HOLY SHIT! What do the Prod's say? What do the Jews say?

tw, why do you hate people?

aw shucks tw, you sure danced circles around me again. i sure hope to be brilliant like you some day. i suppose if i barf the last book i read into a post, it would be a good start.

*just so you know - my troll comment was just to rattle your cage. this comment gets a little closer to an insult. *

People want their freedom. People respect others rights. They don't stifle innovation. They don't impose on others misguided preachings from an obsolete book. Good people don't let religion pervert them to the dark side of the force. The dark side - when religion becomes anything other than a relationship between you and your god.

Those who love people would condemn religions that would even create the Spanish Inquisition and condone pedophilia (and not even apologize for it), condone torture (as the American religious right does), and massacre innocent Spanish citizens only because their government participates in an unjustified crusade against another sovereign nation. All this done only because religion somehow knows better?

But you tell me. Show me how good a church is that even told us to hate Jews because of what happened to Jesus. How could I love people and be a part of such hatred? Hatred does not exist just in Islamic extremists. It exists in those who so hate as to stifle the advancement of mankind and innovation; such as stem cell research and kidney transplants. Those who love people do not fear innovation; so fear as to even hype an obvious myth called intelligent design. Good people would not put up with such hatred for mankind’s advancement.

Meanwhile, more people could have been killed in London yesterday. Why? Because religion is so good for people? You tell me who really promotes hate. I have simply carried the message - hatred promoted by religious concepts. Do these mythical gods really exist? Then why do their doctrines promote murder - a hatred for mankind?

*yawn* the only person i've heard who has a broader brush for their stereotyping would be your pal Rush.

Stepping in as devil's advocate for a moment, I, too, have heard the Catholic church described as pagan. If I can find a cite, I'll post it.

Ah, HERE it is.

You may now resume your squabble. :p

I'm not sure you can refer to the "Bible Discernment Ministries" as a reliable source.

I'm not disputing any claims that the Roman Catholic Church has pagan or paganized elements, but, well, the Catholic Church is what the Protestants were protesting about ...

I was lazy. It was the first one out of about 600 that popped up when I googled "catholic church" and "pagan."

Anyhow, I thought that was just sort of a given. Those clever early Christian missionaries just overlaid their doctrine on top of the pagan worship that was prevalent at the time, so we got Christmas instead of the winter solstice, Easter in place of the spring equinox, etc.

I forget what Martin Luther's exact bitch was when he nailed those 95 theses to the local Catholic university's door. I think mostly he was upset that the pope back there in Rome got to be the utilmate authority on the latest insider news from God. The Catholic Encyclopedia hints that Luther may have been a psychopath, but they're probably a bit biased.

Talk about thread drift! :3_eyes:

[quote=tw] Meanwhile, more people could have been killed in London yesterday. Why? Because religion is so good for people? You tell me who really promotes hate. I have simply carried the message - hatred promoted by religious concepts. Do these mythical gods really exist? Then why do their doctrines promote murder - a hatred for mankind?[/QUOT

I never intimated that religion was "good for people", I don't subscribe to any organized religion. I know that a lot of people promote hate and it's ususally the love of filthy lucre that drives it. They may wrap themselves in the robes of this-or-that religion, but it always comes down to money.

But you didn't answer the question. Why do YOU hate people? Not why do you hate religion. It's easy to hate religion. It's easy to generalize--you spank cellarites and say they are generalizing the beliefs of the muslims but then you go and generalize Catholics, right-wingers, etc. You do the very thing you say you despise.

There are several of the nuttier fundamentalist Protestant sects that think Catholics are Pagans or Satanists.

There was an excellent article in the Independent today (at the fairly insane price of 5.50SFr over here grr) from a columnist who lives and works in beruit. His hyphothisis on the motives for suicide bombers in this scenario makes more sense than any Iàve heard. Shortened right down, it goes something like this.

Like early western explorers were quite taken by idea of harems but disgusted by other practices in the east, many muslims today are very tempted by the sexual freedoms and other freedoms of and living in the west. His example was a turkish student that studied over here and slept with is girlfriend but then got mummy to find him a nice turkish virgin to marry when he went home. That's the happy ending to this cultural oddity. The unhappy one is when the desire leads to self-loathing and guilt, and a spell in an old-school pakistani madrasa doesn't hurt here. The person ends up wanting to punish the society they percieve as having led them astray as well as destroy themselves.

The bomb makers are of course, a slightly different story, they are that hard-core of extremists that exist around any ideology, from my earlier socialist/communist example to facism, christianity or animal rights. I think these two ideas togher paint the best picture of the mental landscape of islamic extremism, particularly in the UK and essentailly, most of europe I've seen yet.

Makes sense, Jag.
Here is manifests itself in slightly safer scenerios, every day.
I screw up.
I sue you.
I win money.
That proves it was your fault and I didn't really screw up. :rolleyes:
Of course if I don't win money I may have to blow stuff up.

I don't understand the part about terrorism that says that Muslim Extremists can gain some kind of advantage by blowing up 73 Egyptians and 10 folks from other countries like Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Dubai, Italy, and Great Britain.

blow up people from other countries sothat those other countries will place pressure on the US.

to do what exactly? it's frigging egypt. That incident and those like it are rooted in the state of egyptian politics or lack thereof.

Precisely my point ...