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-   Current Events (http://cellar.org/forumdisplay.php?f=4)
-   -   Obama: "I'm ready to negotiate with you, Iran." Iran: "Fuck you." (http://cellar.org/showthread.php?t=19488)

xoxoxoBruce 01-08-2012 11:08 PM
Joe, who are you responding to?

Big Sarge 01-08-2012 11:30 PM
I think joe is referring to mine. I admit the world is too globalist now for it to be realistic. Sometimes I feel like we should act like the super power we are. Let's at least invade Canada

piercehawkeye45 01-09-2012 09:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by traceur (Post 786042)
So you are assuming that if take out Iran's current regime that it will become a true democratic country? Given the history of western intervention in Iran that is a small to none probability. What is more likely to happen is that rouge Revolutionary Guard soldiers will step up terrorism in the region and on the west if we intervene and the population will get behind an even more extreme government.

Unless you want to go trillions of dollars even more in debt and invade Iran, facing even more resistance than Iraq or Afghanistan on a endeavor that is certain to fail. Sounds like a cakewalk


Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Sarge
Sometimes I feel like we should act like the super power we are. Let's at least invade Canada
Agreed.

it 01-09-2012 10:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by piercehawkeye45 (Post 786271)
So you are assuming that if take out Iran's current regime that it will become a true democratic country? Given the history of western intervention in Iran that is a small to none probability. What is more likely to happen is that rouge Revolutionary Guard soldiers will step up terrorism in the region and on the west if we intervene and the population will get behind an even more extreme government.

Unless you want to go trillions of dollars even more in debt and invade Iran, facing even more resistance than Iraq or Afghanistan on a endeavor that is certain to fail. Sounds like a cakewalk
take out? i thought you where talking about an internal revolution. my guess is that right now the oposition in iran is a democratic one, one that is pissed at what happened at the last "elections" and got disilusioned.

actually taking down the trade sunctions is likely going to make it much harder for the iranian government to control its people, including everything from information access to home made firepower. that's the best western intervention i think the US can do.

piercehawkeye45 01-09-2012 11:37 AM
I was talking about an internal revolution that is sparked by external forces. If there was a purely internal Iranian revolution, referencing other Arab Spring countries in the Middle East, especially Egypt, there is no guarantee that a democratic government will arise even when a regime is overthrown by democratic protestors. The clerics and revolutionary guard in Iran are not going to give up their power easily.

If the internal revolution is sparked by external forces, considering the history of western intervention in Iran (Operation Ajax, etc), there is a good chance the resulting regime could be even more anti-western and more nuclear prone than the current. I'm sure Iran is convinced that once they get a nuclear weapon they will have much more power and be safer from attack and sparking a revolution from external forces when they do not have the bomb will only solidify that view, making their drive for nuclear weapons even stronger.


I'm not sure taking down trade sanctions would help start a revolution in Iran. Many Iranians are unhappy with the current regime, but many others are happy as well. Also, assuming the clerics in Iran are rational, they will most likely liberalize before allowing a revolution to happen.

classicman 01-09-2012 11:43 AM
Oh hell, lets throw this into the mix as well
Iran Sentences U.S. 'Spy' to Death
Quote:
Iran's Revolutionary Court found 28-year-old Amir Hekmati "Corrupt on Earth," and sentenced him to death "for cooperating with the hostile country . . . and spying for the CIA." Under Iranian law, Hekmati has 20 days to appeal. His trial and death sentence came as Iran announced that it had enriched uranium at an underground facility and as the U.S. imposed harsher economic sanctions on Iran to stop its nuclear program.

Hekmati's mother Behnaz Hekmati said she and her husband Ali were "shocked and terrified by the news that our son, Amir, has been sentenced to death. We believe that this verdict is a result of a process that was neither transparent nor fair."
"Amir did not engage in any acts of spying, or 'fighting against God,' as the convicting judge has claimed in his sentence," said the statement. "Amir is not a criminal. His life is being exploited for political gain."

The U.S. State Department has asked the Iranian government repeatedly to allow Swiss diplomats, who represent U.S. interests in Iran, to meet with Hekmati. Iran has refused, according to the State Department.

"Allegations that Mr. Hekmati either worked for, or was sent to Iran by the CIA are simply untrue. The Iranian regime has a history of falsely accusing people of being spies, of eliciting forced confessions, and of holding innocent Americans for political reasons," she said.

Hekmati's family also said they had been rebuffed in all attempts to speak with the Iranian government.

"A grave error has been committed," said Hekmati's parents Monday. "We pray that Iran will show compassion and not murder our son, Amir, a natural born American citizen, who was visiting Iran and his relatives for the first time."

Hekmati, an Arizona-born Iranian-American who served the U.S. Marines as a rifleman from 2001 to 2005, was arrested while visiting his extended family, including two elderly grandmothers, in Tehran on Aug. 29, 2011, according to the family. The family said they were urged by the Iranian government to keep quiet about his arrest with the promise of later release, but then in December, Hekmati was shown on Iranian television allegedly confessing to being an undercover agent of the Central Intelligence Agency on a mission to infiltrate the Iranian Intelligence Ministry.

"It was their [the CIA's] plan to first burn some useful information, give it to them [the Iranians] and let Iran's Intelligence Ministry think that this is good material," Hekmati says calmly in the video.

In an exclusive interview with ABC News shortly after the broadcast, Hekmati's father strongly denied his son was a spy and said the confession was forced.
ABC

He has been sentenced to death by hanging and his sentence should be carried out within a week.

piercehawkeye45 01-09-2012 11:44 AM
Last time we save their fisherman from pirates. :rolleyes:

Clodfobble 01-09-2012 05:57 PM
Quote:
"We pray that Iran will show compassion and not murder our son, Amir, a natural born American citizen, who was visiting Iran and his relatives for the first time."
Not fucking likely. Kid's as good as dead. And this is why my aunt can never go back to Iran, and why her sister had to literally kidnap her mother to get her out of there a few years ago. Honestly, I don't know what the hell the parents were thinking, taking their son there. Almost makes me think he is a spy.

Spexxvet 01-10-2012 08:04 AM
I'm thinking that I don't want to leave my country. In fact, I don't really want to go to some parts of my country.

Undertoad 01-10-2012 07:43 PM
US rescues Iranian sailors... AGAIN!

classicman 01-10-2012 08:45 PM
I'm REALLY beginning to wonder about their threat to close the Strait with sailors like this :eyebrow:

TheMercenary 01-11-2012 04:44 AM
Death to another nuke scientist. They are slowly picking them off.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/45953703.../#.Tw1npphLLHN

Spexxvet 01-11-2012 09:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by classicman (Post 786653)
I'm REALLY beginning to wonder about their threat to hose the Straight sailors like this :eyebrow:
FTFY

classicman 01-11-2012 10:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMercenary (Post 786685)
Death to another nuke scientist. They are slowly picking them off.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/45953703.../#.Tw1npphLLHN
Quote:
In general, the American covert war against Iran is extraordinarily dangerous and probably illegal (it’s certainly unauthorized), but in particular, the assassination of Iran’s scientists is just reprehensible. Now that it’s actually happening, one wishes the reaction to it were even partially as aggressive as it was when a right-wing blogger suggested it.

Undertoad 01-11-2012 10:54 AM
Nobody knows whodunnit.


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