Well, we don't know what the story is with his mother and I doubt we will ever know. What bbro knows is probably filtered thru the boyfriend and he may not be a reliable witness. I know plenty of people who say "mom and dad don't love me" as an excuse to continue doing what they are doing.

*nods* that also is true of many people.

I think my point really, was that we cannot use the Mother's unwillingness to help him/love him as evidence of his being beyond help. She may be a loving mother who has finally had enough of his antics. She may be one of those women who just didn't bond with her baby and left him emotionally bereft throughout his growing up.

He may or may not be on a journey towards self realisation in which bbro can help or provide a necessary anchor, or he may be in a cycle of self-destruct and denial which will (or has) draw her in and make her part of his destruction. It's impossible to tell really, from what she has said here.

I would suggest she needs to be as self aware as she can possibly be whilst involved with this man. She may be right about him and be the one to provide him the support he's lacked thus far in his life. She may be catastrophically wrong about him in which case she needs to be ready to bail out before he has a chance to drag her too far into his destructive pattern.

If someone will not help themselves you cannot help them.

very true. But if someone has reached the point in their life where they really do want to try and help themselves, you can offer support (moral at least)

True, if they are actually willing to make changes & not just talk about it.

Change, real change, is so very difficult to maintain. As human beings, we almost always revert back to the familiar, no matter how nasty it is.

Bri, that has a horrible ring of truth to it.

glad we agree on something! ;)

Oh shug, we agree on lots! .....we aso disagree on lots and that's usually more fun :P

I never said that he didn't fuck up. I know he did, but the sentance is more than should have been dealt given the crime. It was also his probation officer saying one thing and doing another. I didn't come on here for advice on whether or not to dump him, I just wanted to be able to unload on some people I thought would be the last to pass judgement because no one here is innocent.

When I said that there was something my fault, that was in response to DanaC's questions. In that particular incident, it was my fault, and that has no bearing on the happenings right now.

And about his mother, it is not just what he tells me, it is what I see myself. She is a royal bitch. No matter what he does, she bitches at him and expects him to be at her beck and call. He has never once said that she is the reason he has made mistakes. He takes the blame for them.

But like I said, I never wanted this to be about whether or not I should stay with him.

No I won't.

Bbro - relax a little - many here are genuinely concerned and you may have taken their comments out of context. They/We have lived a lot of life and are just giving you honest, unbiased opinions. Take 'em or leave 'em its up to you. By the way - no one here is passing judgement on anyone - at least not that I have seen in my time.
By the way - you said he was 36, how old are you again??
Good luck with everything.

What did he do? You won't say. All you say is that the punishment didn't fit the crime--that's what everybody in jail says: I'm being unfairly treated. I didn't really think I'd go to jail for not following the rules! Look, you're on probation, you keep your nose spotlessly clean. (and I've been on probation--it was enough for me, thanks) It's supposed to be a wakeup call and guess what? He didn't wake up.

Stay with him, by all means. It sounds like true love.

The point is you are both where you are now, right now. Cannot change the past & we can't discuss things you are only going to talk around.
What is he going to do to change his actions from now on?
No drugs, no alcohol abuse, perfect behavior while inside, constant job while out?
If that is the case, I see no issue. If his mother does not believe he has changed, then it is time to move on.

Next time I will

So, i was right, then. You just wanted us to pat you on the head.


Consider it done.

(In the interest of full disclosure, bbro quoted a post I made and I was trying to re-quote it and it got deleted by me. I didn't mean to delete it. --but she quoted the meat of my post and I did ask her, again, to tell us her age, which she has not and, I suppose, will not)