Re: Re: Toyota Echo
 

My trips are almost never under 20 miles. The warm-up time, based on the dash indicator, seems pretty short though.

Which is better to do: go to a used car lot and purchase a car; or reply to a newspaper ad?

We're in the market for another used car. My husband has a Volkswagen Jetta hatchback (shift) and he likes the roomyness in the car. He'll probably look for something similar. What other cars do you recommend, foreign-wise or otherwise?

I sure did love my Jetta... even more than my GTI Rabbit.

what price range/. payment range ?

what size car?

These days it takes about 5-10 minutes to warm up, but if my trip is 15 minutes, that is 1/3 the drive time. I know I'm not supposed to accelerate hard during this time because the batteries are cold and they don't supply the same kind of power as when they are warm. While warming up, it seems to get about 25mpg. Once the car is up and running, I think its getting 45+, which is what it should be doing.

I've put a little less than 5000 miles on it, and I have noticed my MPG going steadily up these past months, so it might just be the car break in period.

Last tune up was two days ago at the dealer service shop. I really want to do a road trip somewhere just to drive my car around. Maybe I'll go to Atlantic City this weekend and go throw some money away. A nice, long trip is the best way to figure out how well the car is performing.

He's not going to commit himself until he checks the inventory.:haha:

she

Aerion_13 here.

Spoke with hubby. I guess he's looking for something only as big as the VW Jetta, stick shift, hopefully not more than $4,000. He just drives it to work and back.

that's a very difficult car to find

not many 5 speeds left in america, unfortunately.

reccomendations:

another jetta (96-97)

92-94 accord Lx
97-98 nissan sentra
2000-2001 kia sephia ( this is actually a mazda protege), but they dont hold their value for shit, so you can get a good deal on one. and they are actually pretty good cars ($2500-$4600 in NADA)

TO ANSWER YOUR ORIGINAL QUESTION:
a car from a dealer will most likely have gone through inspection at least, and come with some kind of warranty. You MIGHT find a good deal from an individual, but you have a much better chance of getting burnt on the deal because of undisclosed mechanical issues. The best place to look is at a dealer that sells new cars of the same make you like, or online at plces like autotrader.com or it's clones.

let me know what you find, and I'll try to advise you on what you SHOULD pay, and common things you should watch out for.

top 10 cars as rated by consumer reports.

american cars gain ground in reliability ratings:

http://www.consumerreports.org/conte...0404rel002.gif

the article

from the same article:
The last 2 demos i've taken have been the Liberty and the Cruiser. I had a renegade liberty that was just too cool, if the tire pressure monitoring system was a bit annoying. And i am currently driving a black PT cruiser Limited with the platinum pkg, and a turbo motor....a rooom a zooom zooom!

the best and worst used cars.


Jinx and I own a repeat offender :(

link

be patient, it takes a while to load.

As I am not a subscriber to CR I don't get to see the juicy informatin from the survey, but was happy to note that my car was not on that "worst" list at the end of the page.

No, you.;)

oh, me. right. now i get it. ha ha. .......ha

Thanks to a mysterious benefactor, I have now read the entire article and car listings, and find that while my car is not on the best list, it, more importantly, is not on the worst list, either.

My wife's car is a Mercedes 450SL 1974 (that date is correct) She has not been able to drive because of ever increasing physical disabilities for about 10 years now. The car sits in our garage and I drive it a few miles each month to keep batter charged. I'm told this model is the last year it was built-about 6"longer than current SL's. How should I go about selling it. It has only 80,000 actual miles on it and drives perfectly. Original rag top in pristine condition.

bad spelling ID should read Telephonics

go to user cp, find "edit profile" scroll down, it's on the right

To get the most, you'll have to do the dog&pony show of advertising in specialty publications. That means tire kickers that always wanted to drive one of those and guys that didn't have anything to do that afternoon. I suppose with a car like that, you'll get that anyway.
Before you even start, find out what it's worth and decide what you'll accept. Might be worth a trip to Hershey or Carlisle, maybe even Atlantic City.:)

What are your goals? Do you want to sell it simply and easily, or maximize your sale price?

There are a number of ways to go, and depending on what you intend to acheive, I'll have different suggestions.

My aim is to simply sell asap at decent price. But I don't know what a decent price might be. Wife and I are in our 80's and she is very seriously ill. Have cancelled her driving license several years ago. By the way what is of interest at Carlisle and Atlantic City??

TIA

there are open auto auctions in those places.


I can get a number from our high-line wholesaler for you if you want to make this quick and painless. If you're local, he'll want to buy it, if not, he may know someone near you. where are you?

are the 80K miles that you call "actual" reflected accurately on the odometer?

You say it drives perfectly.
Does everything else work, too? ie. is the A/C still cold?
how are the brakes?
what condition are the tires in?
is inspection current?
what color paint/top/interior?
automatic transmission?

telephonics

You may want to check out www.kbb.com , this the Kelly blue book web site , you can generly determin a good asking price there , i don't know if their list go back that far on the web site

I've been hearing a lot of bad stuff about newer Ford SUVs. People I know and reviews like Consumer Reports rate them as having poor reliability, low gas milage, and a high depreciation rate. Anyone else experience the F.O.R.D. (found on road dead) syndrome?

I ask because a neigbor of mine just bought an Excursion one year ago and its been in the shop three times already (not to mention the fact that the damn thing doesn't fit in the garage). Even people I know with Explorers say bad things. What exactly is your $30,000 worth in a Ford SUV?

The main reason the Excursions sell at all is the tax write off.

I used to sell Fords, and they're nice when they're new, but used, they squeak and rattle, and don't hold their value for sh**.

I'm biased, but jinx's 5 year old Grand Cherokee with 69,000 miles on it runs and rides like a new one.

One of my friends just traded in his 300,000 mile (not a typo) Grand Cherokee on a Honda Pilot.

LJ,

i wrote off my Daewoo a few months ago (thread: would you stop?) and have finally organised another car. i understand you might not have the same makes and models over in your part but i was wondering what you thought about older second hand cars.

Car im interested in is a 1994 Mitsubishi Magna. its 4 cylynder and has just completed gear box reconstruction. the price is right but the taco says 183,000 kilometres, (is there big expensive things that need to be done at the 200,000kilometre mark because all cars seemed to be traded in before this figure turns the clock???? ). Unfortunately its an automatic but has power steering and all that.

i travel a lot! the car will be traveling every weekend back to the farm and home again (some 1200 kilometres every fortnight) and also socially round town. do you think im running a risk?

ok, in the US, i believe ( just by looking at it) that the magna is known as a Galante. These are OK cars, but with 113,000 miles on it, the price had better be really right. I don't know how us & aus dollars convert, but over here, that car would be worth around $2000. $500 wholesale. A rebuilt transmission, you say? I'd prefer a manual trans with miles like that, provided it had a fresh clutch, but if the tranny was done recently, and it runs well, i guess it's ok. looks pretty clean. You might want to call a mitsu dealer( service dept) in your area and ask them about the common problems that they have. Ask if they have timing belts or chains, and when they should be replaced...then ask the seller if he has record of it being done. When in doubt, take the car to your mechanic or that mitsu dealer BEFORE you sign or pay for the car.

looks like a nice litle ride, though. I had figured you for the Jeep Wrangler type, though......I can get you a really nice deal......shipping not included

good luck!

I have a question. When you ask a dealer to see their invoice, do they just make up stuff. I'm sure they don't show customers what they actually pay do they?

it's illegal to make a fake invoice. Most dealers are very careful to be legal. If someone is shown the invoice, then that is what the car cost the dealer.

NOW> there MAY be dealer incentives. These are like rebates, but they go directly to the dealer. The dealer CAN pass this along, but does not HAVE to. Chrysler likes to put "stair step" programs out. This means that they set an objective....say 50 jeeps in a month, then they give you $500 per jeep back to the first one if you hit 100% of your goal. $750 for 110%, $1000 for 120%. A smart and brave dealer will write deals as though he has already acheived the first level. the theory being that if they pass on deals that they could have made with the extra cash, then they wont ever reach the level that is needed to earn it anyway.

you can check invoice amounts at edmunds.com or kbb.com. keep in mind that there are advertising fees billed to each car. edmunds mentions them, but cannot quantify them, as they vary from region to region. on a Jeep, there are 2. ppa and daa. national and local advertising groups. one is $220 or something, the other is closer to $450. allow for something like this when you build your car to check the prices.

Dealerships also make a lot of money on other back-end stuff after the sale itself, such as carrying financing themselves or selling a loan they originated.

When you see the invoice, it is legit enough, but it really doesn't tell you very much about the whole deal. Also keep in mind that options added on at the time of purchase are very, very profitable for dealerships.

I'm sure there are other things, but these two come to mind right off. We have a dealership locally here whose whole pitch is "$50 over dealer invoice". I assure you, if they only made $50 per car, they wouldn't have been in business as long as they have.

I remember a few years ago, I went to a dealer in Vegas before "Fletcher Jones" and they hold onto your license while you're doing the test drive and don't want to give it back while they are pressuring you. This is the same place that said, "get Mr. Ireland the invoice please...and the guy who got it seemed like he was going......suuuuure.....I'll get the invoice."

My friend later went to the same dealer and when he asked how much the car was the guy had the nerve to look him in the face and say, "It doesn't matter how much the car is because the payments will be low."

thanks for your advice LJ, you were right in that too much needed to be done to the car from so much mileage.

I opted for a newer (more expensive) car with only 20,000 Kilometres on it.

Have called it 'Chilli Dragon' in memory of my late Daewoo 'Puff the Magic Dragon'

hyundai accent?

no, Hyundai Excel actually. 2001 model.

Look, i know what everyone will say - why did i do it?!

but honestly, its an economical car, i know a guy who had one and travelled round Australia for three years without a problem! and he was towing a camper van!

I know that if i crash thats the end of me, but hey, its a car. and i think its cute.. so leave me alone!!!

:)

And you're a girl. ;)

hyundais are well made. The only real problem ( other than the unavoidable disadvantage it has in an encounter with a Ute) is the way they hold their value. But, having bought a 2001, it has seen the greater percentage of it's depreciation already. Did the long powertrain warranty transfer with ownership? I think they come with a 10yr, 100,000 mile PT since right around 2001 over here in the US. I'm wondering how much of that was an image rescue tack over here, or a company wide move.

Chilli Dragon
 

Yes they do loose their value, the guy i purchased it from brought it for $12,00 in 2001, has barely driven it and i just brought it for $6,200. But if i have it for 5 years, it really doesnt bother me that much. Excels are like assholes around where i live - everybodys got one.

The warranty will transfer with the car. it is a 5 year/ or 150,000 Kilometre warranty. which i thought was pretty good.

:D

It drives much better than the Daewoo did, it has a twin double over head cam on it and it has power steering too.

Coincidence?

This morning as I rode in to work, traffic was stopped. There was a big Mason's truck stopped in the opposite lane. There is a house that has(had) two large concrete and stone pillars at the end of it's driveway. The pillars are 5 ft tall, and 2-3 ft sq. Big.

I thought at first that the masons were removing the pillars, as I could see that one of them had been knocked down into a pile of rubble. When I got closer, though, I saw that someone had run their black hyundai excel ( just like yours) into this pillar. An Indian man was standing there rubbing his head. He was wearing green surgery scrubs. Seemed obvious to me that he had fallen asleep at the wheel after a long night shift. (The road is straight at this point)

the hood was crumpled, but the passenger cabin was intact.

Hopefully you'll never test yours to see if it holds up as well.

oh dear!

i hope everyone was ok, it sounds as though they were. well i suppose with any little car you do have to pay for your choice through a safety comprimise. Excels are just as small as my daewoo, which crumpled like a sheet of paper when i hit a tree coming off the freeway in the rain.

Ill just have to be carfull and drive with the concoious thought that i am in fact in a small fart bubble of a car, which will mean giving way a lot more to larger vehicles than mine. (eg. 4x4's that threaten to run over the top of me!)

heres a photo of the daewoo i smashed last november:

So Jim, how long until we just throw them out?

Last fall, a brand new BMW 3-series car rolled into the Old Dominion Carstar Collision Center in Eugene, Ore. - literally. A teenager was "driving dad's car," says shop owner Patty McConnell, and rolled it over - with little apparent structural damage. The teen walked away, and normally the damage wouldn't have been hard to repair. But the BMW had so many air bags "it looked like a balloon," recalls Ms. McConnell. The new car, worth more than $30,000, was totaled.

Some Cellarite was talking about their insurance company totaling their car because of airbag deployment.

disposable cars.


like a motorcycle helmet. once it;s been cracked or dropped, replace it. the post impacted helmet is weaker than a new one, and unsafe if you should go down again.

the really tricky part of totaling a newer car is that in most cases, people are in negative equity positions until about 4 years into a 5 yr purchase. And with loans going longer and longer as prices rise, the effect is amplified.

If you were to buy a new car, put tax and tags down, and end up financing the invoice amount, you could count on being "upside down" by the time you got home from the dealership.

an example:

you buy a grand cherokee limited for 35000. take the 3500 off for the rebate, and you pay the tax and tags. you're financing 31500. In one year, that jeep is worth about 22-23k. And jeeps are better than most american suv's in holding their value. so, as described in griff's article, the jeep gets totalled.

the insurance company gives you 24K for it, you call for your payoff, and find out that you still owe 28500. you have to pay $4500, and you no longer have a car to get to work in.

don't wreck your car. or let it get stolen

what to do to prevent it?

buy gap insurance. it pays the $4500 in the example above. most policies will cost under $200 for the term of the loan. that usually means about 5 or 6 bucks a month.

mileage
 

We were talking milage on one of these threads and somebody was unhappy with their hybrid Toyotas mileage. NPR did a story last week on the problem. Apparently the epa tests are ideal for hybrids but real mileage will be lower. The program noted that even if the wanted to, which they just might, Toyota cannot advertise the actual mileage because of the way the laws are written.

dulp! this is griff

Ok Jimbo , here's a good one for ya , we have a dodge mini van with 140k+ on it . My wife is in withdrawles about replaceing it but i am trying to think ahead . We don't need all the room of a mini van any more , she wants a convertable , i am thinking a small suv ( maybe a liberty ) . What are your thoughts ??
Oh and we DON'T trade cars every 3-5 years , we buy new and drive them till the wheels fall off .

sorry for the dealy in replying, zip. the liberty is a good choice, but there are so many factors in picking the right car, a lot of times it just comes down to your emotional response. if you are thinking convertible vs suv, maybe the wrangler? it comes in a model called the unlimited now, which is still a 2 door, but it's 15" longer than the standard jeep. i think it looks a bit dorky, and it only comes in automatic, but that top comes down or flips up like a big sunroof. pretty nifty.

A car how-to question....
 

Any advice for runinng a cable into and through a car? Specifically, a 2002 Dodge Grand Caravan. And the cable in question is for a magnetic roof-mount satellite radio antenna. Being a very informal kind of guy (just ask Emily Fucking Post if you don't believe me), I had previously just run the cable in around the front door. The problem is, it's very easy for the cable to get crushed if it ends up between the sliding rear door and the frame. So now I've got a busted cable, making the antenna useless, and another antenna on the way. And I'm wondering if I can do a "real" mount this time and run the cable in through a non-door space.

most vehicles have a wiring harness running somewhere through the car to get to the read electronics. i'll check on wwhere the caravan's is, and get back to you. just a moment.

steve, the antenae connection is behind the glove box. Remove it, and you can splice it in there, and run the cable out the right side, down to the floor and then along the passenger side under the doorsills and then up the C pillar( the frame post behind the door opening) to the roof. the plastic door sills snap out so you can get under them.

I'll check it out, thanks! The satellite radio I have is one of the removable ones, so the cable needs to actually come out rather than stay in the dash (another reason it just seemed easier to come in through the door). But coming in the glove compartment has possibilities.

you mean the antana wire comes out the front of the radio?

This is the idea.

http://www.xmfan.com/viewtopic.php?t=1956

The radio detaches from the dock so you can take it with you to different cars or use it at home.

WHOOK.

you're on yer own with that mess. you might try mounting the unit in your underseat drawer under the passenger, and running the cables under the rug to the radio.....

do you have the powered center console? there's a phone charger jack in there that could be used to power it.

The unit is mounted, for better or worse. (It's on a bracket that attached next to the radio.) I just need to replace the antenna and, hopefully, run the cable somewhere where it's less likely to be crushed than around the door. (The front door is OK with the rubber seals, the problem was when it got slack and ended up between the frame & the sliding door.)

well, then i think that going along the floor under the plastic doorsills and up that C pillar is the way to go.

DUCT TAPE. :D

Well come on Bruce, how did you think I had the power & audio output cables reined in?? ;)

Hey I forgot to ask LJ, what does satellite radio look like from the dealer standpoint? I know Chrysler is supposed to be offering Sirius radios as factory-installed options on some models--and I think most of the major auto mfrs have deals with either Sirius or XM. Is it a selling point? Do people care one way or another? Are you actually selling cars with the satellite radios in them or is it just a corporate thing that never managed to filter down to the consumer?