

glatt 06-28-2006 01:57 PM

Looking back over this thread, two people have mentioned Mt. Kahtadin in ME. I think it's kind of telling, because Mt. Kahtadin isn't a National Park. It's a State Park. The National Parks are great, but there are so many levels of parks in this country. Counting private property that's open to the public, there are even more places to go.

One of my favorite places to hike is Mt. Tumbledown in ME. It's a short day hike. Takes 3-4 hours to get to the top. Once you are there, you have a spectacular view, a mountain lake to swim in, and all the wild blueberries you can eat. And it's owned by a lumber company. If it was a National Park, there would probably be a parking lot on the summit, like Cadillac Mt. in Acadia National Park.

rkzenrage 06-28-2006 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kitsune
What, exactly, does one do in the everglades? I've been really tempted to haul the kayak down there and do some exploring, but I want to know what camping in the winter months is like or if it is even recommended.

Ocala, from my short trips into the depths of the park, is wonderful. Juniper Wilderness is nothing but pure quiet.

There is a lot to do... some cool kayak trails that I used to do in a canoe, the sleep spots are on platforms. Too cool. If you are squeamish about mosquitoes and bugs definitely do it in the winter. I would call the park office for tours, trails and maps, they are very helpful. Make sure they know you are there and where you are. While I was down there, every time, they always wanted to know because I was a first responder and how long I had been in Scouting... some of the most amazing trips and times of my life spent down there. I hope you go.
Ocala, as subtle as they are, there are many biomes there and could not be explored in a lifetime. So beautiful and some of the most fragrant places in the US. Lived there for seven years.

Undertoad 06-28-2006 02:19 PM

Pan, I have an issue with signage at this location:

http://cellar.org/2006/vfflooding.jpg

http://cellar.org/2006/vfflooding2.jpg

They put the damn boating signs in the middle of the river!

http://cellar.org/2006/vfflooding3.jpg

rkzenrage 06-28-2006 02:22 PM

It looks as if that may not have been the case at the time the sign was put there. Unless you were making a joke.

Undertoad 06-28-2006 02:29 PM

That is the Schuylkill River at three feet above flood stage and rising.

glatt 06-28-2006 02:39 PM

Our unfinished basement has flooded each of the last three days. Not too bad, just a few inches. Today might be our lucky day. The sun was actually shining.

Undertoad 06-28-2006 02:49 PM

(moved my flooding images to Quality Images where they should be, sorry for the threadjack)

Happy Monkey 06-28-2006 02:54 PM

A friend and I watched "An Inconvenient Truth" Sunday night in Shirlington, VA. 395N was underwater at the Shirlington exit, and full of stalled cars in all lanes. It was sort of surreal looking. We took some back roads, and saw a cab driver on the side of the road, scooping water out of his cab. Luckily, we found our way to another 395N exit, and it was mostly clear the rest of the way.

glatt 06-28-2006 03:02 PM

Shirlington is pretty low-lying. I've been amazed at the seeming randomness of the flooding. The Potomac hasn't really flooded, but many creeks have. I guess the rain has been really heavy in localized areas. Or maybe it just wasn't raining up in the mountains enough to make the big river swell.

I've known for a while that my gutters need attention, but the last few days have really driven that point home.

glatt 06-28-2006 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Happy Monkey
A friend and I watched "An Inconvenient Truth" Sunday night in Shirlington, VA. 395N was underwater at the Shirlington exit, and full of stalled cars in all lanes.

The obvious question is did you draw any conclusions after just having seen that movie, and then encountering record breaking rainfall in DC?

Pangloss62 06-28-2006 03:09 PM

Record rain in the East. Katrina did a number on our Gulf Coast and New Orleans parks.


http://www.wildfreshness.com/brian/a.../sharknice.jpg
This is in the Everglades

Happy Monkey 06-28-2006 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glatt
The obvious question is did you draw any conclusions after just having seen that movie, and then encountering record breaking rainfall in DC?

The subject did come up in conversation...

xoxoxoBruce 06-28-2006 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glatt
Looking back over this thread, two people have mentioned Mt. Kahtadin in ME. I think it's kind of telling, because Mt. Kahtadin isn't a National Park. It's a State Park.

Because it's the terminus of the Appalachian Trail which is managed by the NPS. ;)

glatt 06-29-2006 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce
Because it's the terminus of the Appalachian Trail which is managed by the NPS. ;)

I got ya.

There's a lot of blurring of what is a National Park and what isn't. Lots of things that aren't National Parks are administered by the NPS. The urban park across the street from my last office building was administered by the NPS. The guys who emptied the trash cans and mowed the lawn wore NPS uniforms. But I wouldn't call that urine soaked, pigeon infested urban park a national park. To me, a park isn't a National Park unless it has "National Park" as part of its name.

Pangloss62 06-29-2006 08:20 AM

National This, National That
 
National Scenic Riverways
National Seashores
National Scenic Trails
National River And Recreation Areas
National Military Parks
National Historical Parks
Ecological Preserves
National Monuments
National Memorials
National Preservation Areas
National Historic Sites

All administered by by the NPS.

And there are probably other types I don't know about.:neutral:

Kitsune 06-29-2006 08:37 AM

I heart the NPS. Some years ago while exploring the North Georgia Mountains, I stumbled across a very tiny spot of land under NPS management. The trail was barely noticeable off the side of the road, but once you hiked into the woods for several minutes, you came across this sight.

And, unlike the majority of other waterfalls in the area, you could actually get close enough to cool off in the water. One of the great beauties of the NPS is that you're free to explore most areas without handrails or walkways, meaning that you can really enjoy the area as long as you are careful and respectful. (Hey -- you're also free to die doing incredibly stupid things, too! Nothing prevents you from taking a tumble off the edge.)

Pangloss62 06-29-2006 09:18 AM

Oops, I Slipped
 
You got that right, Kit. Perhaps the most notable cliff incident is when a base jumper, protesting our new rule to prohibit base jumping in our parks, jumped off El Capitan in Yosemite (to her death). So much for that argument.

This Summer is looking to be notable for NPS death::neutral:


On the morning of Thursday, June 22nd, 43-year-old Juanita Richardson of McBain, Michigan, fell from a cliff above Lake Superior about a half mile southwest of Miners Castle. Richardson was picnicking along the cliffs with her husband when the incident occurred. He ran to the visitor information center at Miners Castle to report the incident to park staff. Personnel from the park, the Alger County Sheriff's Department, the Michigan State Police, and the Michigan Department of Natural Resources extricated Richardson from a rock ledge near Lake Superior. She was transported by Alger County Ambulance to Munising Memorial Hospital, where she was pronounced dead on arrival. The investigation is continuing.

A visitor from Michigan slipped and fell to her death north of the Tower Fall area around 10 a.m. on Saturday morning. The 52-year-old woman, her husband, and their two children had stopped at an overlook along the road about three-quarters of a mile north of the Tower Fall area. The woman stepped over a small rock retaining wall to take a photo, lost her footing, slipped down an embankment, then went over a cliff. She fell about 500 feet, coming to rest near the Yellowstone River. The woman’s husband flagged down a passing motorist, who called 911 for help. Responding rangers could see the woman through a spotting scope lying immobile on the canyon floor. High, fast-moving water prevented rescuers from reaching the woman by raft, so a ranger rappelled down the canyon wall to reach the woman. She was declared dead at the scene. Her body was then placed in a litter suspended by cable from a helicopter and flown out of the area on Saturday afternoon.

On the afternoon of June 8th, rangers and members of the Mesa County technical rescue team recovered a body near a wrecked vehicle approximately 200 feet below Rim Rock Drive in Red Canyon. The suicide most likely occurred on May 18th. On that day, rangers received notice that a 49-year-old Grand Junction man was threatening to drive off a cliff near Cold Shivers Point. An immediate search was conducted in the Cold Shivers Point area and along Rim Rock Drive, but rangers found no signs of a vehicle going over the edge. On the morning of June 8th, a park volunteer was picking up litter near Rim Rock Drive when he noticed a white vehicle in Red Canyon. Rangers, Mesa County Sheriff’s Office deputies, and the Colorado State Patrol officers are investigating.

Kitsune 06-29-2006 11:00 AM

Red Rock Canyon, just outside Las Vegas, was astounding in terms of how easy it was to take a fall and meet your death. Living in the southeast for so long, I've become accustomed to gauging distance through visual cues that are assisted through humidity: for me, it's easy to see something is far away by how faded it appears and how obscured it is by the heavy air. In the desert, however, that doesn't exist, so stepping off a trail along the canyon wall seemed like it would be a nasty fall to the next ledge below, but probably not a big one.

...until I squinted and saw dots.
Tiny, tiny dots.
Dots that were trees.
Huge trees.
Down there. Waaay down there.

No fence, no rail, no safety guides to prevent anyone from taking one step down, down, down. NPS won't yell at you for taking risks on the trails, won't put up barriers preventing people from climbing loose rock walls or plunging down a waterfall. In our age of warning labels declaring hot coffee and lawsuits over people attempting stupid stunts they see on TV, I find it amazing that places like this still exist. It's also comforting, in a way, that I can trek out into the wilderness and enjoy it the way it really is. People that abuse the areas and do stupid things get what is coming to them.

barefoot serpent 06-29-2006 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pangloss62
I don't know how old you are, but Death Valley "went National" in 1933. I suppose you've noted cultural/behavioral change over time. I would hope the rangers are still nice. Our new Secretery of The Interior is more to our liking than Gale Norton.

Death Valley was originally a National Monument and not a National Park. As a NM it was still open to mining -- both corporate and individual prospecting. And to livestock. As a NP (~1990) it is now offlimits to mining but also offlimits to 'open' camping. I used to go there alot and camp -- zero impact camping (no fires, no offroading) -- off any established road. You can't do that any more. You must camp in established, parkinglot campgrounds (ugh).

But, on the other hand, it is now more protected from the 'maximum' impact offroading types. So, fo me it's a mixed blessing.

Pangloss62 06-29-2006 11:36 AM

Now With Borax!!
 
Good point, serpent. Whether Monument or Park, so many things have changed in terms of what you can and cannot do. They used to make a fire waterfall at Yosemite; after the ranger did his spiel at the fire ring on top of the cliff, he would dump all the coals over the edge, creating a cool pyro effect. In Mammoth cave in KY, they would go into this big "room," turn off the lights, and then the ranger would throw a flaming oilly rag thing through the air. They even had lunch service in a special cave room. That was before radon was a concern.:neutral:


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