The Cellar - Afghanistan

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- - Afghanistan (http://cellar.org/showthread.php?t=19231)

The passion was edited out when images of coffins, and such were banned from free speech.

As much as I hate the media for using tragedy to line their pockets, it is very hard to create passion if we are blinkered.

I really feel sometimes just how unbearably white bread (and white bred) our country is. I remember visiting Paris in the mid 80s and my host was telling me about the various riots and demonstrations that were going on. I asked what they were about. She said sort of dismissively, "It's always something, we're very passionate about things and we love to have protests and demonstrations."

Where is our outrage? Who will lead us in our Haka?

Quote:

Originally Posted by footfootfoot (Post 826755)

Who will lead us in our Haka?

The New Zealanders left enough Maories around to learn from.
You lot just killed too many of the original inhabitants.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZenGum (Post 826668)

New Zealand have just lost three more soldiers in Afghanistan, bringing their losses to ten.

The bodies of the fallen were received back at their base by a giant haka or ceremonial dance. This video shows it very well, not too intrusively, and with absolutely no inane commentary.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-08-2...mrades/4225346

Spine chilling.

Even more impressive. Thanks for that post.

This is the latest, but perhaps not the most relevant, thread
with "Afghanistan" in the title... So I'm posting this here.

It is my opinion that Bin Laden spoke explicitly on the objectives
of his opposition to the US, and within were the reasons he was so effective in recruiting.

This reasoning appears again as "Two" in the five objectives
seen below in today's Statement from the Taliban:

The Guardian
Tuesday 18 June 2013

Taliban agree to peace talks with US over Afghanistan – full statement

Quote:

The Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan wants good relations
with all the countries of the world including the neighbouring countries,
on the basis of mutual respect and while desiring security at the country level,
the Islamic Emirate wants security and justice at the world level.

Of course the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan considerers it
its religious and national duty to gain independence from the occupation
and for that purpose has utilised every legitimate way and will utilise it in future too.

Similarly at world level, it considers the struggles and efforts by the
miserable and oppressed nations for achievement of their legitimate rights
and independence as their due rights, because people have
the right to liberate their countries from colonialism and obtain their rights.

In order to elucidate this policy the Islamic Emirate has
deemed it essential to open the political office in the
Islamic country of Qatar, for the attainment of the following objectives.

One: to reach understanding and initiate talks with countries
of the world for the purpose of improving relations with them.

Two: to support a political and peaceful solution which
includes the end of the occupation of Afghanistan
and the establishment of an independent Islamic system and
true security which is the want and aspiration of the nation.

Three: to hold meetings with Afghans as times may demand.

Four: to initiate contact with the United Nations as well as
with the international, regional and non-governmental organisations.

Five: to put political statements at the disposal of media regarding current
political developments.

It is worth mentioning that to thank the Emir of Qatar,
his highness Sheikh Hamad Bin Khalifa Al Thani who agreed
to the opening of the political office of the Islamic Republic
in his country and provided facilities in this regard.

These ideas also have relevance for for current discussions of US involvement in Syria

Of course, the entire conflict (now that Bin Laden is gone) with the Taleban can be reduced to their interpretation of "the establishment of an independent Islamic system", also from "Two".

Yesterday, the UN-led troops officially handed the official security responsibility of the last regions to Afghan forces.

Lets see if we can slip out quietly before the whole thing falls apart.

Afghan women will now be among, if not absolutely, the most degraded, enslaved, abused human beings on the planet.

Well Ortho, the US has been in charge of Afghanistan since 2001.
If our influence over these 12 years, more or less, has not been "influential",
what else could be said or done that would turn things out differently ?

Is it inevitable that the Taliban will return to it's former power
and rigid enforcement of Sharia Law. I hope and think not.

I would hardly say the US has been 'in charge', and I do think the Taliban will return to power. The faint promise of some education and a safer, less enslaved life will now disappear for these women, but that issue is not on the minds or agendas of the West; we're now occupied with Syria and its implications. The efforts of the Islamic Emirate to achieve its 'just, secure, independent' state and hegemony will, however, include as a given the abasement and abuse of half its adult population. We'll be so glad to be out of Afghanistan that we'll shut our eyes and ears to that situation, and negotiate with these monsters as though they were worthy of respect.

Psst. Nobody mention the status of women in any of our Arabic allies.

I'm picturing Afghanistan as like a kids' game where you get a top spinning as fast as you can and have to run out* of the room before it falls over.

* in the snow, uphill both ways, at band camp, etc etc.

It's an outrage, I agree. Under the Taliban, and in other places where fundamentalist Muslim leaders rule with an iron fist (including Saudi and Yemen) it's beyond outrage.

Kinda off topic, but one of the things I like most about my present job is that not one but two of the students who drop in regularly are young adult female hijab-wearing Muslim refugees from Afghanistan, both studying anthropology and gender studies, and both have spent their first semesters at uni getting their heads around the concept that gender roles are social constructs. As well as my core duty of making sure they understand the assignment instructions (some of them were quite tricky) I was quite happy to make sure they understood this bit of theory.
I noticed recently one of them had a few wisps of hair escaping from under her hijab. It might have been an accident in the late-semester chaos ... but it might not. :D

Set the people free man.

If you can help them internalize that, you'll have had a huge positive impact on their lives. Go Zen.