Nice to meetcha!

It's a short list, and it really was made quickly and as a joke. I was just trying to help her fit in. She reached out to me when she started to feel excluded, and I was trying to tell her not to take offense or worry overmuch about one persons opinion...

I'm not happy about her bringing it up in public, and using it as bait or leverage, but then again...I did write it and will own up to it. I am still trying to salvage the possibility of being friends with her privately. I love all of you...my cyber family...even the ones on the asshole list. And it's tough to see friends fight with each other. It certainly seems improbable that she will be able to recover gracefully from this bloodbath, but I will still try to help her do that if I can.

Bri, you're not on the list. As I said, the omissions are the worst part of it. I forgot glatt too.

Monster is on all 3 lists. I'm on 2. So please, don't take it seriously.... It was but a jape.

And UT, I can't argue with your point. I really wish I could. I am trying to be more considerate of other people's perspective.... I think life has been bonking me over the head with that lesson lately. My history says that I am what you say, though. Remind me of this post if I should come down hard on a male newb?

Spexxie...did you think I said I'm a lummox? :p:

I am disappoint.

:(

Oh well, as they say...meh.

Jim, the one flag she didn't show in her signature line was an all red one. But it should be obvious. Be careful.

We are! You are special to me. We are kindred spirits, you and I. If we ever meet, I'm going to hold you down and tickle your feet until you pee!

Or he'll throw you under a bus, given the right circumstances. :lol:

Kidding. Really, kidding. ;)

I'm sorry

so - I'm NOT on the list and she baits me with it?

what does that say about her? IIRC, I was nothing but nice and welcoming to the lady. I thanked her for some interesting posts about new jersey ffs!

I just got fed up when she kept saying she was leaving as we were horrible (for not commenting on her breast cancer thread?) but then she didn't leave which is the hallmark of someone who is ....you know, drama-whoring.

She's probably loving this.

eta - anyway - glad we're friends. :heartpump for you.

She didn't say you were on the list. I assumed someone else had talked to her about you privately

jim, you don't have to apologize to me. You owe me nothing. Except the friendship and respect that you have spoken of. If it's not there, don't speak of it.

I don't understand it, but I don't love you any less.

Of course, as paranoid as I am, I have all kinds of ideas that hurt about what "list" or lists I was on, but it doesn't really matter. You were working on a goal that I can't fathom. It's not really about any of us on that list (which might even be worse than actually being on a list: not even mattering which list you were on, it only mattered to the person hell bent on destruction and division, thinking she had a secret, that she knows more...though we don't know her "trials and tribulations", her quote, she thinks she knows ours, and "us") it's about something that is not my business: your private life.

But she made it public, and made a lot of people feel badly in the process. What does that tell you?

She never did say specifically that you were on "the list." But it's possible you were mentioned elsewhere. She was apparently PMing a lot of people. Including me. But I didn't talk about any of you.

Well that's even better. Join a forum, then immediately start...what? I don't even know what the name for it is.

Jebus Crepes.

ffs (not at you glatt, sorry)

If you received a PM from Dis PRIOR to the blow-up, please raise your hand.

I did not.

I suspect you needed to have a penis. I could be wrong.

This is making me ill. What a crock.

Oh, no. Mine was post blow-up. She was just answering a question I raised in this thread.

[emilylittella]OK, sorry. Nevermind [/emilylittella]

Imma shut up now. I've said more than enough, as usual.

eta: I'm sorry everyone. I don't help matters. :(

My wife's Mom used to put the kids to bed, and say:
"I don't want to hear another peep out of you tonight"

This round (about lists and who made them and who's on it) goes to BD.
She really poked you kids.







PEEP

I agree with this.

It must be quite disconcerting to join a group and have them keep suggesting you're someone from the past pretending to be someone new.

Each of the people who've made such comments probably feels that it was no biggie. Just a single comment, just a single question. But with quite a few people doing it intermittently, from the perspective of Brill, who sees all of those comments as a whole, it must seem like a wall of suspicion.

I also thought she was someone else. I thought she was Bri. because Bri had posted about changing her name, and then BD arrived with her 'Brilliant Disguise'...etc.

Some of the responses to Brill have been less than stellar. At one point a poster actually asked if the lass had been shown the way to the tip jar. Sorry, but I'd feel shit if someone said something like that about me on a new forum.

Much of what's been said has been intended as humour. Unfortunately humour doesn't always click online, and if the person at the centre of it is new then they may not get some of the running gags, or continuing stories.

Though actually a fair few people have been friendly, warm and welcoming, it doesn't take many off-kilter comments to make that friendly stuff fade into the background. Just so much more potent that way.





@ BrilliantDisguise: in answer to your earlier post. Yes, we have had several people coming back in disguise. Usually, these are people who have initially joined specifically for the purposes of trolling/gaming the community. Pensive Pam and Emma both come under that category. Every so often one of them returns in a new guise. Spends a few days getting settled in then starts causing shit with everyone. Y'know, starting fights, using private messages to stir up trouble, attempting to play established members off against each other, that kind of thing.

Very occasionally someone will join, settle in, get to know us and post for awhile and then get 'driven off' by some argument, disagreement or personality clash with an individual dwellar or a particular contingent of dwellars. Often this begins as discussions on politics that go too far. Jill falls into that category. So did Lamplighter but (thankfully) he returned.

Mostly though, the newcomers who arrive here and then claim they've been harshly treated turn out to be the aforementioned trolls. It's happened enough times now that even I am suspicious with newcomers, and I am really not suspicious by nature. I make a conscious effort not to let that slight cynicism affect how I interact with newcomers.

You have wandered into the cellar not so very long after a bout of troublemakers fucking about with the community. Why they do this, i don't know. I know it is a 'thing' though, because we're usually not the only site they've done it with. There have been several occasions where the tone of the trolling has suggested that we may be dealing with something more worrying. On those occasions a little research has turned up the same posters on multiple forums, often leaving a trail of bans and suspensions, and in at least two cases the posters have had genuine mental illness or distress. (PP and SE)

We have been here for a very long time. You cannot exist as long as we have without occasionally becoming a target for something. You cannot be a target as often as we have been (for both individual and group shennanigans) without taking on a degree of skepticism.

Some of what you've said and done during your short time here has rung bells with a few people. That's all.


If you actually look at the way people have responded to you, you'll find it's a mixed bag. Well, we're a mixed bunch. There are people here with whom I can barely keep a civil tongue (finger?). There are others to whom I'll happily pour out my inner thoughts.

I'd really like it if you stayed. I think you fit in really well. Which is to say you draw just as much positive attention and just as much animosity as the next poster. That's to be expected with a group as mixed as we are.

The timing of this is relevant, I think. I wrote that list as a tongue in cheek reassurance that she was doing fine fitting in. Prior to this situation/debacle .... And this has snowballed so quickly.... She's really a very normal and 'similar to us' kind of a person to talk to. Seems to me, she got mad, said something about it, and decided to leave. Now, we all know how hard it is to leave this particular forum .... AND, if you're in the limelight/crosshairs It's clearly much more difficult. Can we just ease up a bit on the name calling and judgement... On both sides of this.... And let her start over if she wants to? Brill, this is a great family, and worth the effort it takes to find your place in it. My word on that.

Well said, Jim.

Great post Dana.

BigV, put that one in your hall of fame.

Oh, lol,.....I swear I was writing my post before I saw yours Dana....


But if someone says 'get a room' ....i'm buying!

I thought brill was fitting in fine but I don't agree that anyone's comments to or about her should have received the amount of venom she included. No one knows anyone on the internet. These are not people here she knows or should care about enough to say fuck you to... JMO

I think Jim covered that with the 'standing up to a crowd' comment.

No one response was bad enough to warrant venom. But taken as a package I can see how Brill mayhave felt very much under attack. Clearly her response to being attacked is to give back more than she was hit with. Fair enough.


[eta] Trouble is. We are each seeing our individual responses and Brill's individual responses to us. From her perspective we're a group. We're a mass of not-yet-knowns.

And once again, it's the big meanie weanies faults. So "she got mad" but that's OK.

No one else is to get mad back and respond?

How's this: one of your meanie weanies has had enough of finger pointing and the pretense of 'so fair and caring' which is actually meanness personified, not to mention how it belies the talk of friendship and love.

How's this?: I cry EVERY SINGLE DAY. And yet, I come to the Cellar for laughs, and whatever it is I'm going through comes through, because some of you so called FAIR people can be anything but fair, so I respond...but I'm a big meanie weanie because I call something as I see it?

I remember finding out how a certain beloved dwellar has some mental issues. AFTER the fact, I heard: well gee, I wish I'd been nicer.

So WHERE do you get who is to be treated with kid gloves and who gets to be pointed out as a meanie weanie by the saints.

I come to the cellar because I'm lonely. I'm leaving because my 'friends' here make me feel more alone and isolated than my actual life.

There, how's that? Perfect for you, i"M sure. YOu can be rid of me AND tell me to quit being a martyr.

I'm so tired of trying to fit in, myself. Maybe BD or LR, whoever it is, had the right idea.

They both accomplished the same goal.

Meek and innocent and downtrodden my ass.

I don't feel as if I was part of the group of "thought of attackers" My comments were totally benign. If it makes her feel better I will say " stay, you will be assimilated," ;)

Read my post again Infi. I never said anyone was a meanie.

But hey. Way to personalise the fuck out of everything.

Oh, you're far too kind. Fucking PERSONALIZE? WTF do you think your goddam BD was doing? Fuck that!

Thanks Dana. Thanks so fucking much.

Right. That's it. I am done with the histrionics.

You are impossible to interact with Infi.

I don't want you to feel like you have to fit in IM you are perfect as you are:hug:

It makes my day to read your posts...

And you're a hypocrite. And meaner than you'll ever believe.

Now go find some red carpet for your less histrionic new friend.

So, me trying to be nice, and more considerate than I have been is a bad thing?

How does it belie talk of love and friendship? I missed that leap... I do love you and think of you as my friend, shaw. What did I say that contradicts that? Because I made a joke list, I've been lying about caring about you?

What can I do to prove my affection for you?

It's a lot easier being a hammer, btw.

Whatever Infinite Monkey.

You're the one who made this about you. You're the one staking out sides (her or you). Imade a considered post putting forward my own take on the situation. I didn't attack you or accuse you of anything.

What i got in response was this:


So, basically, anytime I don't simply take your word for it that the girl is bad news. Or try to see what it might be like for a newcomer to our fold, I am apparently betraying you.

But here's the thing. What I said about her reacting to us as a group? Is exactly what you do. From time to time a handful of people get under your skin and then you explode at the entire collective. I am just considering the possibility that this is exactly what BD has just done.

I haven't said she is genuine. I haven't said she isn't. What I've done is consider the possibility that she is, and if so what her experience of us may have been.

Every time a newcomer arrives and there's a little trouble, I consider these things. And every time I do, you take it personally and start flinging shit at me.

Had. Enough.

I dunno if you think I have steel skin or something. It is possible for you to hurt me too.

Somehow that never matters though does it?

Maybe I should be more vehement in my expressions. Then you'd know for sure when you got a hit.

You had enough of me a long time ago. You can tie pretty bows around the shit you sling but that doesn't change the fact that it's shit.

Oh, you think I'd like a little consideration from you? How very fucking human of me.

Why I always thought we'd end up friends, I have no idea. You only see pain if you get to hold up a big sign about how you are uniquely qualified to sense pain.

Now tell me more how much I suck. How I made this about me. I've had enough, too. You are not the moral fucking compass of the cellar.

Yes, it's nice that you give the benefit of the doubt to the new person. That's a good quality you have. But once you decide that another person isn't worthy of such consideration, it's a done deal, isn't it?

*nods*

ok.


For the record. That was a hit. As was the one before.

And that's exactly how I feel! I'm not made of steel. I don't know how to reach out and send a PM about how I need someone to show they care.

I have honestly gone back and forth between wanting so desperately for you to like me, and being so mad at you....because I think you don't like me.

Everything in the last couple pages felt like a hit to me...as has many many many posts in the last couple months.

My hangup? Maybe, probably. There is no reason for anyoen to want to hear what my issues are. I know that I lash out. I've admitted it. I'm under some tests by my doc to figure out what exactly is going on in my head. My only issues aren't here, and, believe it or not...I used to be a pretty fine person.

And I"m stuck somewhere between hiding behind my anger, and so much wanting to think someone gives a shit.

Many responses to me feel like hits.

Again, my hangup? Probably.

And it's best for me not to subject everyone to that, wouldn't you say? You're not mind readers, and I can't reach out.

So it's an impasse.

fwiw, I've admired much about you.

Also, I didn't see your post that I just responded to when I posted Post # 336. I'm not completely heartless.

Oh for fuck's sake. Infi. I DO like you. I have ALWAYS liked you. You baffle me at times. But I have never not liked you.

If I didn't like you I wouldn't give a shit what you thought of me. The times when you've blown up at me would have just sailed over my head as meaningless noise.

I made what I thought was a mildly contentious point about us as a group (myself included) and suddenly found myself being lambasted by my friend. Truth now: I was crying a few minutes ago. I don't often cry over internet attacks, but when they come from friends they fucking hurt.

Look. Let's just set this to one side, eh? I honestly didn;t mean any attack on you with my comments about BD. If any of it came across as an attack, I am sorry. It was certainly not my intention to make you feel shit. Really it wasn't.

As to me getting upset: well, I'm in a slightly emotional place right now. Tears come more easily than normal I guess. Just one of those things :p

I've been crying too. In the parking garage. Like a fucking child.

I'm so sorry Dana. Really. I'm such a shit and I'm sorry.

Everything feels personal and my most logical part of myself telling me it's not is no help.

I, so caught up in my crap feelings, and doing something that is the exact opposite of what I always thought made a little special: understanding when people are in pain, and avoiding hurting people I care about, and trying to lift up and not stomp down.

I am so sorry.

Me too. I'm worried about my health. I want to pull myself up by my bootstraps, but every day I fall at some point or other.

I'm sorry I took it as an attack. My paranoia has reached new highs.

*hugs*

Forget about it now, hon. We all do it. It says nothing about you. All those things you considered makes you a little special are still firmly in place.

That point isn't when you're attempting to pull up by your bootstraps by any chance? :p

Thank you.

You have no idea how many ways you just helped me. For one, I need to be shown that I can be hurtful too, when lashing out from real or intended hurt. I needed to see that. I'm not proud of it.

And for validating my "human-ness."

Hugs back.

Ok, ladies. Now kiss and make up...


And take pictures, 'cause that would be cool. :D

Haggis. :o

*grins*


and all is calm.

Awwww... Good on both you guys :lovers:

Peace.

And watch out for the giraffes.

AS I've said before. There's a lot of love in the room tonight...
 

Oooh, Nirvana quoting Ted Nugent. How sexy is that? grrrrrr!

UT, you are the Milton Fucking Erickson of forum owners. Dude, you really need to get credentialed and take that shit on the road. Seriously, you can be onbe insightful mf
Your dad sounds like a tool (Thanks, I'll be here all week. Try the crow, it comes with a slice of humble pie) Remember what my sister always says to me, "Leave humor to the professionals!"

That's so British and sexy of you, Dana. Right. That's it.

Note to self: Don't piss this woman off.

You know exactly what to do, Jim. Road trip!!!



Way cool.

Yeah, thanks foot. Turn the knife.

Dana & IM - get a room. :)
I just read like 7 pages. This has been an incredible shit fest. Damn you guys are like a pack of wolves on a baby doe. Right up till you started feeding off of each other. Cannibalism is rather ugly to watch in slow motion.

and A Blessed day to all.

Oh, Classic, why Bless your heart. :p

Don't let the terrorists win!

Ladies and Gentleman, let me present to you:

Together again, for the first time....it'sssssss, The Dana and Infi Show. Starrrrrringggg...DANA AND INFI.

(the crowd goes wild)

:)

I love dogs.

I want to shoot my neighbors dogs to make a point.

About thirty posts ago, I was thinking we should just get jim to post his list and be done with it, but now I'm thinking, who really gives a fuck. Most of us already know what the other regs think of us don't we? Some of us are in transitionary phases of our cellar lives, so the lines might be a bit fuzzy there, but hopefully we all still know where we stand with each other right?

I wonder what BD is thinking about this all now. i'm sure she's still reading us and our in house fighting (which happens fairly often because there are a lot of strong personalities here).

Anyway, I just wanted to say to Jim; don't give up on being the new you. I'm sure I'm not the only one cheering you on from the sidelines hoping you get to your journeys end feeling better for the trip. xx

^^wss