I didn't mean to suggest otherwise.

I don't think that's what Sundae was saying at all.

That would be because I was responding to Monster! Perhaps I should use the quote thingy.

Ahh. My mistake.

The thing I accept on faith is that Jesus endorsed it, the path stands on it's own merit.
I think I got what you meant, them understanding the history and meaning behind the traditions. Especially the traditions that are primarily from the Roman Catholic and Episcopal denominations. I think those are the dominant Christian denominations over there, aren't they?

In the small town where I was drug up, the protestant church was built by a federation of people from a bunch of denominations, so the customs and rituals were an amalgamation. Going to churches of different denominations, I'd pick out bits and pieces that had been lifted from them.

Over here, it's been my experience that most people don't bring religion into their daily social interactions at all, other than when somebody sneezes. If they discuss religion at all, keep it pretty general in concepts and preferences. The people that quote chapter and verse the most, are usually the most intolerant, often racist, usually sexist & homophobic, closed minded motherfuckers on earth. YMMV.

If someone starts quoting Bible verses, they're selling something, most often their religion... available on an easy payment plan, publications extra. If they are quoting Old Testament verses, they're usually trying to justify some abhorrent social behavior(see racist-sexist-homophobic above), win people over to a political candidate, or to reinforce a position that has no logical or reasonable defense. It's amazing how a sentence or two, can be "interpreted" to cover things which could not even have been imagined, by the people that wrote them.

That was a perfect summary, Bruce.

Not stupid. Absolutely plausible. Or said this way: Things we interpret as actions by god may have been actions by an alien (or time traveller).

I really tried to be a believer, so I actually read the bible. What I learned turned me off god and religion. Now, I can refute the people you describe using their own, and only, source of justification. But I don't charge or ask for donations.

I agree completely

Then you're an atheist. That's the only requirement. Atheism is a lack of belief, not a belief. Individual atheists can have beliefs in various (non-diety) things, and about dieties (like them not existing), but all that is required to be an atheist is to not believe in a diety.

There are beliefs that you have to be an atheist to hold, but there are no beliefs that you have to hold to be an atheist.

I don't believe ... you, I believe.
wait... what?

I believe...


I'll have another cookie.

Atheism is to theism as gentile is to Jewish. You don't need to have any beliefs to be a gentile; you just have to not be Jewish.