Its unamerikan to tax the rich or provide a social safety net or affordable health care to all.

:headshake you're just a soc symp!

Yeah...a pinko commie. that's me. ;)

Thats how it works.

Smear, innuendo, half truths and misrepresentations, name calling....

Repeat and rinse until it gets to the roots and you "believe"

lol...well to be honest, I don't think classic or anyone else here thinks that about me, or you even. Most of it is pretty good natured mud slinging I think. Kind of like a food fight. You know it's not right, but it can be pretty funny at times. ;)

Yep..I agree.

I dont even mind the attempting bullying and belittling.

Its just sooooo repetitive, it gets boring after awhile.

But it is still good for a laugh and I dont expect to change any minds here.

Well, some of us are amenable to a different viewpoint. I know mine has changed about some things since I first started posting here.

Actually, that depends on how you interpret the whole purpose of government, states' rights vs. limitations of federal government control, the success/failure of programs and initiatives brought about by the "War on Poverty" and progressive liberalism, and what the government's role should be in our daily lives: the small, quiet guardian that steps up to protect rights and civil liberties when needed, or the large, heavily involved and controlling patriarch if you will, that maneuvers us and our wealth around in what it thinks is best for the people.

Hmmmm....I wonder if we can get ACORN to register you to vote next time. ;)

I understand and accept the differences of opinion on the role of government.

What I find objectionable is the gross mischaracterizations by either side.

a system of government regulation as opposed to a completely "free market" is not socialism

a progressive tax system is not socialism

affordable and accessible health care for all is not socialism

protecting or representing the rights of the most disenfranchised citizens is not socialism (or mafia-like)

lol...that's doubtful...for a number of reasons.

This. Personally though, I don't think applying labels like that to a particular program and then filling in the gaps with assumed ZOMG BAD THINGS is ever appropriate. I don't care what label something is given, if it's an efficient government program that will do legitimate good and there's no alternative, then I'm all for it. But otherwise, I think people should be left to their own devices, and that some things such as a house or affordable health care are not "rights" at all but privileges of hard work and living in a wealthy nation. I don't want my tax dollars going to a program that can be done better by an NGO, or efforts to support legislating morality. Maybe I'm just jaded from living in a swing state and suffering through all the bullshit (gross misrepresentation) that surrounded this past election from both sides. Very few of them are real winners in my book. I need a drink.

I have no argument with the above, even if I dont agree with it. It is certainly worth discussion in a reasonable and rational manner in another thread.

My point....google "obama socialsm" or "acorn voter fraud" while you have that drink and find anything resembling facts....rather than smears, innuendo, half truths and misrepresentations, name calling....

Unfortunately, it is the nature of political discourse these days.

ACORN has a long history of scandal
. In the state of Missouri
in 1986, 12 ACORN members were convicted of voter fraud.

In December 2004, in St. Louis,
six volunteers pleaded guilty to dozens of election law violations
for filling out registration cards with names of dead people and other bogus information.
The volunteers worked for “Operation Big Vote” — a branch of ACORN

On February 10, 2005,
Nonaresa Montgomery, a paid worker who ran Operation Big Vote
during the run-up to the 2001 mayoral primary,
was found guilty of vote fraud.

In April 2008
eight ACORN employees in St. Louis city and county
pleaded guilty to federal election fraud
for submitting bogus voter registrations.

All members of acorn - all guilty. You asked me to put up and I did. These are facts - irrefutable facts.

They probably already did!:rolleyes:

The fact is that ACORN submitted all registrations as required by law, reported those that they thought were questionable, fully cooperated with authorities, which led to the convictions.

In fact, ACORN had collected over 1 million voter registrations nationwide in 08 and less than 1/10th of 1 percent were questionable and reported as such by ACORN to the appropriate state authorities.

ACORN has never been charged with voter registration fraud.....that is a fact.

You can transfer the guilt of volunteers to the organization or characterize it as you wish. No court has ever made that leap of guilt association.

But in your unsubstantiated and undocumented opinion, its all a cover-up of deceptive practices and a ploy that makes them worse then the murdering, drug running, prostitute pimping, illegal gambling operations Mafia?