I think it all depends on the person. I got my first tattoo when I was 16, and I never regret it. I got my second (the last one so far) when I was 17, and again, I never regret it. I had wanted them for a while however so I already knew that I would be happy with them for the rest of my life. I want more tattoos but for the time being they are too expensive. I have more important things to spend my money on (like college tuition).

There is a minimum age for a reason. There are very few people under the age of 18 that will be able to decide on something they can live with for the rest of their days. I happened to be one of them, at least in that aspect of my life. My tattoos help me remember things I do not want to forget and remind me of what my life use to be like. I have an iguana on my stomach surrounding my belly button (which is also pierced by the way) and a dragon on my lower back. No one except those that know me well will understand the significance of my tattoos, nor should they. But that doesn't make them any less important to me. I am 22.

On the subject of the 12 year old who gives blow jobs in the bathroom, I think there must be much that isn't known about her. I find it very difficult to fathom that she has not been abused in some way in order for her to choose those actions for herself. As was said before, children are very secretive about what happens when they are abused. The girl would not just volunteer that kind of information out to anyone who wanted to know.

I hope they continue to be positive and important reminders for you... but it'll be a lot more significant if you still don't regret them when you're 40.

16 or 17 ought to have steadfast parental approval as to what and where the tattoo is, beyond that (18 +) I think the parents should strongly advise but not have the last word. Meaning going with them, persuading the kid not to get a flying dragon with pink unicorns on his/her chest, making sure they use disposable needles and get a fresh one, the joint isn't in a seedy part of town, etc.
Learning to live with your decisions (big mistakes included) is an essential part of entering adulthood in my book.

The best tattoo I ever saw was a pair of Achilles heels in the Madrid metro .

Stop pondering , and try to see .

There was an arrow in them or what? How did you know they were Achilles heels?

the more recent of my two tattoos is 9 years old now. no regrets ever. i will most likely add to them, but I only trust one person to put ink in my skin and i don't see him but once every 3/4 years.

if you are getting a tattoo because it is cool or all your friends have them... you're screwed. if you want one because you want one and you know what you want before you get to the shop, you'll probably be just fine. if not, you can always have it redone/altered.

I got my first tattoo on my 18th birthday. I've always been a straight-A student, gotten along with my parents, and have never been in any real kind of trouble. I gave the design/idea for it months of thought, I told my parents I was getting it done, did not try to hide it from anyone. I do not regret it at all.

Tattoos are just another form of expression, much like art or music. If you don't like rap, you don't listen to it. If you don't like tattoos, don't get one. It's as simple as that.

I do believe that there is a too young age. Aside from the fact that the child will have to live with it for the rest of his/her life, have you considered the pain factor? A 15 year old going through the pain of a tattoo? Umm, no please. Thanks.

As an aside.....The difference between people that have tattoos and people that don't? The people that do, don't care that the people that don't, don't. ;)

I always screw that up when I try and say it Bruce.

wait on the tattoo
 

Where I live, blood donations are not accepted from folks with tattoos.

Why not wait a few years, and help save a few lives donating blood first, then if the kid still can't stand being a good person, get all the tattoos the kid wants.

A disease free blood supply is more important than indelible body art, at least to me. Maybe if people with tattoos could not get transfusions, since they can't give them either. That would be a good trade off.

Where is that?Whoa, there. Tattoos make someone a bad person?
So you want to deny medical care to people with tattoos?

I'm not disputing the not being able to give blood where you live, because I don't know where that is. I would, however, suggest you move to somewhere, anywhere, the medical community has moved up to at least the 20th century and preferably the 21st, before you need their services. :bandaid:

First of all, I can't donate blood because I have pernicious anemia. So what does it matter if I get a tattoo? And second of all, we only have a 12 month limit on the no donating policy. What is one year of not donating? Many people who can donate don't anyway, so why single out the people that want tattoos? Are you going to say that the people that can't donate shouldn't be allowed transfusions as well? Because I am in both catagories (have a tattoo and can't donate for medical reasons). I think you should re-evaluate what you are saying. It sure sounds pretty closed-minded to me, but that is just my opinion. You don't know the circumstances behind every person's tattoos and reasons why they don't or can't donate.

Oh, and most tattoos do not cause diseases. It is only when you don't check out the place first that you can have problems. If they dispose of everything they use (including leftover ink, not just the needles) then there should not be any problem.

And I agree with Bruce, how does having a tattoo make you a bad person? Inquiring minds want to know.

He is three now, been hard to keep around... may be getting a tracking # tattooed on his instep and I'm looking into a GPS anklet.

unless they've changed, the Red Cross requires 2 years from the date of your last tattoo before they'll accept your donation. then again, i believe they require one year from the date you pierced your ears. what kind of an evil selfish person would pierce their ears thereby denying dying children the blood they need to make it one more day?:rolleyes:

I can see why they have people wait, they just can't afford to give everyone who donates a blood test.

One of the guys in my dorm block last year spent the better part of 4 months picking out his tattoo design, though not for any sentimental reason. Since he's an engineer he knew he'd have to keep it small, black and white, and on a part of his body he could keep covered easily.

The Red Cross tests every single donation. They can't afford not to test everyone who donates.

The Red Cross won't take my blood, because I spent too much time in Western Europe. Could have mad cow disease, you know.

Let me guess: Pepe Le Pew?

From what I understand, that is why they make you wait. Some diseases (i.e. HIV or Hepititis) may not show up on their tests if you just recently contracted the disease. So if they make you wait they ensure that they will know whether or not you have any diseases.

Tatoos... Acceptable age?

I'm an old foogie.

Both my daughters wanted tatoos while in High School. Dear old Dad said "No Way!"

Of course I went into a long, drawn-out, repertoire of rhetoric that would have made a classic American Hero scream "uncle." And, my daughters, who learned the art of verbal self-defense at an early age firmly informed me they were going to "get a tatoo" whether I liked it or not. I laughed and told them they can become a "tatoo canvas" AFTER they graduate High School. Until then... pffft...

Both my daughters waited until they were in college to get their tatoos.

Should have seen their mouths drop when I told them I was thinking about getting one. :eek:

I'd say 18 is the magic age. You grow out of most of the tastes you had in high school, but tattoos can't be grown out of -- at least not without significant expense and pain.

Tattoos weren't cool for kids when I was in high school, but if they had been, there would be a lot of 30-somethings running around with the faces of the guys from Poison inked into their backs.

As a mother of 4, (19yr, 17yo, 16yo and 11yo) I have to say we have had this discussion a few times in our house. However I have told each of them the same thing. Tattoos are permanent, they fade, the skin may stretch over the years (depending on where the tat is. I suggested they wait until after they are done college, before they decide they *have to have one* No tattoos until after they are adults (one is, and she is not interested)

That being said, I have allowed ear piercing (2 holes, and one cartalige limit) and hair styles/dyes. The piercings you can take out and most likely they will grow over. No body piercings again, until they are over 18. As an esthetican, I have tried to show they the bad facial piercings I have seen. I show they what something cool may look like in 20 years. They have all said, ewww. The only facial piercing I would not gripe about (after they are of age) is a nose peircing. These can be quite nice.

They can grow or cut thier hair, dye it purple with pink stripes if they want. This gives them some creative espression/control and be *cool* with no after effects. (other than the goofy pictures mom can use as embarassment later!) I make them tell me what they are planning, and go with them to have it done. I figure 3 months of neon hair is much better than an impulsive body peirce or tattoo.

I had the colored hair along with the tattoo, and I loved it. I naturally stopped dying green and purple (among other colors) when I decided I wanted a job. It is difficult to find a job with green hair. My father actually was somewhat against me getting a job, mostly because he thought my grades would fail. I was always an honor student so that would have been bad. So the first semester I worked and went to school I got straight A's just to prove to him that I could do anything I set my mind to. I had never gotten straight A's before as there was usually one B (sometimes two) on there, but I still was on the honor roll.

Oh, and you can't very well tell a child that they can't get a tattoo until they are 19 or later because it is legal if they are 18. If they still live at home I guess you could threaten to kick them out, but most of the people I knew moved away from home as soon as they hit the 18th birthday so there isn't really anything you can do about it. And sometimes if you stifle them too much at a young age they will go completely crazy as soon as they are out of your sight. Moderation is the key! But that is just my humble opinion. :o

So not getting a tattoo. I'd regret any that I got within hours.

/fickle

We clearly have differing definitions of the word "nice."

I always think of the line from the movie, Fame, "Does that hurt, or is that ethinic?"

Of course, nose piercings were pretty much unheard of in 1980.

I have seen many, including my 79 year old client, with tiny barely noticable nose peircings. The tiny gem hit the light about an hour after I got there... or I would not have noticed it at all. I don't like those huge nose rings and things.. I meant a tiny stud.

Tattoo You
 

Below is a pretty lame article by David Brooks from this week's NYT. He writes as if this popular culture trend is somehow more significant than those from the past.

At some point some guy wore a Derby hat; soon everyone was wearing them. Whatever.:neutral:

Nonconformity Is Skin Deep
Published: August 27, 2006
We now have to work under the assumption that every American has a tattoo. Whether we are at a formal dinner, at a professional luncheon, at a sales conference or arguing before the Supreme Court, we have to assume that everyone in the room is fully tatted up — that under each suit, dress or blouse, there is at least a set of angel wings, a barbed wire armband, a Chinese character or maybe even a fully inked body suit. We have to assume that any casual antitattoo remark will cause offense, even to those we least suspect of self-marking.

Everybody who has been to the beach this summer has observed that tattoos are now everywhere. There are so many spider webs, dolphins, Celtic motifs and yin-yang images spread across the sands, it looks like a New Age symbology conference with love handles.

A study in The Journal of the American Academy of Dermatology showed that about 24 percent of Americans between the ages of 18 and 50 have at least one tattoo, up from about 15 percent in 2003. Thirty-six percent of those between 18 and 29 have a tattoo. Pretty soon you’ll go to the beach and find that only the most hardened nonconformists will be unmarked. Everybody else will be decorated with gothic-lettered AARP logos and Katie Couric 4-EVER tributes, and Democrats will have their Kerry-Edwards bumper stickers scratched across their backs so even their morticians will know which way they voted.

The only person without one of those Pacific Northwest Indian tribal graphics scrawled across his shoulder will be a lone 13-year-old skater scoffing at all the bourgeois tattoo fogies.

Traditional religions have generally prohibited tattoos on the grounds they encourage superficial thinking (what’s on the surface is not what matters). But it turns out that tattoos are the perfect consumer items. They make people feel better about themselves. Just as Hummers make some people feel powerful, tattoo-wearers will talk (and talk and talk and talk) about how their tattoos make them feel strong, free, wild and unique.

In a forthcoming essay in The American Interest, David Kirby observes that there are essentially two types of tattoo narratives, the Record Book and the Canvas. Record Book tattoos commemorate the rites of passage in a life. Canvas tattoos are means of artistic expression.

So some people will have their kids’ faces tattooed across their backs, or the motorcycle that belonged to a now-dead friend, or a fraternity, brigade or company logo. In a world of pixelated flux, these tattoos are expressions of commitment — a way to say that as long as I live, this thing will matter to me. They don’t always work out — on the reality show “Miami Ink” a woman tried to have her “I will succeed thru Him” tattoo altered after she grew sick of religion — but the longing for permanence is admirable.

Other people are trying to unveil their wild side. They’re taking advantage of the fact that tattoos are associated with felons, bikers and gangstas. They’re trying to show that far from being the dull communications majors they appear to be, they are actually free spirits — sensual, independent, a little dangerous.

The problem is that middle-class types have been appropriating the symbols of marginalized outcasts since at least the 1830’s. This is no longer a way to express individuality; it’s a way to be part of the mob. Today, fashion trends may originate on Death Row, but it takes about a week and a half for baggy jeans, slut styles and tattoos to migrate from Death Row to Wal-Mart.

What you get is a culture of trompe l’oeil degeneracy. People adopt socially acceptable transgressions — like tattoos — to show they are edgy, but inside they are still middle class. You run into these candy-cane grunge types: people with piercings and inkings all over their bodies who look like Sid Vicious but talk like Barry Manilow. They’ve got the alienated look — just not the anger.

And that’s the most delightful thing about the whole tattoo fad. A cadre of fashion-forward types thought they were doing something to separate themselves from the vanilla middle classes but are now discovering that the signs etched into their skins are absolutely mainstream. They are at the beach looking across the acres of similar markings and learning there is nothing more conformist than displays of individuality, nothing more risk-free than rebellion, nothing more conservative than youth culture.

Another generation of hipsters, laid low by the ironies of consumerism.

Cartoon from the late '60s (when I was a lad) --

"Why do you have long hair?" (addressed to a guy)

"Because I want proclaim my individuality. I want to be unique."

"Shouldn't you have short hair, then?"

The 40-something librarian at the local public library has one on her shoulder. I'm guessing they're on the way out.

I heard a news story teased while I was waking up a day or two ago about students complaining about the school dress code (presumably in Philadlephia) which bans items such as ripped jeans and facial piercings. The girl I heard interviewed was complaining on behalf of her friend who had gotten an eyebrow piercing over the summer, "It was like $70 and they're making her take it out."

I similarly hope that the young lady (giving her the benefit of the doubt) who was interviewed can have her "like" excised before the end of the school year.

Do we really?

I mean, even if every single American did have a tattoo, how many situations are there where you actually would have to work under that assumption, rather than just not caring?

Quote:

And that’s the most delightful thing about the whole tattoo fad. A cadre of fashion-forward types thought they were doing something to separate themselves from the vanilla middle classes but are now discovering that the signs etched into their skins are absolutely mainstream.

Ha, ha! Let's laugh at all those people who got tattoos before they were mainstream! Because now other people are doing it, too! Take that, wierdos.

Weirdos? Everyone with a tattoo is a weirdo?
The article made it sound like people without are the weirdos.
Take that, you blank canvas, unfulfilled possibility, you. :p

Thanks...I had to look it up too. However, I dont think it's sad. I think it's sad that proper writing has gone to shit, whatever happened to using words that already exist instead of making up crappy words..?:)

I believe people should be waiting until 18yo before getting tatts or piercings, although piercings can be removed any time. By the time I was 16 I had a total of 5 piercings in each ear (now only have 2) and I had my first body piercing at age 16 (it is legal here at that age) but didn't have the sense to research first so ended up getting a dodgy naval piercing by a dodgy tattooist that shouldn't have been piercing at all! Years later I was forced to take it out, due to the poor way it was done, and decided to have it re-done properly. I got a tattoo at age 21 after getting my mum to do the design so that it would be personalised to me and still waited 2 years before having it done.
Years later I had my tongue pierced on a whim and have not regretted it and then thought for a good 7months before having a vaginal piercing.

My partner has multiple tattoos (back, shoulder and legs) and piercings (7 around his face as well as both nipples and penis). One tattoo was done to cover up a bad home job from when he was a teenager and he doesn't regret any that he has now (15 years after the first) he wants at least one more tattoo and another piercing at age 30.

On the other hand my brother had had his tiongue pierced twice by the time he was 14 years old and got his first tattoo with mum's permission at age 16. He is still not 17 and has a large tattoo of the grim reaper on his shoulder blade as well as a few other body piercings. I do think that he'll regret the grim reaper tattoo when he's older as it isn't something that represents him or his life (his first is chinese writing - love, honesty) and knowing my brother as well as I do I know he'll wish he never had that one done.

By no means are we bad people or 'horrible' looking. Only shallow minded people judge on first looks. :finger:

That time never existed. New words have been coined from the very beginning. It's what makes the language dynamic and why Oxford and the rest add new words to the dictionary on a regular basis.

I was always too scared to get a vaginal piercing. I would think that would really hurt! Besides, I didn't like the idea of some strange person looking at my bits (other than my gynocologist). Do you like it? What part did you get pierced? I was just curious... I have been more fond of tattoos than piercings because I am allergic to all metal besides pure gold, which makes it expensive to get replacement jewelry. (the gold belly button ring I have now was $65, and that was the cheapest one!)

I had a bad experience before with piercings as well. I didn't think it would matter much when I got my belly button pierced and I didn't get pure gold. It remained unhealed and infected for a year and a half before I finally broke down and bought a gold ring. Since then I haven't had any problems. But now I know! Gold is the way to go!

I had clitoral hood done, it was just like getting belly done in way of pain and healing. It's a bit weird having to wash your vagina 2-3times daily tho. Hardest part was giving up sex for 2 weeks, I didn't really manage that one too well. If you have it done, go to someone who specialises in ONLY piercings, not tattoo's or cosmetics, they know exactly what they're doing and don't care what you look like naked cos that's what they see all day!
Believe me, I was scared shitless too but the lady who did it soon put me at ease.

I also am allergic to metal (mostly nickel) and have found I can use stainless/surgical steel and sterling silver. Have you tried those for your belly ring?

Depends on if that first look is all they have time for, I'm sure you take out the piercings and cover the tattoos for interviews. Even so, you can tell alot about a person by their physical appearence, not everything, but enough just the same to make a judgement call if you have to. We get all types through the doors at the local ER (I work there in the summer) and 9/10 first impressions are bang on.

I don't get why people think tats are a form of expression that sets them apart. Everybody and their dog is getting one...often some chinese characters incorrectly interpreted. They are "just like everyone else." Get a damn bumper sticker...tacky still but you can peel them off.

Everyone has some form of hairstyle - even people who just let it grow and hoick it behind their ears are saying something about themselves.

I love my tattoo - it's part of me. I didn't get it to be dangerous or "out there" (just as well seeing as so many people have them now!) It says as much about me as my watch, my shoes, my hairstyle except that it's less visible and far more personal. I'm glad it's permanent - I got it in full knowledge that this was the case.

You made a good point, Sundae Girl. Thank you for your response. It seems the only way to get a response at the Cellar is to rile someone or totally kiss their ass...you show your class by responding but not biting.

When I think of it in form of hairstyle I see what you mean, except that most people have, or have had, hair! :) At any rate, how we choose to express ourselves often means more than the expression itself.

Born with a tattoo
 

I have a birth mark on my neck and on my left arm. To this day, grown men and women I don't even know get this really concerned look on their face, come right up to me and ask "What's wrong with your neck?" or "What happened to you?" It's happened so much in the past that I just take it in stride, but it strikes me as kinda rude. I mean, if I see some guy with one leg in a wheelchair I don't say "What happened to you?" Though that might lead to a good story.:neutral:

I think my birthmark is a part of me more than any tattoo could ever be.

My son has lots of Thomas temp tats... looks awesome on him.

I've got this big 'ol birthmark that goes from my neck, down to my shoulder then splits, continuing down my arm to my elbow (which is completely covered by it) and also down my chest. It's slowly fading, though, and I think before long it'll be invisible.

Yeah, usually you put your whole body in a wheelchair, not just one leg!

OMG, can't stop laughing - all I can picture is some poor guy hobbling down the street with one leg shoved into a wheelchair, trying not to fall over, while hopping along on the other leg!! LOL :lol: :lol:

Funny you should say that - I have a condition known as ptosis which means my left eyelid droops slightly. It wasn't handled particularly well by my Mother when I was younger, to the extent I saw it as a deformity and my throat closed up every time eyes, eyelids etc were mentioned. The first boy I dated told me I had beautiful eyes and I ran off in tears and was completely unable to explain myself.

It took til I was in my 30's to accept it and accept I'm normal. I can now answer intrusive questions, "Oh! What's wrong with your eye?!" quite calmly. "It's called ptosis, I was born with it" and sometimes, if I'm feeling vicious, "I prefer not to talk about it, thanks"

Anyway - the turning point for me was when I was considering surgery, believing it would change my life because I would finally be normal. The boyfriend of a beautiful friend of mine sat up all night with me talking, gently explaining to me that my slightly flawed face made me more interesting to interesting people. He also said that it had formed my character and I should therefore wear it as a badge of honour (and lots more compliments like that). It broke the dam - we went for a long walk as the sun came up and I cried my eyes out sitting on the park swings.

I wouldn't change it now.

And Shawnee123 - you're welcome :)

The Eyes Have It
 

To be honest, I have to say that a woman that has a slight imperfection of one of her eyes is really, really sexy. Have you ever seen Karen Black? Her eyes are just a slight bit "off." Damn that's alluring. You made the right decision, Sundae.:rolleyes:

I don't think I've come across her before. Oh - just looked her up and we have the same birthday!

The bottom line is you need to learn to love yourself. Bleurgh, but it's a cliche because it's true.

I rarely post full face pictures of myself though. I haven't learned to love my extra chin yet :)

"There is no exquisite beauty," says Bacon, Lord Verulam, speaking truly of all the forms and genera of beauty, "without some strangeness in the proportion."

Edgar Allen Poe, Ligeia

It's true, too...who wants to be the cookie-cutter beauty?

You rock, Sundae Girl!

Whats the age for an eyebrow peircing and a tattoo?
 

I was wonderin' about the ages cuz I really want my eyebrow peirced and the tattoo I want to get for the Memory of my dad.

Holla At'cha Bwoi!!

Whts the age for getting tattoos? And piercings?

Holla At'cha Bwoi!!!

"Kids" and tattoos, indeed...

Like Forrest Whitaker?

Good for you!

Yes. At least in appearance, I don't know if it is exactly the same condition. Also like Thom Yorke of Radiohead.

I have a pinky finger with no nail. Missing when I was born, Dr says the finger was probably caught in a placental mass and didn't develop properly. However, being interested in horses, breeding and genetics...it was enough to keep me from having children.
I didn't understand that it wasn't a genetic thing when I was younger, and I had already made the have-no-children decision and I couldn't get past my younger mind-set when I matured.

I want to get a tattoo for my b-day this year. I have the design picked out, it is small, but I am at odds as to where to place it. I'd like to put it at the back of my neck under my hairline...
...but I am such a wuss...
My mother is very negative about tattoos...and I don't know if I'm getting the tattoo to piss her off (place it in a very visual area) or getting it for me (place it in a personal area) or even if I'd be placing it in a personal area to prevent her from seeing it.
Why, oh why, at this age...is my mother still controlling my life?
Maybe THAT is why I'm getting this tattoo. I decided. Not her.

Sorry to hear about your fingernail - I really hope it didn't cause you too many self-esteem issues growing up.

And pleased to hear you have decided to come out from under your Mum's judgement. From your photos and posts you're beautiful and individual - you know what you choose will be right for you. Go for it.


An update on my original post. Over the last few months I have become much closer to the 15 year old co-worker I described. I still feel she (and her mother) were unwise re the tattoo issue, but I have come to see her as a person and not an age now.

Her father left them last year for another relationship, and times were hard at home due to a clever accountant "proving" this successful businessman could only pay £100 a month for child support for 4 children. She argued quite significantly with her father at Christmas last year and we had quite a few conversation where I gently tried to persuade her that even if she does hate her father now, he's still her father and always will be, and things will hopefully change as she matures.

He died unexpectedly 2 weeks ago following a routine operation.

She was back at work last Saturday, hurt, brave, aware, guilty and generally all-round making me want to cry for her. Which I would never do in front of someone coming to terms with the pain in her own life.

Sod getting tattoos underage. I'm glad I admired it when she showed me, so that she feels she has an adult outside her family she can talk to now.

Life, eh?

Great googley moogley. That poor girl was given a hard row to hoe. I am glad she feels she has an adult that is willing to accept her for who she is, on her terms, and not stuffed into a "proper box" of how a teenager should be. It is a hard age.

My finger doesn't bother me much and I didn't have much trouble with it growing up. When I was made aware of how 'differet' it was, it was easy to keep my fingers curled under and hidden. I didn't have to reveal it unless I wanted to. It really isn't that noticeable at a quick glance and I don't wear nailpolish so it doesn't stand out.

My beautiful (reminds me of Mariah Carey) best friend lost her right eye to cancer when she was 14. They had to remove part of the orbital socket and her eyelid so she must wear a prosthetic patch that goes into the eye socket and covers the eyelid area from eyebrow to cheekbone. She is a hoot to drive with...no depth perception and my right leg gets a phantom brake workout when I ride shotgun with her. :D

My fave story of hers...
She was 8.5 months pregnant and we entered a jewelry store to have our rings cleaned and checked and the handsome clerk asked about her eye...Kim told him she got in a fight with her boyfriend and he stabbed her in the face. He looked shocked and horrified as he looked between her missing eye and swollen belly and asked "What is going to happen now?" and Kim told him with a big smile and a cheerful voice that they had made up and were getting married!
Oh, we laughed so hard when we left the store....
*sigh* I miss her. I need to give her a call, or fly back to CA for a visit. She rejuvenates me, she is so full of life.
hh