I was/am fond of Clinton. But the whole Lewinsky thing really bugged me. He should have just said "Yeah, I nailed her. So what?" Instead, he and the stupid stupid stupid Republicans dragged our country through the sleaziest round of political mudslinging I've ever seen. Both sides should be ashamed for that. Both sides ended up covered in filth. Clinton lowered the bar, and we got Bush as a result. If Clinton had never lied about a BJ, we would not have a recovering alcoholic frat boy screwing up the world today.

Clinton should've kept his pecker under control, but then again he IS a Southern politician. For many of them, philandering isn't just a general rule, it's an art form.

Should he have admitted the affair openly? Sure.

But the degree to which he was hounded for l'affaire Lewinsky was absolutely ridiculous. The Republicans were desperate to throw SOMETHING nasty at him that would stick, and that's the best they could come up with -- lying about a BJ to save his family public embarrassment? Not only do I not care, I say that there should be an official Presidential Oral Squad for such needs. If the man's going to have his finger on the nuclear button, keep him relaxed and happy.

The embarrassing thing about Lewinsky was not that it happened, but that it became such a legal and media circus for years.

Frankly, philandering isn't limited to southern politicians. They ALL practice it as an art form. And I'd be curious to know just what percentage of regular guys are 100% faithful to their wives anyhow? I've had more than a few married men come on to me, and believe me, I was not doing anything in any way to encourage this. One of these guys was actually a friend of my BF's. This guy approached me and suggested a blow job. His rational for this request was that blow jobs don't really count as sex. Maybe Bill was under the same delusion. :3eye:

Difficult to explain that to politicians who are doing same on a normal basis, but instead preach morality. Reality is found in the numbers as first demonstrated by type matching for organ donors. 20% of the children were not fathered by their father. That number is same in the puritanical 1950s as it was the in free sex 1980s as it is today. That means such affairs probably involve more than 50% of us. What Clinton and Lewinsky did is quite normal throughout the world - once we remove the puritanical preaching from a pope, the drug addict and money launder Rush Limbaugh, Jim Baker, and self righteous critics. The Clinton Lewinsky affair would be a nothing if we had first shot all the extremists looking for a reason to critize Clinton. The scandel demonstrates how powerful the religous right extremists have become.

In the meantime, it is no accident that Clinton set the record for the longest standing ovation in the UN history. Once you eliminate lies from Rush Limbaugh, then discover why US popularity throughout the world was at the 70% region when Clinton was president. The world can see liars just as easily as we would - if we first stop listening to Rush Limbaugh 'Pravada'. George Jr has taken US approval ratings to the 15% mark. It does not take a genius to see what a mental midget this president and his extremist supporters be - as well as liars. Shameful to bring up the Lewinsky affair and not mention the corruption of those who would chase Clinton's penis. Top of the list is the righteous Ken Starr who would trash evidence so that people who burned to death in a defective design were not justly compensated. This same 'righteous' Ken Starr is the perfect choice for the righteous among us - because the righteous are Satan's favorite people.

In the world, such affairs are so normal that most of the world was asking why all the hub-bub. After all, before anyone can criticize Clinton, they must first confront the fact that such affairs are so normal even among the religous righteous. So normal that 20% of the Cellar - one in five of us - is a direct result of such affairs. The religous right is obligated to save us from ourselves and liberate people who don't want to be liberated. Yelof is very much correct. Much of the world saw the Monica thing as silly nonsense - because that is what it was. And much of the world defined America's Pearl Harbor invasion of Iraq correctly. Even the extremists among us must admit they were wrong - about Iraq and about Clinton.

20% of the kids are not fathered by their father. Until one comes to grips with that reality, then one does not have a righteous leg to stand on. What Clinton and Lewinsky did is only between them and the families. Once a righteous person speaks up, then that meddling righteous person becomes Satan.

Pardon me for interfering here. I havent read all the pages in this thread but I cant help commenting on the subject.

Those Iraqi prisoners should be so lucky as to be humiliated by being "headbagged" naked to have pictures taken of them. If I....or should I say when I was in charge, I would have had some hungry rats eat their genitals before the anal electrocution was activated to do them in. If this process got boring, I'd come up with some equally non-Geneva sanctioned process to punish them. During the entire process, I'd have been taping for viewing at some family event , or simply for Uday's twisted viewing pleasure.



Just a thought.

These are the next names coming in the Gitmoizing of Iraqi prisons.
Brig. Gen. Barbara Fast, General Sanchez's top deputy for intelligence,
Col. Thomas M. Pappas, who commanded the 205th Intelligence Brigade,
Lt. Col. Steven Jordan, director of the Joint Interrogation and Debriefing Center at Abu Ghraib
519th Military Intelligence Battalion, from Fort Bragg, N.C.,
377th Military Police Company, an OH reserve unit from the Cincinnatti OH area
Capt. Carolyn A. Wood, who had led an interrogation team at the Bagram Collection Point where at least two Iraqis are now listed as homicides.
General Fay's report on the intelligence services part in open Geneva Convention violations is due soon - even thought the George Jr administration is trying to get it quashed.

It seems to be getting more fucked up. There was a pile of stuff on the BBC today, a few things stood out.

- pictures used to intimidate new prisoners
- started by general miller, the guy that made camp x-ray
- very clear intel guys were privy to what was going on, just just a few guards

Then it got wierder

- concensual and non-concensual sex with both male and female inmates
- female guards taking multiple partners simultaniously in front of naked prisoners
- 'invisible' inmates that were never entered officially into the system, the body in ice was one of these and had a fake id stuffed in his arms before being carted off by medics.

The word that keeps running though my mind is a funny one, evil.

Systematic persecution of inmates to 'break' them by whatever means necessary and if you really want to fuck them up, just never enter them into the system and beat them to death at your leisure.

I keep wondering, did it work? Right, wrong or whatever, did they find out what they wanted to know?:confused:

I'm sure they were told something. Torture me and I'll tell you where saddam burried his WMD.

Lots of the real pros at this stuff have said quite bluntly that torturing people like that is a double edged sword- they'll tell you something, anything to make it stop so there is no way of knowing whether it's true.

It would be just our luck that the only guy that knows where the WMDs are buried, is a homosexual sadist that loved it.:haha:

just read through the entire thread. This thing is a clinic in topic drift ...


-sm

And your point is? This is America, damn it, we can drift anywhere we want. I'll spare you the Constitution and fallen solders retoric. :D

Where have you guys been. That was so well known so long ago that I had posted same on 9 May 2004

Some of us don't have all day to follow every emerging news story, I follow what I can and read a variety of publications but I found the BBC show a nice summary.